CARTER TO THE NETS?

by **Big Answer** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 10:23 am

Moiso's been waived to make room......

by **Username123** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 10:32 am

This is the stupidest trade ever. Eventhough Toronto got the better of the trade. Carter was the Star of Toronto, now who is the star??? Chris Bosh

Zo wont even play in TO he wants to get out to a contender. Probably they would trade Zo and Rose to Miami for Eddie Jones. Either way you look at it we (Toronto) lost good talent for somn Injured Prone Guy who dosent want to play, and bench warmers. I think Toronto got did get the better of the trade only because of Draft Picks

by **Donatello** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 10:49 am

vince is on the injured list........is it only in NBA Live that you can't trade IR players (dodges tomatoes cause i'm stupid)?

by **EGarrett** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 11:06 am

Wow.

My question is...are they trying to get better or to rebuild? We picked up a kinda-sorta superstar for spare parts. But it cost us some draft picks and a lot of size.

This'll help for now...Vince gives us a shooter...and if he was dogging it this year...another star.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

by **j.23** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 11:14 am

they're probably gonna package zo and donyell marshall (his contract expires this season) for someone decent.. i think you guys can expect an adequate palyer to hit TO

by **J@3** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 11:54 am

The two first round selections sent to Toronto were originally acquired from Denver as part of a trade made this past summer. The draft picks include Philadelphia’s first round pick in 2005, protected 1-8 or 2006, protected 1-5 or 2007, unprotected and Denver’s first round pick in 2006, protected 1-5, 2007, protected 1-2, 2008, unprotected.

by **Donatello** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 12:08 pm

by **Ataraxia** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 12:21 pm

someone try a dbf edit of VC...

what a trade, cant believe it happend......I wanted to see VC on the Knicks, I got a feeling Kidd will get traded in feb for Dre ++ ......their going to try make the Nets a fun club that sucks at winning.

by **Matthew** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 1:55 pm

I cant see how this deal really helps Toronto. Vince may not have been as good as he once was, but he is still better than eric williams. Alonzo might get minutes but he will probably get cut and goto a contender, and aaron williams is a hardworking player, but wont be pushing bosh out of the rotation. Toronto could have made the deal with the knicks, then been under the cap in two years. stockpiling picks usually doesnt pay off.. and toronto looks doomed right now.

by **Stevan** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 2:38 pm

... so the Nets get rid of Martin only to later acquire Carter. Hopefully they saved all that money they were hoping to save, and now they might even get a few more bums in the seats...

And let's all remember who the real victim is in this! Poor Ron Mercer, there goes his playing time :lol:

by **Yessie** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 3:42 pm

Stevan wrote:... so the Nets get rid of Martin only to later acquire Carter. Hopefully they saved all that money they were hoping to save, and now they might even get a few more bums in the seats...

And let's all remember who the real victim is in this! Poor Ron Mercer, there goes his playing time

you never know maybe carters breaks another leg or gets hit by a car. but on the other hand NJ could go small like some teams in the NBA and have a lineup of Collins,Jefferson,Mercer,Carter and Kidd.

Bluesky · by **Andrew** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 6:38 pm

Heard about the deal on the KIA Shootaround before the Heat/Nuggets game, and was surprised to say the least. I would have thought the Raptors would have waited for a better offer (or perhaps considered one of the other six offers that were reportedly on the table) but I guess with Carter's season they were just eager to get him out of town before there were no offers at all.

Toronto got the better end of the deal in terms of talent and insurance policies. Mourning isn't the player he used to be but can still contribute as a starter, Eric Williams is a workhorse player that teams can really use and Aaron Williams is a good player for the Raptors to have as a third string backup up front. Those picks may or may not produce players who can plug holes but it doesn't hurt to have them.

However, I think New Jersey got the better end of the deal in terms of personnel. Mourning probably won't want to play in Toronto, but it's going to be difficult to move him. Jalen Rose is now the Raptors' marquee player. It didn't work out with the Bulls, my guess is that it's not going to work much better in Toronto.

In Mourning and Aaron Williams, the Nets moved a player who didn't want to be there and a player they sought to deal in the offseason. It did thin their ranks in the frontcourt and losing Eric Williams is a blow, but they're stronger at the wings and have added a player who should really benefit from Kidd's unselfishness.

by **beau_boy04** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 6:52 pm

Wow! what a breaking news! I guess we just have to see how VC and Kidd get along and how they play together alongside RJ. Gotta be interesting for sure.
By the way anybody knows the status of Vince's injury? when is he coming back?
I dont care about all the players the Nets traded but in my opinion they gave in too many draft picks. But, if you think of Kwane brown (washington), chanlder and curry (bulls).... you never know that kinda of talent are out there LOL

Ok my british babe wants to go out... see you guys soon

Thanks.

by **fgrep15** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 7:13 pm

Kevin_93 wrote:Toronto won this deal. They get a legit center in Zo (not as good as he used to be, but still dependable), Aaron Williams, another big guy to come off the bench who can rebound and score a bit, and Eric Williams, who imporves the bench drastically when Mo Pete is given the starting job. Carter is having the worst year ever, AND he's injured...again. Oh, wait, and they also got 2 1st rounders off a crappy team. BONUS!!!

In conclusion, they're is a cure for cancer, just send it to New Jersey.

I don't think you understood the deal man, Toronto doesn't really win, it's okay I guess, but I wouldn't call it a win.

Fiirst of all Alonzo Mourning is very likely to not suit up for the Raptors, even Babcock admitted it and said he would've done the trade with only Aaron Williams and Eric Williams which is pretty stupid, and ZO was just there to make it even.

Next, the picks are not New Jerseys, one is a Denver's pick which is Top 3 protected next season, and the other a Philly's pick which is Top 8 protected in 2006.
Denver isn't going to get a top3 pick, so we'll get the pick which will likely be about mid-first round, 20-23 ish.

Now to continue, yes we get toughness, but Aaron Williams is a 6'9 Center and he's stronger than Bosh and Woods, but also 33 years old and a worse rebounder than them both so he really doesn't plug our biggest hole. He'll be a better defender than them, but is still udnersized and not anything special on the boards.

Eric Williams is okay, but also an old guy at 32 years old, let's get serious here this isn't a trade that is supposed to propel us into the playoffs. Also we have our nice waste of a pick Araujo waiting to blossom at the age of 24.

So in review, we didn't get younger, we didn't shed salary, we didn't fill our rebounding need, we didn't get cap space or do anything to help our contract situation, and we got 2 draft picks which will be in the teens to 20's, and with next year's draft being weak will help but not as much as some people might think.

Also the locker room might not be as great as some might think since none of these players are really "happy" to be coming here. EW is a savy vet, but he expressed displeasure in coming, Alonzo is even less happy than being in New Jersey, and AW isn't really happy either.

Knowing Carter was on the trading block, the Nets called the Raptors two days ago on a lark. "Other than giving up Richard or Jason, I didn't know if we had what we needed to get that type of player - you never know until you ask," Thorn said, referring to Kidd and Richard Jefferson. He said he was initially surprised that Toronto went for the deal.

...

Around the league, the move caused some executives to question the thinking of Rob Babcock, Toronto's first-year general manager, and to praise the Nets' move.

"It's a home run," said one Eastern Conference executive who spoke on the condition of anonymity. "This deal definitely makes them better. Alonzo wasn't playing. Aaron Williams wasn't playing much. Basically, it's Eric Williams for Vince Carter."

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/12/18/sport ... 8nets.html

Most of us Raptor fans are banking on the idea that Babcock has a plan to get another deal in place which will deal Alonzo Mourning maybe with Jalen Rose to a contender, if he doesn't then this is pretty garbage overall.

The only problem is from this:

Around the league, the move caused some executives to question the thinking of Rob Babcock, Toronto's first-year general manager, and to praise the Nets' move.

Any other trading partner we have is going to be looking to take advantage of us thinking Babcock is just an idiot. It's an okay trade, not really good, but it's too early to tell, if Babcock can make a second trade [a good one] that helps us future wise then it will be good. If he makes a stupid trade or does nothing then it's just a waste, we really don't gain anything and their were better offers on the table.

I mean seriosuly, the Nets were surprised to get this...

by **fgrep15** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 7:33 pm

Donatello wrote:
The Future wrote:Its "official" in a sense..just the NBA has to approvve

already is approved. done deal.

as bhzmafia just said to me, imagine if NJ hadn't traded k-mart for nothing.

http://www.nba.com/nets/

If they didn't trade Kmart then Zo wouldn't want to leave, then the trade would probably not have happened, the Butterfly Effect.

by **MaD_hAND1e** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 8:17 pm

Stevan wrote:... so the Nets get rid of Martin only to later acquire Carter. Hopefully they saved all that money they were hoping to save, and now they might even get a few more bums in the seats...

And let's all remember who the real victim is in this! Poor Ron Mercer, there goes his playing time

hmmm... I remember the Raptors being a better team without Carter, anyone remember there 9 game winning streak a couple years back without Carter?
But really, I think the Nets got ripped off badly. They lost their frontcourt and future basically for one player.
Or maybe the Nets are sacraficing bigmen and trying to go with the fast break style of play that has given the Suns and Sonics their recent success? but if thats the case, the Nets don't have the depth or talent (apart from the 1,2 and 3) to run this offense as efficiently and they would get eaten alive on defense with Scalabrine and Collins manning the middle

by **Andre** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 9:02 pm

The Nest better pick up some free agent to strenghten the frontcourt. Right now they only have 3 players taller than 6.8:
- Brian Scalbrine 6.9
- Jason Collins 7.0
- Nenad Krstic 7.0

Considering that 2 of them should start, that leaves only 1 reserve for big men. Oh yeah...there is also Jabary smith..but please.....

Toronto got the worst out of the deal. 3 old players on the falling and some draft picks that will reveal useless IMO.

Overall, NJ got a good deal but they will not go anywhere until next year when they will be able to get some big men in the offseason. Toronto should have definitly waited for a better deal to come up...I don't know what's in their GM's mind....

by **Tuomas** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 9:12 pm

to me this trade is maybe even worse than the one that sent shaq to miami. TO lacks everything now... I mean who are they going to build the team around now? Bosh? Alston? Rose? They lack a centerpiece, a #1 scoring option. I doubt that Toronto has the potential to develop itself to a team-team like Utah...

No problem with Carter leaving but they should have got a franchise player for him. No playoffs this year for Canada.

by **Ataraxia** on Sat Dec 18, 2004 10:22 pm

I cant believe the Raptors rejected much "better" trades for something like this.....

I mean I thought ok so they were saying NO to Reef because they thought they'll get better....but if u ask me Reef is probably good as all 3 of those players the Raptors got combined.

Geez, this has got to be one of the worst trades Ive seen of all-time....its pretty close to the one that saw K-Mart for those future picks and Dre being traded after 16-11-4 for D-Miles....

Anybody know when VC will suit up again, I mean is he even comin off the IR list by the end of the year or will it be like February before we get to see him in a Nets jersey?

by **thegreatdivide** on Sun Dec 19, 2004 1:28 am

i would have loved to have seen magloire go to toronto in a package for carter because he actually wanted to go there. Dont players generally play better when they're happy?
But the Nets are my East team and i have to support them...go Mr Thorn!
Maybe the nets should sign moiso to a minimum contract to fill the void at C.
hmm, one wonders about the future...

P.S. I think the raptors should put their focus on building around Bosh and Alston and hope that they can end up with a decent SF in the draft next year. (Denvers projected draft pick is 19 on nbadraft.net, hakim warrick is projected at 17.....hmm, draft day moves....more to think about!)
The future could be bright in toronto.

by **Username123** on Sun Dec 19, 2004 2:31 am

Vince is prjected to play on Monday--20th, on Sunday--19th the Raps play New Jersey!!!

by **fgrep15** on Sun Dec 19, 2004 4:19 am

I don't think the Raps will really "build" around Alston considering he's 28 years old, he'll be a peice of the puzzle but not a building block.

by **air gordon** on Sun Dec 19, 2004 7:43 am

fgrep- what are the player salaries of e williams and a williams? also imo it's a little early to be calling next year's draft class being weak :wink:

andrew: rose toronto's marquee player? i'm not sure about that one. maybe you can explain this further. from the games i've seen and what i read in last week's sports illustarted, coach mitchell is not running the offense around carter or rose (well not counting last nite for rose :wink:

)

by **fgrep15** on Sun Dec 19, 2004 10:02 am

That's definately not happening with Rose, sometimes the other guys don't even give him the ball, if you heard his interviews, this is how it went:

Reporters: Jalen how do you feel about the trade?

Jalen: Did we get Richard Jefferson?

blah blah blah blah

Jalen: Vince was the first dominoe, this isn't the end of it.

Jalen is expecting to be moved really, he deinfatley doesn't think he's our marquee player, unlike other players Jalen knows/pays attention what goes around and what people say, so he's not ignant of the whole situation.

by **MaD_hAND1e** on Sun Dec 19, 2004 10:11 am

fgrep15 wrote: so he's not ignant of the whole situation.

Do you mean ignorant?

CARTER TO THE NETS?

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