Stockton or Malone?

[Jackal]

Hmm, not many topics going around, so I decided to just make one.

Ok, topic. Stockton or Malone?

Both in their primes, both players putting up solid numbers together. You know of them, you've heard of them. Who do you pick? Who made who better?

Hmm, in this day and age I'd pick Malone, size + a nice jumper. Big-men are always welcome right?

But, Stockton has the ability to make anyone look like a better player, a la Jason Kidd just more passing. Hmmm, having him on the team wouldn't hurt either.

I'd go with Stockton. His passing abilities > Malone.

Who made who better? Did Malone make Stockton better or did Stockton make Malone better?

My answer is that Stockton made Malone a better player.

Any thoughts?

[Jay-Peso]

I'd agree.

Stockton did make Malone a better player by giving him some great passes for easy scores.

[J@3]

I'd pick Stockton due to the fact that it's alot more rare to find a PG of his abilities. I think with Malone, had he retired 6 years or so ago, like most PF's would've, his legacy wouldn't be as great as it is. It'd still be up there, but not to the extent because he's carried on putting up good numbers over such a long period of time. When you look at guys like Amare Stoudemire averaging 20 and 10 at such a young age, it kind of makes you think that with a player like Stockton it wouldn't be difficult for him to post the same sort of numbers as Malone, or even surpass them.

[FanOfAll]

Stockon for reasons already stated.

[ATTENTIONWHORE]

Stockton...he was just damn good at getting the pass just right...

[Alcoholic]

With the question Stockton or Malone, I'd go with Malone. He's big, he has range, he's capable of running, and is a solid passer.

Now on who made who better, Stockton made Malone better. Reasons stated above.

[Amphatoast]

i'd go with stockton.. he created the plays for malone and malone just finished them

[magius]

no brainer. stockton.

[j.23]

stockton just for his pass first mentality.. it's a rarity to find a point guard like that nowadays.. and his fg% as a guard was simply outstanding too; he could hit the open shot when he had to

[magius]

except when the championship was on the line sorry, couldnt resist. stockton rocks.

[Fresh8]

No-brainer!!!

Stockton definately... he's probably one of the rare players- as the guard who would get the nod as making his counterpart better...

[Andrew]

I still think it's a bit "chicken or the egg?" when it comes to asking who made whom better. Malone certainly benefited from Stockton's passing skills, but would Stock's assist numbers have been so high had he not been playing with such a capable scorer? Would Stock have been able to run such effective pick and roll plays without Malone setting the picks? Maybe, maybe not. Maybe the Mailman wouldn't be second on the career leaders in points if he didn't have such an unselfish player who could handle the ball as well as Stockton feeding him the ball for over a decade.

I think I'd have to pick Stockton. Talented swingmen are easy to find, but good big men and point guards like Stock aren't quite as common. It's amazing that both Stockton and Malone went as low as they did in their respective drafts. I think you could find a strong, talented power forward a little easier than a true point guard like Stockton, so he would be my choice. A tough choice though, because it's always difficult to pick against a player like Karl Malone.

[Fresh8]

It's amazing that both Stockton and Malone went as low as they did in their respective drafts.

I think both were unknown prospects...therefore dropping so low. Well...if the draft was done again, I'm sure both would definately be Top 3 picks in their drafts...

[Andrew]

It was certainly a sign of the times. Players with their talent would not go unnoticed these days and as you noted, were the 1984 and 1985 drafts held again there's no way they wouldn't be top ten.

[air gordon]

maybe it's concidence...

as hard as it is to find a player with 'pure' point guard skills like stockton, in recent nba history, having a pure point is not a prerequisite for the larry o'brien trophy

since the piston championship team of 1990, the point guards of the nba champs, for the most part, weren't exactly floor generals or big time superstars:
paxson/armstrong
k smith/a young but still ugly cassell
harper
avery johnson
derek fisher
parker
billups

another trend as well is that in that same period, the nba champs #1 scoring option was in the paint with the bulls and this year's pistons being the exceptions. although you can make a point of jordan being post player. but that's for another discussion.

perhaps this logic is flawed, but i'm going to give the mailman the nod here.

[twolvezfanfoever]

Malone doesn't have that many points wit Stockton cuz they had they ESP goin for them.Stockton knew when to pass so Mailman could get his dunk or favorite Jumpshot.

[Andrew]

maybe it's concidence...

as hard as it is to find a player with 'pure' point guard skills like stockton, in recent nba history, having a pure point is not a prerequisite for the larry o'brien trophy

perhaps this logic is flawed, but i'm going to give the mailman the nod here.

Actually that is a good point, one that never occurred to me. But most of the players that you mentioned were unselfish and accepted a role in which they were not usually the centre of attention on offense (with the exception of Billups in the 2004 Finals series), two traits that Stockton possesed.

[air gordon]

haha they are bound to share the some traits, after all they all are point guards.

Malone doesn't have that many points wit Stockton cuz they had they ESP goin for them.Stockton knew when to pass so Mailman could get his dunk or favorite Jumpshot.

and who's to say malone would not have thrived in a different system with a different pg? i think it's safe to say, or you can go ahead and ask someone like Robby, that malone could get points on his own w/o the picknroll

[Robby]

Well, as someone who has watched countless Jazz games, my answer would be 50-50. Without a doubt Stockton created plays for Malone, but Malone returned the favor as well.

A great example that comes to mind is Game 6 in 1997 in Houston when Stockton hit the three to get Utah into the finals. That is arguably John's greatest moment but most people don't realize or know that it was Karl Malone who set a "nice" pick on Drexler to get Stockton a wide open shot.

And if you watch Jazz games, both players' effectiveness goes down when the other isn't playing with them. Interestingly, Stockton had a great first couple of seasons while backing up Ricky Green while Malone was making a great strides while playing with Green the first few years in Utah. Personally, I think both would have become great players without each other but their numbers wouldn't have been as high as they are now. Malone's career would have been similar to Patrick Ewing's while Stockton's career probably would have been a combination of Mark Jackson and Mark Price. Together, however, they made each much better. The only other duo in NBA history that came close to doing the same thing was the Jordan-Pippen tandem.

[Carlos Boozer]

fifty fifty.
They both are decent gameplayers who made theirselves better in every single game.

[Andrew]

haha they are bound to share the some traits, after all they all are point guards.

True again, though Harper was a shooting guard playing out of position and Billups has also spent time at shooting guard earlier in his career. But you are absolutely right - an All-Star player who is also a pure point guard does not guarantee a title.

[Homer]

.

[FanOfAll]

Oh come on guys, you can't take "50-50"! You can't split both in half and take a half of each .

[eli]

he right 50-50

stockton passes...malone scores.....

[Sauru]

couple of things here. first of all it was easy to slip in the 84 draft as it was imo the greatest draft class ever. so many hall fo famers from a single draft is unheard of, thats not even counting the all star games from this class.

secondly i would pick stockton for 1 simple reason. he was the best ever true point guard. he did what he did and he did it far better than anyone else. some might come here and post that magic was the better point guard. i will say he was definetly the better player but when it comes down to what a pointguards job is supposed to be i will forever stand by my statement that stockton is hands down the best. just look at all the jazz players that were doing really good, then they moved on, and suddenly they sucked. stockton made you better than you were, and that is damn rare.