Kirilenko Good, Great, or just plain bad?

[kinokong]

true but would his back allow him to add 20lbs? looks like he's having enough trouble with the weight on him... maybe 10lbs would be good enough

[fgrep15]

Just on that, have a look at some of the World's best 100m sprinters. Most of them could probably be body builders in their spare time, muscle definitely doesn't slow them down.

Straight line speed and lateral quickness are not the same thing. Lebron's weight hampers his lateral quickness. Ron Artest isn't very quick or fast, he just puts 10 times more effort defensively than everyone else does. If Kirilenko gained weight, it would affect his movement, not everyone can gain weight and be extremely explosive.

He is a great impact player. He's a Top 20-25 [more Top 20] guy in the league, not an offensive superstar, but impacts his team a lot. His scoring is where the weakness comes, he just can't take over games offensively because he's not a great scorer or passer. He's a decent scorer, best all-round defender in the league, one of the best two way and all-round players in the league, can rebound, good passer for a forward [4.3 APG], decent [not really impressive] shooter, and the bad thing, injury prone.

The Jazz are 17-9 when AK plays, and 2-8 when he doesn't play. He's the only player in this generation to have multiple games of 5x5 [5 Points, Rebounds, Assists, Steals, and Blocks], other was Hakeem, and he had a game with 5X6 [6 Points, Rebounds, Assists, Steals, and Blocks], so he can fill up the stat sheet.

[J@3]

Straight line speed and lateral quickness are not the same thing. Lebron's weight hampers his lateral quickness. Ron Artest isn't very quick or fast, he just puts 10 times more effort defensively than everyone else does. If Kirilenko gained weight, it would affect his movement, not everyone can gain weight and be extremely explosive.

But it does happen, so how can you be so sure that it wouldn't work for Kirilenko

[fgrep15]

Well he's not extremely explosive right now, he's an above average athlete. I don't see how gaining weight would make him more explosive, at best he would maintain the same explosiveness, but since it's been so hard for him, then he does not have the kind of body, and will lose explosiveness and movement ability by putting on 20 pounds.

[Jing]

good good good

[AlwaysWhat,NeverWhy]

Well he's not extremely explosive right now, he's an above average athlete. I don't see how gaining weight would make him more explosive, at best he would maintain the same explosiveness, but since it's been so hard for him, then he does not have the kind of body, and will lose explosiveness and movement ability by putting on 20 pounds.

From what I know about muscle training, there are many ways to train your muscles and gain extra mass, depending on the desired outcome. Some train for sheer bulk, others for speed, others to get the maximum amount of work produced in the least possible time( power.) Should a player gradually gain muscle in crucial areas and train for explosiveness/power (power as in the physics term= W/t), the results would be greatly beneficial to his lateral quickness.

[fgrep15]

You can improve those things, but just saying he should gain 20 pounds IMO is not going to do much for him. You're not really going against what I'm saying...

[AlwaysWhat,NeverWhy]

You can improve those things, but just saying he should gain 20 pounds IMO is not going to do much for him. You're not really going against what I'm saying...

No, I said gaining 20 pounds is going to be beneficial both to his strength and to his agility, if he works towards that goal. Not to mention that he will more injury-resistant. In my opinion, gaining 20 pounds 'the right way' (sic) would do him a world of good.

[Andrew]

At this point I'm inclined to call him a very good player, not a great one, kind of like Ginobili in that regard. A lot of players get elevated to elite status too quickly these days. We seem to skip "Hey, this guy's pretty good" and go straight to "This guy is awesome!" He's very good, but not yet a great player.

[tempo]

^^ i disagree.

any player who can play a game and have 20 points, fifteen rebouinds, 6 assists 7 blocks and 5 steals in my opinion is a great player. fair enough that mit be only one game but this guy does it on the regular. in my opinion people these days are automaticall y called great players by avergaing over 25 points per game, the game is played on both sides of the ball which kirilenko can do and he can do it well.

all basketball experts love kirilenko and the way he plays the game of basketball, kirilenko has no weakness! he is average or better at everything on the court. his free throw percentage has dipped this year but thats due to lack of consistant games.

and adding 20 pounds has no negative issues whatsoever for a player his size. read up on all nba rookies who come in the league and read there scout report, 9 times out of 10 there weakensses are lack of weight issues, nba basketball is a grueiling physical athletic game, playing the forward posistion he needs this extra weight.

[J@3]

He does not do it on the regular.

[Jugs]

He does not do it on the regular

He does it on the extra large

[tempo]

eh, yes he does!

[AlwaysWhat,NeverWhy]

He does not do it on the regular

He does it on the extra large

The pattern is: 1 good game - 1very good game - 1 mediocre game - 1good game - 1 mind blowing/qi\uintuple double threatening game - 20 games on the IR.

[Jugs]

I meant that it does it on the extra large penis. Damn penis references, i've been brainwashed by flipz

[J@3]

eh, yes he does!

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/334 ... djWXWkvLYF

[Jugs]

His season started off pretty shitty but he's playing good as of late..

[playkalla]

he cant be as good as in past because now hes got Mehmet Okur is having a great season

[tempo]

and that game log proves what exactley jae? that he dosent do it on the regular?

[Null17]

Did you actually check the link? That was Kirilenko's gamelogs showing his stats in all his games, not just one game

[J@3]

Well, yes.

[Andrew]

^^ i disagree.

any player who can play a game and have 20 points, fifteen rebouinds, 6 assists 7 blocks and 5 steals in my opinion is a great player. fair enough that mit be only one game but this guy does it on the regular. in my opinion people these days are automaticall y called great players by avergaing over 25 points per game, the game is played on both sides of the ball which kirilenko can do and he can do it well.

Granted, he has great skills but that doesn't make him a great player. If he was putting up those numbers regularly, his averages would be closer to those numbers. In my opinion, a great player is one who not only puts up great numbers consistently but can also utilise them for the benefit of his team. Kirilenko's done some good things so far but he hasn't accomplished that...yet.

Derrick Coleman's a fine example of a player with great skills who wasn't a great player. With his career post-1995, it's easy to forget how versatile Coleman was, how he could put up around 20, 11 and 4 with a respectable amount of blocks and steals, knocking down shots from downtown and being one of the better all around big men. But he lacked drive and had a bad attitude, and his teams did little even with a bit of talent around him. Great players generally help their teams overachieve, and achieve at least moderate success with a good supporting cast.

Kirilenko has great skills, but he's not in the top tier of players yet, he's not "great". But with his talent that could very well change especially if he can remain healthy.

[J@3]

Man I loved Derrick Coleman. I still trade for him every time I play an NBA game. Poor guy, if only he had a working basketball brain.

[tempo]

well i do agree with alot that you said but kirlenko in my humble opinion is a better than good player. although you say he doesnt do it on the regular id have to disagree, his averages of 15 points, 8 rebounds, 4 assists, 1.7 steals and 3 blocks are excellent averages and considering they are average means half of the games he plays will be better (reguly as in half) than these averages and half the games he plays will be below these averages.

i understand a players greatness is not just indicated in box scores and is much more applicable to team success i think utahs record with and without kirilenko in the lineup this year goes without saying. which to me shows he is more than just a good player.

many "great" players have not had team success as history has shown, it takes a few great players and a mixture of good players to have team success not just one player.

peace.

[J@3]

I don't see how you can disagree that he doesn't put up 20/15/6/7/5 on the regular when he's not even done it this season, and has probably only put up numbers like that in a single game 3 or 4 times in the past.