Modding Progress

[Andrew]

2K wins

2K won the moment that took Vlad and Leftos from us.

For what it's worth, Vlad approached them, and not the other way around. Seeing what Leftos has done with MyGM and MyLEAGUE, I would suggest that having him on the development team has certainly been to the game's benefit.

And that's what it comes down to. They've hired people from the community who can do great things in an official capacity, to make the game better. It isn't to shut down the modding community. If they wanted to shut down the modding community, all they'd need to do is send us a cease and desist, because have the grounds to do so if they wanted to go down that road. It'd be much cheaper and easier than organising visas and paying people's annual salaries.

[TBM]

Also, Leftos has pointed out that what he's been able to do in an official capacity has greatly surpassed anything he could do with mods. The game is better off with him at 2K than as a tool creator here.

[Jonny2k]

Any word on the roster editor?

[Andrew]

I think the lack of any updates on that front answers that question.

If NBA 2K17 goes with DBF files, or some other more easily editable format, that would be fantastic.

[Jonny2k]

I think the lack of any updates on that front answers that question.

If NBA 2K17 goes with DBF files, or some other more easily editable format, that would be fantastic.

2K doesn't want us to mod. Look at how they gave credit to that guy that did a crappy Create-a-Player based roster with GARBAGE faces; they gave no credit to guy working on a AVENGERS VS JUSTICE LEAGUE mod or to any of the amazing courts and faces the PC community has made.

[Andrew]

If they didn't want us to mod, or were so against modding, they could easily shut us down with a cease and desist. However, they haven't, and seem highly unlikely to do so unless people start charging for mods.

The reason they promote user-made content that only utilises in-game assets comes down to a legal issue. While the Avengers vs Justice League mod is definitely awesome, it also involves the unauthorised use of various licenses and copyrighted characters, which 2K are understandably not in the position to endorse or promote. I would expect that their position is similar the one EA had all those years ago. They probably think a lot of the mods are really cool, and may even use some themselves - I know that members of the Live Development Team did, back in the day - but they can't really openly acknowledge or promote them, because of the can of worms it would open.

Considering that some of the changes in the art archives seem to have made them more organised and modder-friendly this year, I get the impression they might actually be quietly supportive of modding. While I have no idea how much responsibility Leftos has in that regard, I wouldn't be surprised if he's at least advocated on our behalf, knowing his passion and enthusiasm for modding as a member of the community. I don't want to get my hopes up too much, but all the same, I do hope that we continue to see some changes like that in the file formats, which will better facilitate modding in the future. Porting the game from the current generation of consoles has led to new challenges in modding, but we've also made great progress thanks to some very talented individuals in our community, and if 2K are changing some things from their end to make it easier, so much the better.

[Issy]

Hi,
I "think" i did the Orlando Magic court : http://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/201 ... 70-orl.png

But i did not succeed to put it in the game, i try a long hours but i can't
Anyone can explain to me how to process exactly please?

There is my dds and psd files if anyone can finish it, that would be great
https://www.sendspace.com/file/cwd654 (dds)
https://www.sendspace.com/file/1m5ojr (psd)

Sorry for my english.

[Culture Games]

2K wins

2K won the moment that took Vlad and Leftos from us.

For what it's worth, Vlad approached them, and not the other way around. Seeing what Leftos has done with MyGM and MyLEAGUE, I would suggest that having him on the development team has certainly been to the game's benefit.

And that's what it comes down to. They've hired people from the community who can do great things in an official capacity, to make the game better.

It isn't to shut down the modding community.

If they wanted to shut down the modding community, all they'd need to do is send us a cease and desist, because have the grounds to do so if they wanted to go down that road. It'd be much cheaper and easier than organising visas and paying people's annual salaries.

All due respect Andrew, I can't disagree more on almost all points. You're ignoring so much , I think there is CONSIDERABLE evidence for us i nthe community to be leery of 2K and its motives.


I can't speak to Leftos recent work on NBA 2K, people seem to be enjoying the features you mentioned, but what really does he do for them that any number of others couldn't do? They hired a programmer to consult them on their game modes? I believe the theory, yes only a theory, that Leftos was hired primarily because he was one of the few people on here, or anywhere, who showed the ability to literally crack open the game at the core level, as well as make some great tools.

2K may be well and good with customers making some fun visual mods to keep them occupied, but we all know they have no interest in having a game so customizable that people are able to make a superior product to what they are putting out and selling each year. Cyberface mods, fine. Things like Ultimate Base Roster, Or Ultimate Roster Basem or the guy actually editing animations? That's where they get off board. Even HAWK even mentioned months ago that he was contacted by 2K. Now why could that be? Are they going to have him do roster updates? Or is there another reason?

Which brings me to the legendary Vlad who's editor basically made all of it possible. I think the Vlad hiring is the one people hold such bitterness with. Over the fact that Vlad is hired, and immediately NBA 2K becomes relatively unmoddable. After all the lip service initially about how his hiring could mean new opportunities for modding 2K. We know deep down he wasn't hired with that intention, despite what he may have been led to believe, to bridge some kind of gap between 2K and the PC Modding community. What have they done with him besides take away from us?

And finally, all the cease and desist letters in the world wouldn't "shut down the modding community". The modding community, as various sports games and otherwise have proven, is bigger than any one website, as great as NLSC is.

I'd love for it to be proven otherwise, but until then the evidence points to predatory behavior by 2K, and a real dry spell for the next gen modding community.

Verdict: 2K Sports = Guilty

[skoadam]

xoamberxo222, its all facts and well said, i can sign under all of this, but the most scary thing is, how hard it will hit nlsc, when we look around, i mean really, im here from 2002 and i never saw this community so...dead, never. When we look closer what 2k did, few guys here including most important must be blind, 2k signed vlad and leftos, we thought they will do something similar what they did here, at least something close...and what we have? 2k wanted to show us "human face" by hiring modding scene members, thats all. Vlad is perfectly silented and freakin John, one of the most talented guys here was hired to work ..... on pathetic, useless nba 2ktv. If they will hire Hawk we will see same old bs.

[ThePointForward]

As a programmer I can say that having employees that are truly interested in the product and want to make it better because they want to - believe in it - is one of the best things that can happen for the product. Leftos and Vlad probably did more as modders than some of the regular employees back then, so hiring them is not just "good PR", but a very logical business step.

And to be honest, if they really wanted to shut down the modding scene, they could do it much easier than with some cease and desist, not to mention flying foreigners to US and giving them jobs. On a global scale.

Sure, they could make modding easier too, tough some of the changes were to be expected with the step-up to the PS4/X1 version.

[skoadam]

As a programmer I can say that having employees that are truly interested in the product and want to make it better because they want to - believe in it - is one of the best things that can happen for the product. Leftos and Vlad probably did more as modders than some of the regular employees back then, so hiring them is not just "good PR", but a very logical business step.

And to be honest, if they really wanted to shut down the modding scene, they could do it much easier than with some cease and desist, not to mention flying foreigners to US and giving them jobs. On a global scale.

Sure, they could make modding easier too, tough some of the changes were to be expected with the step-up to the PS4/X1 version.

Did i ever post that 2k want to shut down modding? Nope. They want to have FULL CONTROL and whats more, i fully agree that they can do whatever they want to, its their product, their work. They want to limit modding and that way sell more copies with their own DLC in the future. Are they succesful? Yes, community is dead. I bought 2k14 two years after premiere, because of modding(paid 10% of price), they dont like this kind of situations, their main target is to sell their current product, we cant blame them for this, ITS BUSINESS.
When you said its not only good PR and after that you said logical business step i smiled, man, good PR is logical business step. Hiring Da_Czar is not PR move? Are you sure its all about good quality product. Maaan. When i see quasi-limited modding in game (2k16) it means for me ONLY good PR.

[ThePointForward]

To be honest, I don't think DLCs are on the horizon anytime soon with having just one studio releasing the game on a yearly basis. If they'd have 2 or 3 studios working in 2-3 year cycles (CoD for example), they'd have the time to develop some DLCs.

[TheGame8544]

As a programmer I can say that having employees that are truly interested in the product and want to make it better because they want to - believe in it - is one of the best things that can happen for the product. Leftos and Vlad probably did more as modders than some of the regular employees back then, so hiring them is not just "good PR", but a very logical business step.

And to be honest, if they really wanted to shut down the modding scene, they could do it much easier than with some cease and desist, not to mention flying foreigners to US and giving them jobs. On a global scale.

Sure, they could make modding easier too, tough some of the changes were to be expected with the step-up to the PS4/X1 version.

Did i ever post that 2k want to shut down modding? Nope. They want to have FULL CONTROL and whats more, i fully agree that they can do whatever they want to, its their product, their work. They want to limit modding and that way sell more copies with their own DLC in the future. Are they succesful? Yes, community is dead. I bought 2k14 two years after premiere, because of modding(paid 10% of price), they dont like this kind of situations, their main target is to sell their current product, we cant blame them for this, ITS BUSINESS.
When you said its not only good PR and after that you said logical business step i smiled, man, good PR is logical business step. Hiring Da_Czar is not PR move? Are you sure its all about good quality product. Maaan. When i see quasi-limited modding in game (2k16) it means for me ONLY good PR.

I'm glad there are some of you here that agree with me.

Look, I'm happy for Vlad and Leftos. Those guys are incredible at what they do, and they deserve to be compensated. What does upset me though is the way Vlad has pretty much had to ditch Reditor after it being a product you had to pay money for. Not sure if emails are going to spam or what but I've tried contacting him to update my Reditor license for a new computer, since it's locked to the computer you register it on, and have yet to hear anything. He got PAID for the product he put out, and the dang thing cost half as much as the game when you buy all the licenses to edit everything. So when it's all said and done, year after year I was spending $90-$100 on 2k.

As you said earlier, I just find it interesting that the moment Vlad gets signed, 2k significantly alters their file format. Also, apparently a roster editor and now seemingly impossible. I don't know about anyone else but for me, that is HUGE. It's forced me to just continue with 2k14 where I have full control over MY game. I want real coaches. I want more classic teams. I want to edit as I see fit, which is the entire reason I even play video games on my pc. After all, I also have a PS4 and Xbox One with much easier ability to play on my big screen, but I want the ability to mod my games.

You are right on. I also think you nail it on your final points. Being able to mod almost anything in a game, especially a sports game, is bad for business. See it makes the game timeless. You can add the new teams, add in the stats, give guys their awards, update faces, change courts and arenas, get the new jerseys, and so on. But the biggest thing, IMO, that makes a sports game timeless is complete control over the roster. When you aren't having to rely on 2k to give you the latest update with the newest coaches, brand new rookies with all correct information, etc., there isn't as much of a reason to buy the new game.

At the end of the day, all I want is for Vlad to continue honoring the product I already paid for. Locking the registration to one computer without a simple, automated way to change it, means he can't just completely walk away. He operated a business that was essentially sponsored by NLSC, or at least advertised by them through their forums, and then closes down shop and leaves us without access to the product we paid for.

Final comment. If anyone from 2k is reading this, why don't you release a roster editor and charge for it? There are tons of people that would be willing to pay for the ability to edit the game's files the way we could in 2k14. It'd be an excellent business decision, as it's a product that would probably be incredibly inexpensive for you to develop. Charge $30-$40, and you stop the potential losses that are incurred by a modder creating a free roster editor that then makes the game timeless. Make the money yourselves, and we will all love you for it.

[Andrew]

Again, Vlad approached 2K, not the other way around. The file format changed because the year that Vlad was hired by 2K was also the year that we got a port of the PS4/X1 version for the first time. Had we continued to get a 360/PS3 port, chances are the game would still be as moddable and a lot of old patches compatible, but then we'd be missing out on a lot of the enhancements (and post-release support) that the PS4/X1 version receives.

For what it's worth, I've sent in some detailed feedback on how the game could be more modder-friendly. It never hurts to ask for these things, after all. What are the chances it happens? I don't know; regardless of how 2K truly feels about modding - and we obviously have to agree to disagree there - it may not be feasible, or at least not a high priority, because the PC represents a very small portion of the userbase. But I'd rather give it a shot, see if some of those suggestions can be implemented moving forward.

In the meantime, I have to wonder if there are any options that have remained unexplored. Is there anything else we can be doing with the cheat engine, for example? My understanding is that console users have made some creative custom rosters on PS4 and X1, using just the in-game tools (like Create-a-Player). Since we have the ability to externally modify files to some extent, surely we can do more with the PC version. We may not have a couple of our best modding minds active in the scene anymore, but they've left us with tools and tutorials. Can any of the techniques that JaoSming in particular has described be put to use to find ways of modding NBA 2K16 more deeply? I seem to remember him coming out with some roster editing stuff before RED MC was released for NBA 2K14. Some of that stuff might be worth a second look. Even if we can't do as much as we could with NBA 2K14 and earlier games, perhaps we could find a way to do more than what appears to be possible now.

It may be more complicated than is ideal, but then that was the case with NBA 2K9, not to mention NBA Live 95 all those years ago. Sometimes, it's taken a few years for games to be as modder-friendly as we'd like them to be. But like I said, maybe some of those resources are worth a second look. They might contain a few clues that could help us work something out.

[Jonny2k]

Again, Vlad approached 2K, not the other way around. The file format changed because the year that Vlad was hired by 2K was also the year that we got a port of the PS4/X1 version for the first time. Had we continued to get a 360/PS3 port, chances are the game would still be as moddable and a lot of old patches compatible, but then we'd be missing out on a lot of the enhancements (and post-release support) that the PS4/X1 version receives.

For what it's worth, I've sent in some detailed feedback on how the game could be more modder-friendly. It never hurts to ask for these things, after all. What are the chances it happens? I don't know; regardless of how 2K truly feels about modding - and we obviously have to agree to disagree there - it may not be feasible, or at least not a high priority, because the PC represents a very small portion of the userbase. But I'd rather give it a shot, see if some of those suggestions can be implemented moving forward.

In the meantime, I have to wonder if there are any options that have remained unexplored. Is there anything else we can be doing with the cheat engine, for example? My understanding is that console users have made some creative custom rosters on PS4 and X1, using just the in-game tools (like Create-a-Player). Since we have the ability to externally modify files to some extent, surely we can do more with the PC version. We may not have a couple of our best modding minds active in the scene anymore, but they've left us with tools and tutorials. Can any of the techniques that JaoSming in particular has described be put to use to find ways of modding NBA 2K16 more deeply? I seem to remember him coming out with some roster editing stuff before RED MC was released for NBA 2K14. Some of that stuff might be worth a second look. Even if we can't do as much as we could with NBA 2K14 and earlier games, perhaps we could find a way to do more than what appears to be possible now.

It may be more complicated than is ideal, but then that was the case with NBA 2K9, not to mention NBA Live 95 all those years ago. Sometimes, it's taken a few years for games to be as modder-friendly as we'd like them to be. But like I said, maybe some of those resources are worth a second look. They might contain a few clues that could help us work something out.

What's weird is that one person has already made roster mods but refuses to release them because of his irrational fear that 2K will drop the hammer on him and because he's still waiting on greg to finish the roster editor.

[TheGame8544]

Again, Vlad approached 2K, not the other way around. The file format changed because the year that Vlad was hired by 2K was also the year that we got a port of the PS4/X1 version for the first time. Had we continued to get a 360/PS3 port, chances are the game would still be as moddable and a lot of old patches compatible, but then we'd be missing out on a lot of the enhancements (and post-release support) that the PS4/X1 version receives.

For what it's worth, I've sent in some detailed feedback on how the game could be more modder-friendly. It never hurts to ask for these things, after all. What are the chances it happens? I don't know; regardless of how 2K truly feels about modding - and we obviously have to agree to disagree there - it may not be feasible, or at least not a high priority, because the PC represents a very small portion of the userbase. But I'd rather give it a shot, see if some of those suggestions can be implemented moving forward.

In the meantime, I have to wonder if there are any options that have remained unexplored. Is there anything else we can be doing with the cheat engine, for example? My understanding is that console users have made some creative custom rosters on PS4 and X1, using just the in-game tools (like Create-a-Player). Since we have the ability to externally modify files to some extent, surely we can do more with the PC version. We may not have a couple of our best modding minds active in the scene anymore, but they've left us with tools and tutorials. Can any of the techniques that JaoSming in particular has described be put to use to find ways of modding NBA 2K16 more deeply? I seem to remember him coming out with some roster editing stuff before RED MC was released for NBA 2K14. Some of that stuff might be worth a second look. Even if we can't do as much as we could with NBA 2K14 and earlier games, perhaps we could find a way to do more than what appears to be possible now.

It may be more complicated than is ideal, but then that was the case with NBA 2K9, not to mention NBA Live 95 all those years ago. Sometimes, it's taken a few years for games to be as modder-friendly as we'd like them to be. But like I said, maybe some of those resources are worth a second look. They might contain a few clues that could help us work something out.

Wish there was a like button. Good post. I knew that about Vlad approaching 2k, but did not think about the reason for the file format change. That does make more sense.

I still stand by the rest of my post, but you at least provide some good explanations. I know Leftos had a roster editor before Vlad but didn't remember Jao having one. But yes good ideas. Wish I had the time and the know how to try some of your techniques myself.

[Dee4Three]

Again, Vlad approached 2K, not the other way around. The file format changed because the year that Vlad was hired by 2K was also the year that we got a port of the PS4/X1 version for the first time. Had we continued to get a 360/PS3 port, chances are the game would still be as moddable and a lot of old patches compatible, but then we'd be missing out on a lot of the enhancements (and post-release support) that the PS4/X1 version receives.

For what it's worth, I've sent in some detailed feedback on how the game could be more modder-friendly. It never hurts to ask for these things, after all. What are the chances it happens? I don't know; regardless of how 2K truly feels about modding - and we obviously have to agree to disagree there - it may not be feasible, or at least not a high priority, because the PC represents a very small portion of the userbase. But I'd rather give it a shot, see if some of those suggestions can be implemented moving forward.

In the meantime, I have to wonder if there are any options that have remained unexplored. Is there anything else we can be doing with the cheat engine, for example? My understanding is that console users have made some creative custom rosters on PS4 and X1, using just the in-game tools (like Create-a-Player). Since we have the ability to externally modify files to some extent, surely we can do more with the PC version. We may not have a couple of our best modding minds active in the scene anymore, but they've left us with tools and tutorials. Can any of the techniques that JaoSming in particular has described be put to use to find ways of modding NBA 2K16 more deeply? I seem to remember him coming out with some roster editing stuff before RED MC was released for NBA 2K14. Some of that stuff might be worth a second look. Even if we can't do as much as we could with NBA 2K14 and earlier games, perhaps we could find a way to do more than what appears to be possible now.

It may be more complicated than is ideal, but then that was the case with NBA 2K9, not to mention NBA Live 95 all those years ago. Sometimes, it's taken a few years for games to be as modder-friendly as we'd like them to be. But like I said, maybe some of those resources are worth a second look. They might contain a few clues that could help us work something out.

What's weird is that one person has already made roster mods but refuses to release them because of his irrational fear that 2K will drop the hammer on him and because he's still waiting on greg to finish the roster editor.

Far from irrational. I have many in the community who agree with me not releasing those two rosters. Please be mature about it. I'll remove those threads I made if its an eye sore to look at them. I am trying to do the right thing and not potentionaly mess up modding for the rest of us. Its not worth it.

[Dee4Three]

2K wins

2K won the moment that took Vlad and Leftos from us.

For what it's worth, Vlad approached them, and not the other way around. Seeing what Leftos has done with MyGM and MyLEAGUE, I would suggest that having him on the development team has certainly been to the game's benefit.

And that's what it comes down to. They've hired people from the community who can do great things in an official capacity, to make the game better.

It isn't to shut down the modding community.

If they wanted to shut down the modding community, all they'd need to do is send us a cease and desist, because have the grounds to do so if they wanted to go down that road. It'd be much cheaper and easier than organising visas and paying people's annual salaries.

All due respect Andrew, I can't disagree more on almost all points. You're ignoring so much , I think there is CONSIDERABLE evidence for us i nthe community to be leery of 2K and its motives.


I can't speak to Leftos recent work on NBA 2K, people seem to be enjoying the features you mentioned, but what really does he do for them that any number of others couldn't do? They hired a programmer to consult them on their game modes? I believe the theory, yes only a theory, that Leftos was hired primarily because he was one of the few people on here, or anywhere, who showed the ability to literally crack open the game at the core level, as well as make some great tools.

2K may be well and good with customers making some fun visual mods to keep them occupied, but we all know they have no interest in having a game so customizable that people are able to make a superior product to what they are putting out and selling each year. Cyberface mods, fine. Things like Ultimate Base Roster, Or Ultimate Roster Basem or the guy actually editing animations? That's where they get off board. Even HAWK even mentioned months ago that he was contacted by 2K. Now why could that be? Are they going to have him do roster updates? Or is there another reason?

Which brings me to the legendary Vlad who's editor basically made all of it possible. I think the Vlad hiring is the one people hold such bitterness with. Over the fact that Vlad is hired, and immediately NBA 2K becomes relatively unmoddable. After all the lip service initially about how his hiring could mean new opportunities for modding 2K. We know deep down he wasn't hired with that intention, despite what he may have been led to believe, to bridge some kind of gap between 2K and the PC Modding community. What have they done with him besides take away from us?

And finally, all the cease and desist letters in the world wouldn't "shut down the modding community". The modding community, as various sports games and otherwise have proven, is bigger than any one website, as great as NLSC is.

I'd love for it to be proven otherwise, but until then the evidence points to predatory behavior by 2K, and a real dry spell for the next gen modding community.

Verdict: 2K Sports = Guilty

Right. And this is why it scares me. They are moving so heavy into DLC which is a huge driving force of income. So many people buy VC etc to obtain hidden players. Why in the world would they want someone like me, or anybody else here, releasing all of them offline?

I explained the TMAC thing on another thread. I don't want us to lose the ability to mod.

[TBM]

Some serious tinfoil hat action ITT.

[Dee4Three]

Some serious tinfoil hat action ITT.

Only jerks use the term 'tin foil hat". We are having a realistic conversation about modding NBA 2k. About the drop off in it, as well as talk about 2ks strategy. Its like when someone dares to question an "official" story, they are automatically called someone who wears a tin foil hat or is labeled a conspiracy theorist.

TBM, grow up .

[Jonny2k]

Some serious tinfoil hat action ITT.

Ain't that the truth. It's like if the 2010 roster by jubba and smithers doesn't exist...

[Dee4Three]

Question: Has anybody figured out how to adjust the camera angle in blender? I saw someone posting a new "Broadcast view" for MSG, which has me thinking... Two of the camera views they use during free throws, I'd like to make a closer view. Is this possible in blender? Has anyone tried it?

I have the most recent version of Blender, if someone can give me the basics on how to get started that would be awesome.

Thanks!

[TBM]

What do camera angles have to do with Blender?

[Dee4Three]

What do camera angles have to do with Blender?

I thought they could be adjusted in there. Obviously I don't know what I'm talking about... How do people adjust them?

Its not something I've ever tried before

[TBM]

Cheat Engine, or for basic stuff, just the in-game camera angle editor.