Is there a reason for war?

by **JOSEPATCHES** on Fri Mar 21, 2003 4:23 am

War can´t be the answer to anytning.Who can stop Saddam?I think that he was stopped very well last weeks.The inspectors of the UN was agree with the work of Irak to destroy the armaments.
Only the stupid presidents of USA,Spain and England wanted the war and it was a problem the cooperation of Irak.
Do you really think that they gave all the chances to the peace?
No.
There is nothing more important than life.Does anyone know how many inocents die in Afganistan?A lot of more than the people of the Twin Towers and Bin Laden is still alive.War is not the answer to anything.

Why these presidents don´t like "Imagine" ?

by **Tony** on Fri Mar 21, 2003 7:36 am

by **EGarrett** on Fri Mar 21, 2003 10:06 am

War can´t be the answer to anytning.Who can stop Saddam?I think that he was stopped very well last weeks.The inspectors of the UN was agree with the work of Irak to destroy the armaments.
Only the stupid presidents of USA,Spain and England wanted the war and it was a problem the cooperation of Irak.
Do you really think that they gave all the chances to the peace?
No.
There is nothing more important than life.Does anyone know how many inocents die in Afganistan?A lot of more than the people of the Twin Towers and Bin Laden is still alive.War is not the answer to anything.

Why these presidents don´t like "Imagine" ?

I want you to research World War II...particularly the practice of appeasement and how it applied to Hitler.

Nobody likes war...but yes...sometimes it is necessary.

by **f.t.w.** on Fri Mar 21, 2003 11:08 am

I dig what youre saying EG, but what bugs me is that Hitler didn't have a feud going with Roosevelt's father, and Germany isn't the second-largest oil-producing country in its region.

its not that I think Saddam is a great guy. Its just that 9/11 or not, I've seen no compelling evidence of a clear and present danger represented by Iraq, the Bush administration is secretive, and the whole freakin thing reeks of Imperialism and/or holy war.

by **EGarrett** on Fri Mar 21, 2003 9:15 pm

Hussein has presided over the execution of his political opponents. His regime (and he himself) have tortured people who speak out against him. He surrounds his compounds with chained women and children in order to deter attack. He attempted to take over Kuwait in the early 90's. He's been stockpiling illegal chemical and biological weapons for years.

What do you think he might do if he gets enough of them? He may use them on Kuwait...or someone else nearby. He's violated the most basic concepts of human rights and clearly has no regard for the well-being or lives of others. Do you want someone who regularly tortures and kills his own citizens...and who hates the United States...to have the power to kill millions?

No one is saying he poses the same threat that Hitler did. This is more like a smaller version of the same situation. Then again...there are weapons of mass destruction today that can give individuals far more power than they ever had. It's probably best that we do something instead of waiting for him to do whatever it is he's planning with those weapons he's making...

by **f.t.w.** on Sat Mar 22, 2003 3:00 am

I understand your point. I have a more difficult time believing the cryptic information released by the US to which you refer. It would be like shooting fish in a barrel to pick a supposedly unstable regime with dangerous military capability, why Iraq, and why in such a hurry?

the coalition's stance undermines fifty years of international peace-keeping and cooperation. Why couldn't Powell lead Blix and the boys to one of these mysterious weopon-of-mass-destruction transports that is supposedly driving around Iraq to elude inspectors? Why after 12 years of ambivelance is the time so damn ripe that the coalition forces have to race in like frat boys to the bathroom at Bennigans?

I don't like bush. i don't like how he came to power. i don't like how he trots around the globe pretending to liberate people that are ignored once bush's 'evil' enemies are toppled from power. I don't like seeing the government legislate to remove my constitution-given civel liberties in the name of national security. I don't want to be attacked by terrorists, but i'll let them fly an airliner into me before i succumb to bush's totalitarian fantasy-world.

by **Mazorca** on Sat Mar 22, 2003 3:47 am

Ben, do you really know that inocents from Iraq, Australia, UK and US are gonna die? And if you know, do you agree with it?
Any live must be lost for any good reason.
I hate Hussein, for sure. But your president (and I still don't know if he was really elected, not even him) can't decide everything about the world.
He said that this war wasn't about oil; it's becouse of the political system in Iraq and for this country don't respect ONU's resolution. And what is he doing now? Is ONU supporting this attack? About politic: Saddam is a dictator, of course, but he was elected by Iraq population. And you probably know that USA, specially the republicans (I'm not condemning its electors), have always sponsored dictatorships around the world; the ones that was good for them. And I know that exist evidences of it, at least about what happened in Brazil in 1964 until 1984, a dictatorship.
And you must know that US was the country that gave Saddam his weapons, right.
I believe that Bush should try to solve american problems - and they are increaseing - instead of kill inocents.

God bless you and peace to everyone!

by **Rens** on Sat Mar 22, 2003 4:33 am

Mazorca wrote:About politic: Saddam is a dictator, of course, but he was elected by Iraq population.

Only because there wasn't any opposition.

by **Colin** on Sat Mar 22, 2003 5:18 am

Dan Gadzuric wrote:
Mazorca wrote:About politic: Saddam is a dictator, of course, but he was elected by Iraq population.

Only because there wasn't any opposition.

He was the only ballot option, it said 'do you want saddam, yes or no' and the people were voting had an army member with a gun pointed at them while they were voting to make sure they voted right.

by **EGarrett** on Sat Mar 22, 2003 8:14 am

I understand your point. I have a more difficult time believing the cryptic information released by the US to which you refer. It would be like shooting fish in a barrel to pick a supposedly unstable regime with dangerous military capability, why Iraq, and why in such a hurry?

You have to start somewhere. Hussein is the most visible enemy of the United States (next to you-know-who) who has been stockpiling illegal inhumane weapons for years.

the coalition's stance undermines fifty years of international peace-keeping and cooperation.

If Hussein isn't following UN laws...then how is that cooperation?

I don't like bush. i don't like how he came to power.

I didn't vote for Bush...and I don't like the way he won. But the way Hussein came to power is a lot worse. Don't lose sight that Hussein is a violent, murderous dictator.

i don't like how he trots around the globe pretending to liberate people that are ignored once bush's 'evil' enemies are toppled from power. I don't like seeing the government legislate to remove my constitution-given civel liberties in the name of national security.

The government was trying to protect you and me from getting killed. If someone is shooting a bank up and you're in it...the police are gonna shove you on the ground and tell you to stay there and cover your head so you don't get shot while they try and stop the shooter. Sometimes you have to take reasonable control of an area...and everyone in that area..in order to stabilize a crisis situation...same principle.

I don't want to be attacked by terrorists, but i'll let them fly an airliner into me before i succumb to bush's totalitarian fantasy-world.

Let's be realistic. Bush is in power right now and it has barely changed your daily life one bit. The alternative is to have been buried alive in the rubble of the World Trade Center. You're losing sight of the difference between Bush...who is someone who's policy you don't like...and Hussein...who is a murderous despot who would gas you to death if he had the chance...

by **f.t.w.** on Sat Mar 22, 2003 9:18 am

I understand that that is what I am supposed to believe. The bush administration's mythic imagery of good versus evil and appeals to my patriotic vanity are wasted.

by **JOSEPATCHES** on Sat Mar 22, 2003 9:38 am

How can be compare Saddam with Hitler?Saddam is not very dangerous to the world.You only have to see how much time will be spend to destroy him.A week?2 weeks?...
But even if he is the most evil of the world you can´t forget that he was being desarmed by UN.He could destroy his armaments before but that´s not as important to begin a war.
Saddam is a motherfu... but there are more dictators in the world.Why Irak?There is only one reason.
I guess that it´s easy that some people from USA are afraid after the 11S but we can´t kill all the "evils" in the name of the revenge.
The terrorist don´t have country.

YouTube · by **mp3** on Tue Mar 25, 2003 6:24 am

i think this thread belongs on cnn

by **GloveGuy** on Tue Mar 25, 2003 12:28 pm

I haven't been reading much of what you guys have been saying in this topic, but I'm going to put my opinion on the War against the Iraqi government.

I'm anti-war. I do not like war. I did not want this war to happen. I went to numerous protests. Not the one's in Washington DC or in New York City but some in my town and in Boston. But as an American, I'll stand behind the cause. Now that the war is going on, I'll support the soldiers. That's the only thing I can do. It would be wrong for me to not support them even if I do not support war. I hope this makes sense.

I will basically let everyone think what they want. I will not argue with someone who's for war. I let everyone have their own opinion.

One reason I'm not too crazy about the war, is that how Sadaam Hussein is setting up his soldiers in areas where innocent civilians could die. This is not a war on Iraq. This is a war against Saddam Hussein and his followers, his brothers, etc.

There's a lot of things about this war I don't understand. Maybe it has a hidden meaning. I know there are numerous reasons why we are having it even though Bush only states one. I get the feeling that this war could also be about oil. Who know's it could be a personal thing between George W. and Saddam since Saddam has an assasination order on George Sr. There's tons of stuff that we, as a people, don't know about this war and will never know.

Another thing that I do not like is the boycotting of French goods and stuff that some people are doing. That's just ignorant. Just because a country doesn't support war and because their leaders have a different opinion, doesn't mean you should hurt the others of the country, just because they have a different opinion than you do.

But I'll say it again: I'm not for war. But I am for what the troops are doing and I do believe that Saddam Hussein should be abolished.

by **TheBob** on Wed Mar 26, 2003 4:23 am

gloveguy wrote:
I get the feeling that this war could also be about oil.

really?

by **Brave Sir Rubin** on Wed Mar 26, 2003 5:58 am

just a couple of short comments...

1)saddam does have chemical weapons...he himself has admitted it saying that he will attack US soldiers with them if they enter Baghdad...so the US was right...the war is here for a reason...Saddam lied...

2)the US does have the power to do whatever it pleases to do...it's not a matter of right or wrong...it's a matter of the US's best interest

3) even if this war is about OIL and the US does gain control of some of Iraq's OIL...think about this, US citizens, all gas prices will go down...this war will benefit you!

4)Iraq supplies terrorists with weapons/money...enough of a reason to attack them

5)Saddam tortures and kills his own people...another good reason (not strong enough to base an attack on though)

6)Iraq poses a threat to both the US and Israel, and as a citizen of Isreal, knowing that the disarment of Iraq would save my country from terrorist attacks...i support the US %100 percent in this war and in all of their decisions...

7)War requires casualties...but i'm sure that if this war wouldn't have been started, terrorist attacks would have taken much more US/Isreali/European casualities...

8)the major political leaders in the US, G.B., Australia, and Spain have decided that this war in necessary...believe me, those people are not idiots...

well...that's all...

I hope this war ends as quickly as posible and as little coalition troops die...

by **Mazorca** on Wed Mar 26, 2003 6:07 am

Hei gloveguy, you are completelly right. You were (are) against the war, but once it starts, you must want the victory. And the war is about oil and personal reasons; no doubt about it. All the "possibles" reasons showed by Bush hadn't any foundation.

I have a question to you, americans. What is the television showing to you about the war? I say that because here, in Brasil, we have a jornalist who wrote a book about how the american press cover the Golf War (1991) and september eleventh. They didn´t show all the truth and I believe that it could be happening again.

Once again, God bless you and peace to everyone.

by **Mazorca** on Wed Mar 26, 2003 6:11 am

colin826 wrote:
Dan Gadzuric wrote:
Mazorca wrote:About politic: Saddam is a dictator, of course, but he was elected by Iraq population.

Only because there wasn't any opposition.
He was the only ballot option, it said 'do you want saddam, yes or no' and the people were voting had an army member with a gun pointed at them while they were voting to make sure they voted right.

I do know all of that. My sentence was just a provocation around the results of last president election in US.

by **Mazorca** on Wed Mar 26, 2003 6:21 am

6)Iraq poses a threat to both the US and Israel, and as a citizen of Isreal, knowing that the disarment of Iraq would save my country from terrorist attacks...i support the US %100 percent in this war and in all of their decisions...

Brave Sir Rubin,

How can you say anything about terrorists attacks against Israel if your country massacres Palestine - unrespecting ONU - and your president is a neo-nazist? Of course you are pro USA. They give the weapons to Sharon and this way he can kill palestinian.

And arabian people are not terrorists. Only a very little part of them are.

by **Brave Sir Rubin** on Wed Mar 26, 2003 9:22 am

stop watching CNN...you yourself say that the American television doesn't show the complete truth...stop basing your opinions on thier showing..

massacres Palestine

lol...the only palestinians we have killed are either Hamas members (terrorists), thier family members (if they were with the Hamas member) and possible suicide bobmbers...while they have ONLY and i repeat ONLY killed innocent civilians...having suicide bombers explode in SCHOOL BUSES, College campuses, Discos and other public places...killing hundreds opon hundreds of innocent civilians...many of whom are kids...

and your president is a neo-nazist

Neo-Nazist? wtf? i would like toi see you support that statement...you bloody idiot...

They give the weapons to Sharon and this way he can kill palestinian.

dear idiot...think before you write.....the US have never given Sharon any weapons...the US do help Isreal, when isreal are in an official war...which hasn't happened in a couple of years...

And arabian people are not terrorists. Only a very little part of them are.

you don't say......yet, all the terrorists that threaten the US, Isreal and other nations are muslim arabs......

and some friendly advice...next time state facts instead of pointless bullshit....

by **TheBob** on Wed Mar 26, 2003 11:14 am

First of all, calm down Pavel, there's no need for name calling. Second of all...

Brave Sir Rubin wrote: yet, all the terrorists that threaten the US, Isreal and other nations are muslim arabs......

Timothy McVeigh, Eric Harris, Dylan Klebold, Richard Reid, Ted Kazynski, David Copeland, Stuart Kerr, Fazul Abdullah Mohammed....do I need to go on? Try not to be so ignorant and racist in the future...

by **Brave Sir Rubin** on Wed Mar 26, 2003 11:24 am

i mean terrorists right now silly....

these guys didn't do a bloody thing in years...

and me being ignorant? lol...

by **scubilete** on Wed Mar 26, 2003 12:36 pm

Mazorca wrote:I have a question to you, americans. What is the television showing to you about the war? I say that because here, in Brasil, we have a jornalist who wrote a book about how the american press cover the Golf War (1991) and september eleventh. They didn´t show all the truth and I believe that it could be happening again.

Obviously I believe everyone has a different opinion of war, everyone shows what is convenient for themselves but now I would say this: Your journalist could be a lier who wrote a book based on how the american press cover the Golf War & Sept. 11th, What the hell do you want the Press to say when I lived both of them and I saw it with my eyes, do you think this is press? Maybe the Towers are still there and the american press made them disappear, is that what you or your journalist is saying?.

If we watch tv, we just do like you do, I personally don't watch CNN but if I do, I'm going to watch the same thing, shooting, bombing, soldiers being captured & tortured from either side, what is that truth you are talking about? Sadam wanted CNN in 91, he got his ass kicked with all the CNN reporters, that's what you saw if you watched it, if your journalist watched it better than us, then he should say the truth he's talking about not start saying that the Press here doesn't say the complete truth, they just show what is on our interests, if it is gold, gold we get, if it is oil, oil we get, if it's sadam ass kicked, that's what we will get.

US went to war in 91 to take Sadam out of Kuwait who were invaded by him and that's what they did, if it was oil or gold, that's your opinion. They don't have a Simon Bolivar going all over trying to defend their land, so they have other countries who care what is going on there. I really feel angry US gets in so many trouble trying to defend others but that's how it is, as a leader nation, that's what they do. Cause they defend Israel?, then what is it cause obviously is not Gold or Oil?, is it that US is nazy like you mentioned the israeli pres is? Plus, Israel massacres Palestina?, Now I do believe your tv is showing just what is convenient for yourself. Go and ask that Journalist to write about the truth of Palestina and tell me what he will say.

by **TheBob** on Wed Mar 26, 2003 1:03 pm

Brave Sir Rubin wrote:i mean terrorists right now silly....

these guys didn't do a bloody thing in years...

All these guys have commited terrorist acts in the past 10 years, several of them have in the last 3 or 4 years. That's not a long time ago, if non-arab, non-muslim terrorits existed a few years ago they sure as hell still exist today. Btw Fazul Abdullah Mohammed is still on the FBI's most wanted list, Richard Reid was active around the time of 9/11(that's less than 2 years ago), and finally David Copeland and Stuart Kerr were active 3 years ago.

Brave Sir Rubin wrote:and me being ignorant? lol...

Unfortunatly it's not really funny. It's sad when we've reached a point in our society where people can be so brain washed as to believe that one single ehtnic origin is the source of all important terrorism all over the world.

by **Stevan** on Wed Mar 26, 2003 2:04 pm

the US, G.B., Australia, and Spain have decided that this war in necessary...believe me, those people are not idiots...

Yes they are Pavel.

Is there a reason for war?

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