One Year On: Malice @ The Palace

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One Year On: Malice @ The Palace

Postby Matt on Sat Nov 19, 2005 4:05 pm

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2005/basketball/nba/11/18/brawl.anniversary.ap/index.html

AUBURN HILLS, Mich. (AP) -- Millions of dollars were lost, reputations were tainted and the NBA was shaken on Nov. 19, 2004, when the Indiana Pacers, Detroit Pistons and fans were involved in perhaps the worst brawl in U.S. sports history.

A year later, the ugly series of events and the aftermath are being rehashed and dissected.

NBA commissioner David Stern hopes lessons were learned.

"No. 1, players can't go into the stands. They need to leave that to security and not get into vigilantism," Stern said in an interview this week with The Associated Press. "No. 2, fans have to be held accountable because they can't do anything they want just by virtue of buying a ticket. No. 3, we need to continue to review and update our procedures on security and crowd control."

Several players and fans lost control during a five-minute stretch on an unforgettable night at The Palace in suburban Detroit. Pistons chief executive Tom Wilson aptly described it as the perfect storm.

It all started when Indiana's Ron Artest fouled Detroit's Ben Wallace with 45.9 seconds left in a game that was essentially over, with the Pacers leading by 15. Wallace responded with a two-handed shove to Artest's chin, leading to several players pushing and Artest lying on the scorer's table.

Just when the confrontation appeared to be over, a fan hit Artest with a cup filled with an icy beverage and the volatile player bolted into the stands in a rage, followed by fist-swinging teammate Stephen Jackson.

Artest and teammate Jermaine O'Neal later slugged fans on the court, and when the Pacers finally were able to get off the court, they were pelted with beer, popcorn and other debris.

The startling scene included the scary -- a fan hurling a chair -- and the surreal -- Indiana's Jamaal Tinsley wielding a dust pan over his head -- as TV cameras captured the chaos.

Stern's response was swift and strong.

Two days later, Artest was suspended for the rest of the season -- 73 games, plus the playoffs -- in a move that cost him almost $5 million.

"I think any person on the street would have done the same thing," Artest said last month. "I just learned that if somebody from the stands throws something at you, don't do anything back or you'll get suspended."

Overall, nine players were suspended. They lost nearly $10 million in salary.

Wallace was suspended for six games, and one of his brothers was among eight fans charged with playing a part in the melee.

"It's hard to say, 'I wouldn't do this again,' or 'I wouldn't do that,' because in a similar situation, you don't know how you'll react," Wallace said. "It was a unique situation with so many things that happened so fast."

The NBA wasn't the only entity to dish out punishment.

Artest, Jackson, O'Neal and teammates Anthony Johnson and David Harrison were sentenced to a year of probation after pleading no contest to misdemeanor assault charges. They also were ordered to perform community service and pay fines.

For some of the players, the legal battle is not over yet. A spectator who was punched on the court, Charlie Haddad, is suing O'Neal, Johnson and the Pacers. Haddad's attorney, Larry Charfoos, said depositions from the players are expected in December or January and the case could go to court in August 2006.

"Charlie got decked by O'Neal with the punch seen around the world, and he's still disabled and under medical attention," Charfoos said. "Charlie pleaded no contest to being on the court and his sentence of two years probation was worse than the players who punched him, which I still don't understand."

Criminal cases are pending for John Green, the fan accused of lobbing the cup that ignited the fracas, as well as spectators William Paulson and John Ackerman. David Wallace, one of Ben Wallace's brothers, was sentenced to a year of probation and community service for punching Pacers in the stands.

"I just got caught up in the heat of the moment," David Wallace said in a telephone interview from Selma, Ala. "When you don't have time to think about something, there's not always a thought process involved."

When Detroit hosted the Boston Celtics on Tuesday, Phil Creglow, a 24-year-old fan from Lansing, was sitting close to the spot from where the cup was tossed.

"When you buy a ticket, I think you have the right to heckle these millionaires, but you cross the line when you start throwing stuff," Creglow said.

In the wake of the brawl, Wilson said the NBA mandated teams add one uniformed police officer near the court, putting three of them between players and fans.

"We learned that the impossible is possible, so we have to be prepared for the worst," Wilson said.

The brawl transcended sports, landing on front pages, leading newscasts and even inspiring an episode of NBC's fictional Law & Order.

"Both the league and the players got a quick and dramatic wake-up call about their perception in the public," said Richard Lapchick, director of the Institute for Diversity and Ethics in Sport at Central Florida. "When the NBA took corrective actions, like the dress code, it showed how serious they took the threat to their business."

Stern acknowledged the dress code he instituted before this season was "a small thing" the league is doing to improve its image because of the brawl. The new policy requires players wear business casual attire whenever they participate in team or league activities.

"We need to have our players look more professional to show more respect for the game and consumers," Stern said. "That's just part of what we're trying to do to let the public know that our players are good people."

Ben Wallace said earlier this week he didn't know the one-year anniversary of the brawl would be Saturday, but the reminder didn't annoy him.

"We know it's not going to disappear, because people will probably bring it up and talk about it for a long time," he said. "I wish the whole thing didn't happen for the sake of the fans, the league and the players. But it did, so we all have to live with the effects of it."


it wasn't even that bad.
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Postby Matthew on Sat Nov 19, 2005 8:57 pm

What do you mean it wasnt that bad? Did you even see it? I doubt you did becuase everything that was quoted happened.

But stern contradicts himself by saying: "No. 2, fans have to be held accountable because they can't do anything they want just by virtue of buying a ticket."

What did the league do to hold the fans responsable exactly? Fans claim they are part of the organisation, yet nothing happened to the pistons.
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Postby Matt on Sun Nov 20, 2005 12:51 am

What do you mean it wasnt that bad? Did you even see it? I doubt you did becuase everything that was quoted happened


in the grand sceem of sporting brawls this was small. I remember about 2yrs ago soccer fans started fighting with their own players after they lost, in South America.

Those Laker championship riots were worse too.

and you could argue the players got off lightly too......

"Charlie got decked by O'Neal with the punch seen around the world, and he's still disabled and under medical attention," Charfoos said. "Charlie pleaded no contest to being on the court and his sentence of two years probation was worse than the players who punched him, which I still don't understand."


seriosuly, Ron Artest is lucky to be playing basketball. His suspension was light.
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Postby J@3 on Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:02 am

"Charlie got decked by O'Neal with the punch seen around the world, and he's still disabled and under medical attention,"


Wow :shock:
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Postby Fenix on Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:14 am

If I was a 270 pound seven footer and little Charlie ran onto the court to get a piece of my ass, I would've squash that little ant. I mean, how do they dare to bitch about how they got their ass kicked? Aren't they the ones who ran onto the court? Like Matthew said, the fans are should be blamed as much as the players, if not more.
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Postby . on Sun Nov 20, 2005 2:38 am

"Charlie" deserved to get slapped the hell out of him.
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Postby Rip32 on Sun Nov 20, 2005 3:21 am

Jae wrote:
"Charlie got decked by O'Neal with the punch seen around the world, and he's still disabled and under medical attention,"


Wow :shock:


Thats a bull shit lie, "Charlie" was on the Detroit Sports Report a few nights ago, as fine as anyone can be a year after they got punched. :roll:
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Postby Matthew on Sun Nov 20, 2005 7:04 am

Matt wrote:
What do you mean it wasnt that bad? Did you even see it? I doubt you did becuase everything that was quoted happened


in the grand sceem of sporting brawls this was small. I remember about 2yrs ago soccer fans started fighting with their own players after they lost, in South America.

Those Laker championship riots were worse too.

and you could argue the players got off lightly too......

"Charlie got decked by O'Neal with the punch seen around the world, and he's still disabled and under medical attention," Charfoos said. "Charlie pleaded no contest to being on the court and his sentence of two years probation was worse than the players who punched him, which I still don't understand."


seriosuly, Ron Artest is lucky to be playing basketball. His suspension was light.

Seriously, the Pistons were lucky that all their home games werent cancelled. I still have my doubts that you even watched the entire brawl.

The comparison to a south american soccer match is stupid. You said it wasnt even that bad in reference to the article which didnt compare it to a soccer match. and also, what happened with a uefa soccer match last year when the fans threw objects at an opposing player? the next 2 or 3 games at that home stadium were banned for all spectators. I usually criticise soccer authorities but on that occasion they got it 100% right.
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Postby cyanide on Sun Nov 20, 2005 8:43 am

Rip32 wrote:
Jae wrote:
"Charlie got decked by O'Neal with the punch seen around the world, and he's still disabled and under medical attention,"


Wow :shock:


Thats a bull shit lie, "Charlie" was on the Detroit Sports Report a few nights ago, as fine as anyone can be a year after they got punched. :roll:


It could've been blown out of proportion. Maybe "Charlie" gets the occasional minor dizzyness that's considered a "disability" and "medical attention" might mean visiting the doctor periodically.
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Postby Andrew on Sun Nov 20, 2005 12:21 pm

Perhaps there have been uglier incidents in other sports, but in terms of what's happened in the NBA it was one of the most disgraceful displays, at least in recent memory. I'm sure there are people that found it "funny" and "exciting", but I just though it was disgraceful.

But stern contradicts himself by saying: "No. 2, fans have to be held accountable because they can't do anything they want just by virtue of buying a ticket."

What did the league do to hold the fans responsable exactly? Fans claim they are part of the organisation, yet nothing happened to the pistons.


Agreed, I found that statement quite interesting as well. I suppose the NBA's in better position to punish players than fans, but the punishment sure seemed very one-sided. True, the fans who can be singled out as the worst offenders are facing reprimand, but there were a whole lot of people who might not have stood out but were acting in a very boorish manner, the ones pelting the players as they left the court and whatnot. The Pacers' players may have deserved punishment for their actions, but the Pistons' organisation was basically given a slap on the wrist and told to increase security.

All in all, it was an ugly incident, one the league can do without. You don't need that kind of publicity and "excitement".
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Postby hipn on Sun Nov 20, 2005 12:54 pm

The whole brawl started because a stupid fan decided that it would be funny or fun to throw a cup of beer at a player who didn't want to get into any trouble (Artest). I mean Artest was laying by the commentators or w/e and the only reason he went up into the stands was because some stupid fan threw a cup of beer at him. If that fan didn;t do that, the whole thing wouldn't of started.
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Postby Andrew on Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:03 pm

Beyond that, one can could suggest it wouldn't have happened if Ben Wallace hadn't reacted in such an unsportsmanlike way when Artest committed a foul that didn't look to be as hard as it was made out to be.
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Postby hipn on Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:10 pm

Well after Ben Wallace shoved Artest, it was basically over, until tht fan did what he did.
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Postby Andrew on Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:20 pm

True, though Wallace did throw a towel at Artest after they had been seperated and he had backed off. But there wouldn't have been any incident had Wallace not shoved Artest.
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Postby hipn on Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:30 pm

Tru you have a point, but you gotta understand, after both players backed off, it was done. It stopped, I mean c'mon anybody would get pissed if someone threw a up of beer at you, I mean if you was walking down a street and threw a cup of beer at you, wouldn't you be pissed nad want a peice of the person who threw the beer at you? I mean if it was a woman that threw it, fine its ok, no need to get physical, but if a guy did that to me, f*** him and Im going to kill him.
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Postby Andrew on Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:36 pm

Absolutely, Artest rushing into the stands was provoked and that exchange quickly escalated into the ugly scenes that followed. But there's very little chance what happened with Artest would have happened had the previous altercation never happened.
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Postby hipn on Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:39 pm

I agree, but the thigns happening on the court should be kept on the court and not go into the stands.
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Postby Andrew on Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:43 pm

Indeed. Like I said, it was an ugly, disgraceful scene.
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Postby J@3 on Sun Nov 20, 2005 2:27 pm

To be honest I would've only punished the fans and Ron Artest... I spent about 2 hours downloading the entire fight after it happened on a 32k connection and I think Artest/fans are the only people accountable. I don't buy the argument that Ben Wallace started it, these sort of confrontations happen in basketball quite often and it doesn't always result in the sort of scenes that were shown. I also don't buy the argument that Ron Artest was at fault for lying down on the scorers table. It starts with the fans, there was no need for that idiot to throw the cup at Artest... it was completely random and IMO no fault of any player on the court. Ron Artest's reaction though was just wrong.

I don't really think any of the other players should've been suspended either... the few that went into the crowd did so to try and get Artest out of there. Jermaine decked that guy because the idiot ran onto the court. I don't think anyone would've expected them to just stand there while Artest goes nuts in the stands. The only people to blame I think are the fans and Artest... I think Artests punishment was fair, but I also think that the fans really did get away with it.

Anyways, I'm glad that guy isn't disabled. If he was still having problems a year later I'd be concerned.
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Postby Matt on Sun Nov 20, 2005 4:34 pm

The comparison to a south american soccer match is stupid. You said it wasnt even that bad in reference to the article which didnt compare it to a soccer match.


What do you mean it wasnt that bad? Did you even see it? I doubt you did becuase everything that was quoted happened.


in the grand sceem of sporting brawls this was small.


see, there's me comparing it to all sporting events and not denying that anything happened.

and also, what happened with a uefa soccer match last year when the fans threw objects at an opposing player? the next 2 or 3 games at that home stadium were banned for all spectators. I usually criticise soccer authorities but on that occasion they got it 100% right.


chances are that there were precedent cases, and now that's the standard UEFA punishment. I'm pretty sure if the same thing happened again in the NBA punishments would be much more severe.
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Postby air gordon on Mon Nov 21, 2005 9:12 am

ok i hope this is the last we hear abou/discuss this
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Postby Indy on Tue Nov 22, 2005 5:56 am

air gordon wrote:ok i hope this is the last we hear abou/discuss this


No kidding. I just want to say one thing that people always forget to mention about the brawl, and I didn't read this whole thread so I don't know if it was mentioned, but that is the role the referees played in the whole thing.

Imagine if they had made sure Ben Wallace had gotten off the court after he was ejected! That sure would have been nice, the towel would have never been thrown, and the cup would have never been thrown.
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