Flopping to be punished

[Laxation]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3416579

The NBA announced to its teams this week at its annual pre-draft camp that fines will be imposed on players starting next season for clear cases of "flopping,"

NBA executive vice president of basketball operations Stu Jackson confirmed the new policy Wednesday night saying: "What was clearly expressed to the committee is that we would begin imposing fines next season for the most egregious type of flops. When players are taking a dive, for lack of a better term."

I just came.

[[Q]]

you know, I can appreciate the art of flopping (used sparringly) as a defensive tool but some players like Ginobili & Oberto take it over the top. I think it'll be hard to regulate this rule consitently.

[Laxation]

Why do you think it will be hard to regulate?

They go over the tape after the game - so they have time to review the plays in question and determine them that way. The decisions aren't made spur of the moment - and I think will be the most regulated and consistent rule in the NBA just on that regard.

[JT_55]

I can just picture the headlines: "Massive influx of NBA players quit to join Hollywood".

[[Q]]

I feel guys that unfairly get reputations for being floppers (like Vlade Divac. He had to defend Shaq every year for crying out loud) will be punished as well. Just like my theories of "bad boys" like Rasheed & Artest getting techs because of their reputation.

[Laxation]

Right now, I dont think there are ANY unfair reputations for floppers.

Ginobilli, Kurt Thomas, Bowen, Raja Bell, Varejao - are any of their reputations gained unfairly?

[-Young Buck-]

This is great news. Now maybe players will actually try to play some D instead of flopping trying to gain an advantage that they dont have. Also hope they use it on offense too. Ginobili and Rip are good cases of offensive flopping. Just look at tonights game, Rip grabbed into Ray Allen, then jumped like he got hit when Ray didnt make any contact, yet Ray was called for the foul. The "acting" part of the game has gone too far.

[[Q]]

I don't think Bowen & Bell are "floppers" in the same category as Ginobili, but I'm sure they do it once in a while to be considered top one-on-one defeners. You didn't mention Shane Battier. He is a good defensive player as well and I'm sure he tries to draw charges frequently so he has to flop some time. Derek Fisher's also one of those guys that draw charges well but flop to get more calls.

[Laxation]

(theyre not) in the same category as Ginobili

Your point?

[Impakt]

I see a drop in Ginoboli's numbers next season.

[JaoSming]

I see Manu filing for bankruptcy.

[Jing]

LOL Tony Allen's like "you ain't drawing this foul on me". He just leans back and Manu falls on his ass. Doesn't look like Ginobili touched ALlen at all, and if anything, his right elbow may have actually got tony's chin.

This reminds me of like 2 years ago where Mobley was backing down Dahntay Jones and Jones just stepped back and Mobley busted his ass without Jones even touching him.

[shadowgrin]

Manu's game would be relegated as a spot-up shooter. No more driving to the basket. He's going to be like Peja.

[The X]

Jao, you could argue that isn't a flop, it's just an ill-advised leaner. Of course we all know that he was trying to draw contact.

One thing I would like to see included in the flopping is stopping offensive players deliberately jumping into defenders that have left their feet. They'll jump sideways & throw up a crazy shot & always get the call. That's one part of the game I've never liked. I know defender shouldn't leave his feet in first place, but don't do a Reggie. This rule isn't restricted to the Manu's of the World, but to most of the star players in the league. I hate this more than flopping. Then again, it is in a form of flopping in my eyes.

[Sauru]

thats even worse than flopping imo, when a player jumps in the air and the offensive player actually jumps into him, they need to make that an offensive foul.

anyway if they truely regulate this rule and dont just put it out there so they can fine people once in a great while then this will be good, i dont see it really being that much of an impact though, people like manu wont change thier game as i dont see the fines being handed out too often over this one

[Dan's Brain]

It'll probably be like the zero-tolerance technical thing of 2 years ago. They'll go beserk in the first month, then back it off a bit once players start to get the idea.

[Patr1ck]

They'll jump sideways & throw up a crazy shot & always get the call. That's one part of the game I've never liked. I know defender shouldn't leave his feet in first place, but don't do a Reggie.

So they should jump directly into them instead of to the side? It's an offensive mentality to do that. You know you are going to get hit, you want to get the shot off. The offensive player should not be penalized for faking out the defense.

[Alejandrov011]

As some can see the most "floppers" are international players like Varejao, Divac, Manu, Oberto...

What happens is that in the FIBA basket is so common to flop that is a defensive tool!

I can say that cause i play in my club in Argentina and I am a more defensive minded player and i use to flop when it counts and the other team doesn´t argue the call sometimes.

But the referee sometimes warns you, if you flop so bad again you will get a technical

[Sauru]

They'll jump sideways & throw up a crazy shot & always get the call. That's one part of the game I've never liked. I know defender shouldn't leave his feet in first place, but don't do a Reggie.

So they should jump directly into them instead of to the side? It's an offensive mentality to do that. You know you are going to get hit, you want to get the shot off. The offensive player should not be penalized for faking out the defense.

when a defender jumps towards a player thats one thing, its when a player jumps straight up and comes straight down and gets called for the foul. its my opinion that if a player goes straight up and down then thats his spot and if the offensive player jumps into him he should be called for the foul.

[The X]

They'll jump sideways & throw up a crazy shot & always get the call. That's one part of the game I've never liked. I know defender shouldn't leave his feet in first place, but don't do a Reggie.

when a defender jumps towards a player thats one thing, its when a player jumps straight up and comes straight down and gets called for the foul. its my opinion that if a player goes straight up and down then thats his spot and if the offensive player jumps into him he should be called for the foul.

So they should jump directly into them instead of to the side? It's an offensive mentality to do that. You know you are going to get hit, you want to get the shot off. The offensive player should not be penalized for faking out the defense.

I'd agree, if the defender is jumping towards the player, then yes, he is entering the offensive player's space that he already had, obvious foul. But say Richard Hamilton puts up a fake, Tony Allen jumps straight up in the air & then Rip decide rather than drive around him, take one step to side & shoot open shot, Rip decides he'll deliberately jump into him just to get a foul. For me, it isn't in the spirit of the game, & I hate it. And the fact is that all players do it. I'd like to see them starting to call offensive fouls on it, even though I don't think it will ever happen. That's why I'm not going to get too excited about the new flopping laws, unless they incorporate this.

[[Q]]

I agree with you guys on the whole offesive drawing a foul thing, and seems like players are exploiting the referees' tendency to call those fouls.

as far as defensive flopping though, one man's charge is another man's flop i say.

[Patr1ck]

I like the way you explained it. Maybe they shouldn't call a foul in that situation. Just let the shooter hammer himself on the falling defender.

[Lamrock]

It is a sad, sad day for the Spurs.

[Angelo]

Hehehehe i think it is much better if they would just call a foul only if a player has a blood of his face..

But anyways that rule would be good for some players like rip and manu

[Andrew]

It's great to see the NBA acknowledging the situation and that they want to do something about it but I'm not sure how effective the fines will be. Unless there's actually a change in the approach to calling fouls when a player flops, fines might not be a big enough deterrent. Sure, having to cough up an as yet unannounced amount of money might make players think twice but if a flop can save a big game - and it's still going to get the call - then I think we'll see players willing to pay the price. Reviewing the tape will allow a punishment to be handed down but if the call has been made in the flopper's favour, then the damage has already been done.

One thing I would like to see included in the flopping is stopping offensive players deliberately jumping into defenders that have left their feet. They'll jump sideways & throw up a crazy shot & always get the call. That's one part of the game I've never liked. I know defender shouldn't leave his feet in first place, but don't do a Reggie. This rule isn't restricted to the Manu's of the World, but to most of the star players in the league. I hate this more than flopping. Then again, it is in a form of flopping in my eyes.

There's nothing wrong with drawing contact from the defender in principle but I agree that those calls are cheap, since it's the offensive player creating the contact. I'd rather see a non-call in those situations as I think that would be punishment enough. I'd include the practice of players dropping their shoulder into a defensive player while driving to the basket to draw the soft and-one call in this category as well. If the offensive player is the one doing the bumping, initiating the contact and/or dropping their shoulder, it should be a non-call if not an offensive foul.

But again, fines aren't the answer there. It has to be the actual approach to making those calls.