.:My Tweaked Roster Patch - BY DK 1/24/03 UPDATE OUT:.

[DK]

Well I finally gave in and tewaked player ratings and am actually getting good realistic results.

I recomend you play at
8-9 Min
Maxed Fouls
Supre Star
Fatigue on

With these in 5 games the CPU or me has not hit over 50% but has gotten close once.

If you get more than 7 blocks you are doing pretty good

Steals are in the 7-15 range

Speed and quickness is reduced but not to the point of unrealistic slowness.

And FG and 3s are reduced but not eliminated becasue if you are open you will hit a good %, but now using screens is nice as you get a good look and are fouled too.

Both teams should get at least 35 rebounds becasue of the misses.

Try them and tell me what you think



GET THEM HERE


BTW Some attributes may seem a bit weird or too low but just try before you judge because some had to be lowered drastically like inside scoring since the CPU is always money in the paint even with lots of bodies banging and a lot of hands in the air.

[DK]

I see a hunderd views but no replies, has anyone tried the patch?

I'm telling you it will feel a lot better than the default rosters and reseble an actual game now.

[DK]

You've got to try this now, I did some more tweaking and just had agreat game vs Atlanta


Here are the stats

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Entire Game         Atlanta          Boston           

Points              72               84               
Bench Scoring       12               9               
Field Goals         28/68            36/81           
Field Goal %        .412             .444             
3 Point FG          4/21             9/23             
3 Point %           .190             .391             
Free Throws         12/18            3/7             
Free Throw %        .667             .429             
Rebounds            38               46               
Off. Rebounds       4                13               
Def. Rebounds       34               33               
Blocks              0                6               
Steals              8                12               
Assists             12               14               
Turnovers           16               11               
Fouls               15               14               


The great part was that I held them to 3 fg in the 3rd quarter when I steped up my D.

Try the link is the same as above.

[pinkegobox]

i'm trying it right now...

[DK]

You will not regtet it.

BTW for those of you that care it is now available as a save file ZIP instead of just a DBF.

ZIP SAVE

LONE DBF FILE

[kalum]

i tried it.

although CPU only has 50% FG(cus i blocked them too often), i can still get 60% FG. 15 Blks.

and CPU still concentrates on 3pts.

could u tweak it as well? THX!

[DK]

Here are some more stats

I just shut down Washington

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Entire Game         Washington       Boston           

Points              63               86               
Bench Scoring       18               17               
Field Goals         25/73            33/72           
Field Goal %        .342             .458             
3 Point FG          5/29             6/18             
3 Point %           .172             .333             
Free Throws         8/9              14/16           
Free Throw %        .889             .875             
Rebounds            33               47               
Off. Rebounds       6                9               
Def. Rebounds       27               38               
Blocks              2                6               
Steals              9                8               
Assists             15               17               
Turnovers           14               15               
Fouls               20               13       

Kalum- I guess the stats also depend on the way the player plays a lot becasue if you keep on trying to dunk and go for steals and just jumping for blocks like an arcade madman the stats will reflect that. But the blocks should not be morethan 10 in any game since the jumping and blocks are reduced so that you have to time and anticipate really well. I guess you are pretty good on O and sloppy on D.

[smithy_17]

i am glad that there are others who find original nba live being too fast and high-scoring. since i live in germany i do not have the game and therefore have not tried your tweaked rosters yet. but i played the demo and i found it bad regarding lack of realism. go on making the tweaked rosters even more realistic and i will tell you how i find them as soon as i tried them. -one question: how do you tweak the rosters, which program do you use?

[DK]

You can use the Live 2001 toolkit which mostly works with 2003 if you have MS Acces 2003

You can also edit with MS Excel I hear but it's more messy/difficult, I think

There is a program called DBF viewer pro which also works well

There are other programs I think but I can't remember

[pinkegobox]

just one word EXCELLENT

i've played a detroit - new orleans game

very realistic stats but the problem is the team rankings.. they are not realistic..i guess i have to make some change to put it on a good order...

nice roster tough !

[DK]

Thanks a lot man, I'm glad you like them.

The rankings probaply use proportions that depended on good offense but since the offence is reduced the rankings are thrown off, but I personally don't care since I know who is good and who is not and the rankings have no effect on gameplay at all.

[pinkegobox]

can u post or send me by pm the tweaking you made cos i'm playing on franchise mode and i'd like to tweak the rookies created by the computer also

thanks a lot

[DK]

Thes are the modifiers I used with Live 2001 Toolkit

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FG        * .50
3PT       * .77
INS SCORE * .43
DUNKING   * .92
STEAL     * .44
BLOCK     * .22
JUMP      * .42
SPEED     * .82
QUICKNESS * .95
FATIGUE   * .95


[SUDI 5 29]

I recomend you play at
8 Min
Maxed Fouls
All-Star
Fatigue on

What do you recommend, Arcade or Simulation. I am going to try out your settings after Thanksgiving food, hehe, can't wait.

[DK]

I play arcade but sim should not be a problem.

Although before sim used to produce more fast breaks so I play arcade to be safe, but that might have been a byproduct of the default rosters.

To be honest I think it is all in my head and the only difference is the rules that swithch automatically when you switch modes.

[daHiVE]

tried ur rosters, this is what the 1st game was like:

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Entire Game         New Jersey       Phoenix         

Points              71               92               
Bench Scoring       13               24               
Field Goals         27/82            39/82           
Field Goal %        .329             .476             
3 Point FG          1/16             5/17             
3 Point %           .062             .294             
Free Throws         16/18            9/14             
Free Throw %        .889             .643             
Rebounds            34               54               
Off. Rebounds       8                14               
Def. Rebounds       26               40               
Blocks              6                8               
Steals              10               8               
Assists             13               27               
Turnovers           9                16               
Fouls               12               11               


blocks were the thing where i immediately noticed improvement. steals were ok too...just the rebounding was very onesided(i was able to grab 9off with tsakalidis )
it also made me take it to the basket as much as possible cause jump shots are very tough to make(about 50% of the open shots were good but contested shots were pretty much impossible...both for me and the cpu)
i´m gonna play some more games and post the stats but overall i like those settings...with a little more finetuning they could be the ones to go.

[DK]

The offensive boards are always like that if you jump for your own boards but it is not too bad (I did not modify the rebound ratings), and the shooting I have no problem with. If you are having shooting trouble use screens because they free you very well, try the stepback move, or try to get an open shot by posting up and kicking out.

[ToniStarks]

Dk, I can assure you that it's definately not "in your head" as you have said. I've been doing extensive analysis between arcade and simulation mode with both the PC and Xbox(Bought when released)versions of the game, and my sincere deduction is in line with what most have said for some time. Arcade does in fact play more like a sim, and vice versa.

The difference between the 2 modes is even more evident on the PC due to the ratings, which can be easily manipulated to reflect realistic stats and game pace. Basically, these alterations make it easier to spot the differences. With the original rosters it'a different story. Virtually all players in the game had the ability to make just about every basket on both modes of play, so there seemed to be more parity between the modes as a result, leading to confusion and uncertainty. IMO, the only telling areas were the slower game speed, more realistic blocking(Again, there's some parity in this area until you reduce block and jump ratings and compare both modes)and some other player miscues

Anyhow, I'll truncate my experiment and findings to keep this thread short. With a tweaked roster(I believe it's Jcroster's roster) I managed to played a few(Different teams) cpu vs cpu and human vs cpu games while paying VERY close attention to game behavior, stats etc.

Arcade mode yielded more realistic results in terms of fg%(45-55%), game pace,etc. I was unable to hit jump shots on a regular basis, unless the ball was distributed properly, good player position achieved, etc = Sim like experience. The slower game pace is a BIG factor here. Switching to simulation created more fast-breaks, more effective use of freestyle moves, and quicker but easier scoring, which ultimately led to a much higher fg% = The arcade type play that everyone's talking about.

In conclusion I have to say that the rumors are VERY true here. There seems to be much ambiguity on these boards concerning this issue and I hope these findings shed some light.

Keep in mind I have all rules turned up, including fatigue for both modes.

[joemimic]

The biggest problems I have are people being overrated, even with double team and more pressure every tweak i always find the Pgs getting easy penetration and short jumpers and lots of assists. I know you've tweaked the game but have you edited guys ratings as well?

[DK]

Here is another game

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Entire Game         Boston           New Orleans     

Points              92               79               
Bench Scoring       8                20               
Field Goals         35/80            28/68           
Field Goal %        .438             .412             
3 Point FG          7/22             4/20             
3 Point %           .318             .200             
Free Throws         15/18            19/27           
Free Throw %        .833             .704             
Rebounds            44               35               
Off. Rebounds       10               3               
Def. Rebounds       34               32               
Blocks              3                2               
Steals              11               6               
Assists             15               14               
Turnovers           16               22               
Fouls               21               20               


Davis was held to only 15 points as I pulled away in the 3rd but they closed in the 4th but I ran the break to separate in the closing minutes.

[hihihi316]

here's my stat with your tweak

Entire Game Toronto Philadelphia

Points 93 92
Bench Scoring 15 12
Field Goals 41/80 41/99
Field Goal % .512 .414
3 Point FG 3/19 5/21
3 Point % .158 .238
Free Throws 8/15 5/6
Free Throw % .533 .833
Rebounds 43 49
Off. Rebounds 5 14
Def. Rebounds 38 35
Blocks 5 1
Steals 8 10
Assists 25 17
Turnovers 16 12
Fouls 7 16

do you guys think this stat is realistic enough? i wanna hear what you guys think...by the way it was arcade 8min starter user and phily was mine.

I 've noticed that speed was still pretty fast and there were as many fastbreaks as before but for some reasons they missed quite a few open dunks and layins...i saw even vince carter missed dunk!!(hmm..unrealistic i guess?)and AI missing half of his layins...i guess this is why there are more rebounds ...so plz do something about it! beside that, jump shooting is pretty realistic...was able to make shots if it's open most of time.... yeah so only things that troubled me were missing easy dunks and layins and the speed...so i think it would be better if you could make those easy dunks and layins more "doable" and lower jumpshot rating a little bit more so more rebounds can come from jump shot misses...not dunks...
also lowering speed will be helpful to reduce the frequency of fastbreak... so fewer fastbreaks...but if they are in fastbreak, they gotta be able to score~!

[DK]

I have yet to see the CPU miss a dunk, and layups go in very well when I play only a few are missed each game.

***EDIT*** I just saw you play starter and that is probably what is throwing you off, in starter the human gets an advantage. I suggest you play All-Star and if you have trouble playing defense play as the C or PF and let the CPU guard the quick ball handlers.

I see you had 99 shots in 8 min quarters this means you just ran it upcourt all the time and took a quick shot which will lead to a lot of fast breaks, this is becasue if you hurry up and take a shot and miss and all the CPU guys are not even back yet they will be in position to outnumber you and get easy points.

You have to not hurry upcourt sometime and pass the ball around and look for a good shot and I guarantee this will stop CPU fast breaks. I only give up about 12 fast break points up per game and I don't play slowly I pick carefully when it is time to run.

BTW To all people if you play a run-n-gun type of offence with lots of quick and stupid shots you have to expeect the CPU to counter with this since they are getting quick boards and their guys release and outnumber you on the break.

Here is what I do: I turn OFF Crash Boards and this makes sure all your guys get back on D and you can still get good O-Boards since your C is usually under the basket, all you have to do is manually jump.

I also set the defece to always Man to Man to make sure Zone is not called since Zone is eaten up by the break since nobody covers the guys runnig downcourt.

Also if you take long jumber as soon as you let go start sprinting back to ensure good numbers back to defend.

When I am beaten on the break it is usually the SF since Erick Williams is not the quickest guy.

[Nick]

I just downloaded it. I'll play it later on when i get off the net...i'll tell you what i think...

p.s. it'll be my first 'tweaked' roster that i've ever played with with Live 03...

[DK]

I just downloaded it. I'll play it later on when i get off the net...i'll tell you what i think...

p.s. it'll be my first 'tweaked' roster that i've ever played with with Live 03...

Its a hard swithch at first but later you will be glad.

[DK]

Here is an interesting one

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Entire Game         Philadelphia     Boston           

Points              67               81               
Bench Scoring       12               17               
Field Goals         28/67            33/80           
Field Goal %        .418             .412             
3 Point FG          5/30             3/16             
3 Point %           .167             .188             
Free Throws         6/8              12/17           
Free Throw %        .750             .706             
Rebounds            34               51               
Off. Rebounds       3                19               
Def. Rebounds       31               32               
Blocks              0                3               
Steals              14               12               
Assists             21               17               
Turnovers           24               17               
Fouls               29               12               


This was a sloppy game, both teams made retarded passes and the 76ers did not box out, at one point I got 7 offensive boards on one posession. Outside shooting was tough to come by but that did not stop Iverson from jacking up 3s every 20 seconds.

Iverson played a total of 12 min (1.5 Quarters) because he was in foul trouble when he started to hack Pierce and when Battie steped up to take 2 charges on him while he was trying to break some ankles.

This shows what happens when a one man team loses their only offensive weapon.