2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Talk about NBA 2K20 here.

2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby Dee4Three on Wed Sep 11, 2019 4:03 pm

Looking back, NBA 2K has really been getting killed on Steam and Metacritic since 2K18.

NBA 2K15 through NBA 2K17 were "mixed" on Steam, with mixed or average user scores on Metacritic. NBA 2K18 through 2K20 on Steam has been "Overwhelmingly negative" or "mostly negative" on Steam and absolutely terrible on Metacritic user scores. The saying that user review scores are low at times because "nobody writes a review to praise", is a myth. Go look at so many games on steam that get absolutely praised on Steam, are are overwhelmingly positive reviewed by thousands of users. Also, Look at NBA 2K11 through NBA 2K17, where users gave the game a much higher score, and praise, not allowed 2K14 through 2K17 to fall under a 6.0 user score, but 2K18 through 2K20 can't break a 3.0.

Last three 2K's

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2K17 all the way to 2K11

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Steam for the last three

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Obviously a big reason for this is the continued heavy VC push, which we have all discussed over and over again. Many of the comments are also gameplay related. It is a combination of both in my opinion, and I think that is a chance they took (Or felt they had to take) when starting with a new motion system in 2K18.

Again, the point of this is: People don't ONLY go online to complain, or only write reviews or score games if it's negative. So many games on steam are praised heavily, including some of the past 2K's when they were on there. A lot of consumers are frustrated with 2K right now, and with good reason. #fix2k20 was trending on Twitter and had well over 30k retweets the last time I checked. A lot of people feel that they are made promises pre-release, that are not kept. Whether it has to do with gameplay, modes, features, etc.

2K does some great things. The depth is unmatched in sports gaming, they include a lot of retro content and appeal to all age brackets/demographics content/mode wise. They are amazing marketing wise, they are everywhere. That have put personalities out there on social media that people can relate to, people directly involved with the game. They have some good gameplay features and authenticity at times, but they are far from perfect. and currently they have quite a few issues with the current product
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby Hadley88 on Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:20 pm

I bought every NBA2k game on PC since 2K9 but this Year I finally passed. You clearly see TakeTwo gives a flying fuck about the PC Version. If they don't even fucking bother to change the Title and Icon of the Game, fuck them!
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby xubu on Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:16 pm

The power of social media and the mentality: pre-order - buy VC - complain in social media about broken mechanics (repeat every year).
I mean why people still buy the PC version, when the reviews on steam are very negative since 3 years?
Why should 2K change their strategy?

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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby Dee4Three on Thu Sep 12, 2019 1:15 am

Right, they can get away with it, they are that big and popular now. The marketing of the game is second to none, and they have no competition in that space

You don't want to be the kid at school that doesn't have the game, cant be left out of park!

You dont want to be low overall and not be able to hang with the others, cant get embarrassed, must buy VC because you dont have time to grind! Or your friends already bought VC and are higher overall, you have to join!

You want to play like those cool youtubers who pump up the game and have fun personalities? Cant not buy the game or buy VC!

Dont like the gameplay? Frustrated with it? So what, you cant NOT HAVE THE GAME. Are you kidding me? I mean, who doesnt celebrate 2K day?

Similar game to last year? Enjoyed a prior title more? Well, dont be silly. You are the outcast if you have a prior title, the new title is NOW, it's what everybody is playing!

It's not just PC, the console user feedback is incredibly negative as well.


What they have done with the online portion of the game is somehow brilliant, the way they have marketed it and even marketed around it. I've never seen so many pissed off people buy the game EVERY YEAR, it's become systematic.

But again, I'll state. People are not bitching for the sake of it, or only go online to be negative. I could post hundreds of screenshots of positive and overwhelmingly positive user reviews on steam, metacritic, etc. A much higher frustration does exist with the last 3 titles.

And guess who buys it every year? ME. It's become systematic. Why? Because of the mods and the use of them cross games. Like all of my conversions from 2K18 to 2K17, the portraits that I can grab from the newer games, etc. I have every PC 2K game made.

They can count on me to buy every year. However I also give positive and constructive criticism feedback every year, and will continue to do so.
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby PeacemanNOT on Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:02 am

This will be the first 2K I’m skipping since 2K11, unless it comes down in price later down the road. From what I’ve seen online and from the demo, gameplay changes does not warrant another 60 dollar purchase for me. On top of all the shifty micro transactions and gambling controversies, the game needs a fresh breath of air.

Too much time being invested in monetising the game instead of improving it. As far as my interests go, they made some nice additions with retro faces (mainly thanks to R4zoR) and being able to change short length for individual players. Other than that nothing really impressed me this year. The games are just too similar every year. It’s a real shame considering how innovative they used to be. They’re far removed from that now.
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby Dee4Three on Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:09 am

PeacemanNOT wrote:This will be the first 2K I’m skipping since 2K11, unless it comes down in price later down the road. From what I’ve seen online and from the demo, gameplay changes does not warrant another 60 dollar purchase for me. On top of all the shifty micro transactions and gambling controversies, the game needs a fresh breath of air.

Too much time being invested in monetising the game instead of improving it. As far as my interests go, they made some nice additions with retro faces (mainly thanks to R4zoR) and being able to change short length for individual players. Other than that nothing really impressed me this year. The games are just too similar every year. It’s a real shame considering how innovative they used to be. They’re far removed from that now.


I miss working with you, ha.

Yeah, R4zors updates to faces are really nice. Ainge, Jamison, etc. You can tell which ones he did, we know his style. Laimbeer finally got an update as well.

I am doing what I can with sliders and trying to have fun with it, uploading gameplay etc. I think they were innovative in away on this title, revamping the dribbling/sizeup system, etc. But that doesnt mean it was perfectly implemented, and certainly doesnt mean that the gameplay itself otherwise is free from issues. As I stated before, it still has several frustrating issues.
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby sticky-fingers on Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:23 am

Metacritics : metascores mean nothing because we all know that videogame press is mostly corrupted. In other hand, users scores means nothing too, because little kids destroy every game without really judging positives and negatives aspects of the game, and even dont own the game.
On this last point, it's the same for reviews on Steam : 1/4 of negative review are made by players who dont own the game :roll:
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby Dee4Three on Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:31 am

Sticky, it can show trends. Both Steam and Metacritic reviews were average or positive 2K17 and prior, and above average before this gen of games. They are not worthless, or dont count, or dont matter.

Again, people are not just going on to be negative. PLENTY of games with positive and overwhelmingly positive reviews on Steam, and high user scores on metacritic. Again, those reviews show trends, and it explains what I see as well on social media in regards to the games frustration wise.

A lot of people dont do a good job of explaining themselves, however. And that's a problem. They are poor at diagnosing and explaining the actual issues that bother them. "This game is trash" and "fix your gameplay" does nothing to help. The devs and decision makers can't work off those statements at all.
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby PeacemanNOT on Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:35 am

Dee4Three wrote:
PeacemanNOT wrote:This will be the first 2K I’m skipping since 2K11, unless it comes down in price later down the road. From what I’ve seen online and from the demo, gameplay changes does not warrant another 60 dollar purchase for me. On top of all the shifty micro transactions and gambling controversies, the game needs a fresh breath of air.

Too much time being invested in monetising the game instead of improving it. As far as my interests go, they made some nice additions with retro faces (mainly thanks to R4zoR) and being able to change short length for individual players. Other than that nothing really impressed me this year. The games are just too similar every year. It’s a real shame considering how innovative they used to be. They’re far removed from that now.


I miss working with you, ha.

Yeah, R4zors updates to faces are really nice. Ainge, Jamison, etc. You can tell which ones he did, we know his style. Laimbeer finally got an update as well.

I am doing what I can with sliders and trying to have fun with it, uploading gameplay etc. I think they were innovative in away on this title, revamping the dribbling/sizeup system, etc. But that doesnt mean it was perfectly implemented, and certainly doesnt mean that the gameplay itself otherwise is free from issues. As I stated before, it still has several frustrating issues.
I miss working with you too brother :lol:

I’m glad to see you’re making the most out of your purchase at least. I know you’ll try to improve the gameplay but you can only do so much with sliders.

I’m sure the devs poured their souls into those aspects of the game and made some innovations, but for me it’s just not impressive enough. Maybe the game has changed some since they released the demo I just felt like I was playing 2K19 with a patch. That old style of recycled gameplay slightly improved every year is getting old for me, very EA esque. I appluad the people working on the bigger projects like MyCareer though. For the first time since like 2K15 they made a story that wasn’t cringeworthy and unrealistic. That being said, it was too scripted for my liking, at least from what I’ve seen from peoples playthroughs.

Maybe the next generation of 2K can show me the improvements I’m looking for and we all know its right around the corner. I can only hope for that at least.
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby Dee4Three on Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:42 am

And that is what I am hoping, and why feedback both positive and negative is vital.

Big picture, future releases, etc. We are the consumers, we are on the ground floor with the game. I think feedback given the right way makes a difference. I've been fortunate enough to have developers listen or respond to me at times when presenting issues (whether it be live or 2K, etc). So if we can highlight the real issues (for me it's mostly gameplay related), maybe we can impact future releases in a positive way.

I am making the best of 2K20. I've created a set of sliders that smooth things out a little, I'm showing the good aspects of the gameplay in videos, etc. But full positive and negative feedback will be posted shortly.

Maybe when next gen comes around we can work on another project together. That's what some dont understand, I WANT to sink my teeth into another title and bring my rosters over, and even make more content. But I have to love the game to do so.
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby sticky-fingers on Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:46 am

If it's a trends, imo it shows that people are annoyed by 2K, but in other hand, they sell more games year after year.

Bashing a game is a trend to. 2K, but also EA have been through this with Star Wars Battle Front. More examples on wikipedia : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Review_bomb

So i also dont care about positive reviews of Metacritics or Steam. For example Bioshock Infinite, it has amazing reviews, but for me it's a big big over hyped shit. (i'll not explain here why :mrgreen: )

It doesnt mean games have no problem, but imo a good review (positive or negative) should contain explanations, and not frustation.
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby Dee4Three on Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:55 am

sticky-fingers wrote:If it's a trends, imo it shows that people are annoyed by 2K, but in other hand, they sell more games year after year.

Bashing a game is a trend to. 2K, but also EA have been through this with Star Wars Battle Front. More examples on wikipedia : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Review_bomb

So i also dont care about positive reviews of Metacritics or Steam. For example Bioshock Infinite, it has amazing reviews, but for me it's a big big over hyped shit.

It doesnt mean games have no problem, but imo a good review (positive or negative) should contain explanations, and not frustation.


We can agree on the positive and negative part, which doesnt happen nearly enough. People also fail on the detail aspect, they don't actually highlight or explain what is bothering them.

I'll probably make another video on positives and negatives for 2K20, and will also be posting in the wishlist/impressions thread.

I've already made a video on Live 19 and identified negatives and positives with it, and sent that over. Not sure if or when live 20 will release, I just know it would be a bad idea to release Live 19.5
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby sticky-fingers on Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:06 am

NBA Live bashing is a trend too, basketballs fans dont even want to try.
Live has everything to win, they're not so far with their last games. They should have listen the community and improve what was needed.
But no, they wanted their own par, and we know that EA is as greedy as 2K.
It seems that they even dont want to outclass NBA2K. They could change the business model (game as a service, free2play, free update of Live 19 with low price).... instead, they postponed the release with no explanations.
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby Dee4Three on Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:13 am

sticky-fingers wrote:NBA Live bashing is a trend too, basketballs fans dont even want to try.
Live has everything to win, they're not so far with their last games. They should have listen the community and improve what was needed.
But no, they wanted their own par, and we know that EA is as greedy as 2K.
It seems that they even dont want to outclass NBA2K. They could change the business model (game as a service, free2play, free update of Live 19 with low price).... instead, they postponed the release with no explanations.


They are very far with the last games, sorry we dont agree. They didnt and havnt done close to enough to make a dent. The product depth wise is a joke next to its competitor, its literally not close.

Gameplay wise they hurt it with patches, lack the authenticity, and have not provided people a true reason to switch. They have nothing overall that stands out, nothing that separates them, and they dont market the game right (or market it at all).

Trust me, NLVC guys, etc know that it needs to be A LOT better. They didnt make a dent with Live 19, because it didnt have the wow factor to make people have a double take. Court battles was something nobody asked for, the still dont have the basics of a basketball game that existed going back to even Live 2000, etc

The gameplay at launch and during the demo was more fun than 2K19 for me, but that quickly eroded with patches, and NBA 2K19 smoothing things out a tad

Right now, 2K can make mistakes, EA cant. 2K can make mistakes and sell 10 million, Live needs to be twice as good, and twice as fun, and have the depth in order to take up some of the marketshare and get a good portion of people to start switching (or buying both).

Unfortunately, my gut tells me that we will get Live 19.5 without added depth and a few gameplay tweaks. And that would be unfortunate.
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby Andrew on Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:19 am

As I said in the other topic, the backlash was inevitable. It's been building up for some time, and certain issues in the past few years have caused the situation to come to a head.

Obviously there is a lot of comfort with 2K because EA hasn't been able to gain any traction with NBA Live, or get it to where it needs to be. There was a time when NBA Live was doing some creative things and was a very viable game for gamers who played the annual sim-oriented releases, but they started to play it safe on the creative front and dropped the ball with bad decisions that led to a lack of quality and of course, games that ended up being cancelled.

2K, on the other hand, kept going from strength to strength. Their games got better and better, reaching new levels of realism. They picked up concepts that NBA Live pioneered and did them better, like franchise mode. They came to PC when EA decided to stop releasing NBA Live on the platform. They did things we never thought we'd see in NBA games due to all the licensing issues, such as the historical teams and modes like NBA's Greatest and The Jordan Challenge. They won over people who grew up with NBA Live, and ran out in front. They had the superior game - and for a few years in this past decade, the ONLY game - which allowed them to bank a lot of goodwill.

And then, they got cocky and blew that goodwill in just a few years.

It's worth noting that gamers are part of the problem and we need to own that. Despite issues that have been present for many years, the game continues to sell well, do great business with "recurrent revenue", and a lot of people will still defend it no matter what. At the same time, if you do want to get a new basketball game each year, what other option do you have? NBA Live isn't where it needs to be, and no one else is throwing their hat in the ring. As Dee noted, there's a certain amount of social pressure to get the new NBA 2K game if you're a 2K gamer, or if you simply want to find people to play with and against online. A majority of the userbase moves on, so it becomes harder to stick with the previous game compared to how it was many years ago. And of course, despite the issues, a lot of people do have fun with NBA 2K to some extent, myself included. I can't begrudge anyone for not following through on a boycott, because it's easier said than done. That being said, it does make it harder to take a stand.

Despite the overall quality and previous satisfaction with NBA 2K, there are some key issues that have come to cause frustration and erode goodwill in the past few years. From a gameplay standpoint, there are a lot of legacy issues, be it in the movement, the AI, quirks such as canned rebounds and cheesy AI interceptions, and so on. With the modes, you've got bugs that break the experience, design choices that are less than ideal (or geared towards microtransactions), and features that are either removed or put behind a gatekeeping measure. Even though the game is now the base for an eSports league, the home version of its competitive scene suffers from a lack of balance and proper matchmaking. Gamers have increasingly been pushed towards buying VC if they want the optimal experience, or else grind until it's no longer fun, grin and bear the inferior experience, or simply give up on the game mode in question.

In other words, there are issues from how the game plays and how the modes work to how gamers are treated and the overall philosophy regarding design and player retention. These issues vary in severity and relevance to certain contingents of the userbase, but they are there and the longer they're a part of the game, the more troublesome they become.

Now, by themselves, a lot of those issues are things that people could forgive. We can accept that these games are made in a brutal development cycle, and that there's only so much that can be done within the space of a year. We can accept that there are limitations, and certain improvements have to wait until the tech is there to achieve them. We can accept that it's impossible to make a game that is completely bug-free. We can even accept that microtransactions have become a thing, at least if there are ways to enjoy the game without spending money if you're willing to put in the time and be savvy with the in-game currency that you earn.

What's harder to accept is when all these issues come together and continue to be compounded. Most gamers are reasonable enough to forgive an issue or two, especially if they're otherwise enjoying the game, but it all adds up, and it has been for a few years now. 2K has really pushed their luck with VC; it's gone from a subtle nod to a gentle nudge to a firm hand planted in the small of your back, pushing you towards spending more money on the game. Some of the legacy issues in the gameplay have been there for too long. The online scene has cultivated a toxic atmosphere and a style that is at odds with the sim nature of the series. The gatekeeping has gotten worse, promoting a sense of elitism. There have been more problems than solutions, and it's getting harder to avoid them by sticking to a particular mode. Even if you can avoid the situation - say, by playing MyLEAGUE and never having to deal with VC - a lot of people are nevertheless disgusted by the practices.

It also doesn't help that one of the things that 2K has always done poorly is communication. They don't like to deliver bad news, and so find a way to tap dance around it during the preview season instead of being transparent about it. That way, not only are people disappointed, they also feel deceived. A lot of the error messages in NBA 2K are strangely passive-aggressive, too. The infamous connection error is worded in a way that blames the user's connection, even when the problem is clearly at 2K's end. When there's a problem with the game accessing your MyPLAYER face scan data, the error message condescendingly instructs you to try again and "pay close attention to the instructions"; even when you've clearly done that and had a scan appear to complete successfully, only for something to go wrong at 2K's end (also, there are no further instructions in the companion app, nor clarifying details on how you supposedly messed up the scan). They don't communicate well at all.

That of course brings us to Ronnie 2K, who technically isn't a community manager by title, but fills a similar role. It's truly astonishing that he's still in that position, because he does an incredibly poor job of it. Oh, he hypes the game up fine, but he also displays disdain for the community. He's the guy who told someone asking about new hairstyles that NBA 2K is "more than a Barbie dress-up game"...24 hours before a new blog dropped, hyping up all the shoes that you could buy for your player (to say nothing of all the other clothes you can dress your player up in). He's the one taking immature and unprofessional potshots at NBA Live. He's the one acting like he's responsible for 2K's success, then throwing the actual developers and programmers (who do work incredibly hard) under the bus when there are complaints.

On top of everything else, he's the one giving out misinformation. During the preview season for NBA 2K20, he hit back at people who noted that The Neighborhood looked the same by saying that what they saw wasn't The Neighborhood in NBA 2K20. In fact, it was. He talked about how it would be possible to re-spec players and swap Badges in and out, and not have to waste VC on a build you don't like. None of that is the case. A couple of years ago on 2KTV, he talked about how Locker Codes would no longer be limited quantity, but timed so everyone had a chance to use them. That WOULD become the case in NBA 2K19, but it wasn't when he originally promised it. At best, he's given out information without understanding the situation and not bothering to check first. At worst, he's straight up lied about things.

It also didn't help when Mike Wang (Beluba) was asked about the re-spec issue, and said that wasn't the case and that he didn't know where it came from. Considering that it came from one of the prominent faces of NBA 2K - Ronnie - that statement doesn't look good. It looks like he's either trying to cover up the situation, or in the best case scenario, there's a huge breakdown in communication between the development team and Ronnie, the guy who's putting out information about the game. Neither scenario inspires trust or confidence in 2K, because either one hand doesn't know what the other is doing, or both are complicit in some deception. That does absolutely nothing for goodwill, and again, it all comes down to terrible communication. On a related note, 2K Support is pretty lousy too, and unfortunately they're often the only ones who can fix a problem with accounts, VC, and so forth.

Even the developer blogs during the preview season have revealed some shady deception in recent years. Things that were described as wonderful and intentional design choices one year are revealed to have been band-aid fixes and the results of technical problems in blogs for the next game. The previous game is thrown under the bus, leaving us to wonder what we can actually trust from the developer blogs. There's taking pre-release hype with a grain of salt, and then there's outright deception. Hype videos where popular YouTubers are shown pulling amazing cards in MyTEAM at community events and so forth are also rather on the nose. Rob Jones once defended VC by saying that multiple currencies would get confusing, only for the game to add a third currency to MyTEAM. They've gone back on their word, time and time again.

The bottom line is that gamers are fed up, and no longer willing to give 2K the benefit of the doubt. They've gone from the developer who saved the genre and took it to new heights when EA dropped the ball to the company that treats basketball gamers like ATMs. They were the team you could trust, the anti-EA. Now, they've done things that are - in terms of goodwill - worse than anything EA has ever done with NBA Live, which doesn't make a great deal of use of microtransactions. They've reached a point where it's hard to cater to offline and online players without doing so at the expense of the other. The combination of all the issues has just frustrated so many gamers year after year for a while now, and as they've pushed their luck, their audience is starting to push back.

It's unfortunate, because NBA 2K20 has some great features and ideas. I think the gameplay does need some tweaking, but certainly not in the way a lot of Park players want. There are solid concepts there, even if the execution needs some work. They made the Auction House easier to unlock in MyTEAM, and added nifty features like Evolution cards and daily login bonuses. Upgrades in MyCAREER are cheaper this year, and the Badge grind has been simplified. You have little things like a ball machine in MyCOURT's shootaround this year, and you don't even need to level up to unlock it. There's new retro content. There's good stuff, and it should be pointed out. It's certainly not all bad, and I've had some enjoyable games so far. I'm burned out on MyCAREER and the connected modes, but there's other stuff to enjoy.

To that end, some of the negativity and the review bombing is an overreaction, or at the very least, not the way to approach the problems. Like I said though, it all adds up and the game does have its problems, from a lack of customisation in MyGM to the same old primitive matchmaking in The Playground and 2K Pro-Am, to game-breaking and immersion-breaking bugs and features like Triple Threat offline not working properly at launch. Again, gamers are getting fed up dealing with familiar problems and new problems alike. It's all come to a head.

I think things will settle down a bit and there will be some more positive reviews that bring the score up, but I also think that 2K is going to have to work for that a bit. Technical issues need to be resolved as soon as they possibly can. Consensus about gameplay problems needs to be reached, and any tweaks in that regard need to be handled carefully. They need to improve their communication and transparency. They need to accept that they've pushed their luck and messed up in recent years, and start rebuilding that goodwill. Even if they can't give us a full breakdown of everything that's going on, they need to at least acknowledge the situation and refrain from misinformation. To be blunt, they need a better community manager/digital marketer/liaison to deal with everyone and be the face of the brand. Preferably someone who isn't more about rubbing shoulders with celebrities and building their own brand, such as it is.

Are the Metacritic scores and negative reviews entirely fair across the board? Admittedly not. However, with the way things were going, it was bound to come to this eventually. Yes, we need to be constructive in our feedback (and it's important that 2K listens to the right voices here), but this is a fed up community hitting back in one of the most effective ways they know how. As I said, it's hard to stick to a boycott when the alternative isn't up to par yet, and especially so in the years when they're literally the only game in town. When an anticipated game doesn't live up to the hype, when a company has blown through all of the goodwill that it's cultivated in years gone by, the backlash is going to be harsh. One might argue with the way some people defend 2K no matter what, the backlash has to go above and beyond so that 2K can't sit back, point at the positive reactions, and call everyone else a hater. Is it the best way of speaking out? Admittedly not. Is it effective? Well, we'll see.

I hope that something positive can come from this. I hope that people can put their money where their mouth is as far as buying the game and spending money on VC, because actions will speak louder than angry Tweets and review bombing. I hope we can get some swift resolutions to the problems in NBA 2K20, and that we can enjoy the positive aspects of the game. I hope that we can be treated more fairly by 2K, and that if we are, then we can reciprocate by giving them a fair go as well. Right now though, a lot of people are fed up by the combination of problems, and even if I don't agree with the methods or necessarily all of the specific criticisms, I understand where they're coming from.

The backlash was coming, and it's been even harsher than expected, but it's understandable. It'll be interesting to see where we go from here.
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby Dee4Three on Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:27 am

Well said!
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby EMan on Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:25 pm

Unfortunately, all the negative user reviews in the world isn't going to change how Take Two does anything. The only opinions they care about are the actual review websites (evidenced by how they rabidly went after Sixth Axis for giving 2K18 a rightfully earned bad score) and the opinions of the Youtuber/Influencers (evidenced by the fact they've been making patch changes this year based on what Youtubers have been telling them to do over Twitter, that whole speed thing that they bungled up).

Maybe I'm a pessimist at this point, but I expect very little to change unless some Youtube basketball personalities start speaking up. That doesn't seem likely to happen with 2K giving them free VC and other benefits for playing their games on Youtube/Twitch. Gaming reviews has been a corrupt system for a while now, Youtubers used to be the ones with more decency than the review sites, that doesn't seem to be the case much anymore.

The average gamer no longer has a speaking voice in this industry. The big publishers do not care what everyone thinks, just what the select few Youtube celebs and review sites think.

As far as the bad MetaCritic and Steam scores go, 2K has only themselves to blame. This year seemed to be buggier than usual and it felt like this one got released in a near alpha state. They have a PR department who seems to only enjoy hanging out with Youtubers or present/former NBA Players and seems to avoid the common person like the plague. Not to mention Ronnie outright lied about some features in the game.

Of course the VC enters into it as well. VC is the main reason I've not bought this series in a while. As much I dislike EA, at least there is not as much of a reliance on microtransactions in Madden than there is on VC in this game (although I will say I did not get Madden this year, rather buggy release for them as well).
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby Andrew on Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:43 pm

The YouTuber/Influencer situation definitely is a problem. It's clear they don't want to rock the boat for the sake of their access and content, and I understand wanting to remain on good terms with 2K in that regard. However, when it means representing only part of the demographic, or blowing smoke when there are valid criticisms to make, a lack of integrity and honesty ends up hurting the game (and all of us who want it to be the best it can be). Unfortunately, as you said, they're the ones whose opinion matters most these days.

It's hard not to feel cynical at times. We should be in a golden age of basketball gaming with all the things that are possible and how far the games have come, but we're not.
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby Uncle Drew on Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:20 am

They can get away with it, primarily because "they are the only game in town" NBA Live can't compete with all the issues they have. So, 2K virtually has no competition.
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Re: 2K20 Metacritic/Steam, etc

Postby Andrew on Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:18 am

Very much so. As I said, it's why it's hard for most people to stick with a boycott. If you want to play an up to date NBA game, your options are limited.
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