Article on Vince Carter (a little long)

by **fgrep15** on Sat Feb 21, 2004 8:23 am

Comfort Zone
by Ric Bucher
ESPN The Magazine
Monday, January 19

Photo shoot over, Vince Carter is bundling up for the frigid Toronto air this mid-January afternoon when he notices some Polaroids on the studio's blond-wood table. They're all of him, a rough draft of what
the photographer had in mind. One in particular stops him. Staring out is a preview of when his playing days are long over, dim light and shadows conspiring to make Carter appear twice his about-to-turn 27 years. And the smile is not his trademark toothy, 500-watt
version, but a weary old-man-on-a-park-bench grin.

It's no stretch to imagine slippered feet and a slight paunch below the photo's bottom frame. Half-man, half-a-grazing.

Carter isn't ready to hang 'em up yet, of course. He still toys with the idea of entering one more dunk contest, firm in the belief he has a few more aerial wonders to perform. Nor has he abandoned the idea of winning a ring. But having already been feted as the Next Coming, and subsequently dismissed as the Latest Disappointment, he'll work off his own definition of success from here on out, thank you very much. It's a definition that includes walking in his college graduation in Chapel Hill. And getting engaged to his
college sweetheart, former Tar Heels cheerleader Ellen Rucker. And having kids and being able to play with them, pain-free.

And it includes loving that he gets to play basketball for a living. Here's what it doesn't include: going for a few more dunks if it means risking his knees, or a few more wins if it means playing in pain, or declaring his team's superiority and then backing it up. Because he's tried all that. Playing hurt only earned him ridicule, and a bad right knee that came out of favoring the left one, and then a bad left ankle from favoring the right knee. Speaking up made
him look foolish, because the Raptors didn't back up his playoff vow two years ago until after Vince called it a season and underwent knee surgery. And none of it got him closer to a ring.

"You can spend the rest of your life trying to please everybody and forget about who you are," Carter says. "But it's a conflict of interests. You start to worry about the wrong thing, and then you lose focus of the big picture, which is playing basketball. ...this job because of what I can do, and I'm going to do it. If you don't like it, I'm sorry. I hope you change your mind."

Then again, maybe you're one of those who made him the top All-Star vote-getter for the fourth time in five years (Kobe was tops in '03). That's a level of popularity attained only twice before, by Dr. J and Michael Jordan. Fans don't seem to care that he's four
years removed from winning the 2000 dunk contest and nearly three away from that epic playoff battle of 50-point performances with Allen Iverson. Or that he has no championship ring or scoring title.
Maybe it's because he has no arrest record or illegitimate children,either.

"I'm trying to figure it out like everyone else," he says of his All-Star reign. "To me, popular is Allen Iverson. He's the guy I'd expect to lead in votes. I don't know the how and why, but I smile every night when I think about it."

There are others who don't understand it either, only it doesn't tickle them nearly as much. For a middle-of-the-pack team in the East, Carter's next-MJ talent provides the Raptors with an edge that can put them over the top on any given night. But Carter can't be
counted on to put his team on his shoulders. Every possession in the rugged East is as much a chance to wear down the opponent or draw a foul as it is to score a stylish two points. Carter can play that
style, and often does, just not always, which may explain why the Raptors have hovered around .500 all season. With Toronto's fate riding on how much Vinsanity rules, it can drive a coach or teammate
crazy when he appears to downshift, even for a quarter.
Case in point: the Raptors are in Detroit on a Wednesday night in January to face a Pistons team that had won nine in a row, including the last three by an average of 16 points. Vince is in attack modetonight, which means the Pistons can't stop him. He hits three
lay-ups, a pair of driving midrange jumpers and five of seven free throws to carry the Raptors to an 11-point halftime lead.

And then someone else comes out of the dressing room wearing No.15 for the second half. His third-quarter approach consists of off-the-dribble fadeaway jumpers fired early in the shot clock from just inside the arc. If there's a holy trinity of don'ts in the NBA,
that's it. The Pistons roar back. For each VC fling, Toronto coach Kevin O'Neill has a different response. There's the tortured snarl,the pirouette, the head-and-shoulder slump. He gestures to head athletic therapist Chuck Mooney to include the last misfire in the
next day's tape session. Finally, O'Neill outright pleads: "Vince,listen to me, drive it!"
By now, the Raptors' lead is gone, and it's a seesaw game. The real VC makes some cameos. When he attacks, the Pistons send him to the line or double-team him, and when they do he finds an open teammate.
Just like that, the Raptors are ahead again. But when he relies on his jumper, Detroit invariably scores off the long rebound. During a timeout with just under two minutes left, Milt Palacio, Toronto's
backup guard, says, "Vince, you've got to drive." Carter responds, "There's nowhere to go!"

Despite the protest, he tries, and is rewarded with two buckets in the paint. But it's too late. Detroit holds on, 95-91.Neither the process nor the outcome matters to Debbie Bjorgaard and her 11-year-old son, David, sitting six rows behind the Pistons bench. Tonight's tickets are a gift from mother to sonCarter is his favorite player. David is easy to spot among the sea of Pistons fans; he's the one wearing the No.15 Raptors jersey. "It's one of the jerseys I can let my son wear," Debbie says. "He has Kobe's,too, but we've had to put that away."

This is the type of respect Carter craves. And he's even beginning to get it from his current teammates, who are learning to appreciate the way Carter conducts himself. At least he no longer hears that he lacks leadership skills, a frequent refrain from one-season wonders like Keon Clark and over-the-hill veterans like Antonio Davis. (Clark left as a free agent two years ago; Davis is now in Chicago.) Newcomers Jalen Rose and Donyell Marshall are more than happy to share the load with Carter. "When you play against him, you're justworried about his scoring," Rose says. "But he can also dribble,pass and shoot. And I've found out he's a good teammate. He doesn't consider this a one-man show."

Of course, Carter's skills have always been above reproach. It's his heart that's been suspect. The night after the Pistons loss, the Raptors are in New Orleans. Carter takes off for a dunk but comes up
short and lands out of bounds, clutching his right knee. No one on Toronto shows any concern. Even when he's helped to the bench, and then to the locker room, the Raptors go on, business as usual. Morris Peterson, meanwhile, limps around on an ankle that had him on
crutches the night before, logging 39 indispensable minutes in a 78-74 overtime win. "Soldiers don't sit," he says later.

That works for O'Neill, who has hung a "MEN WORKING" sign on the door leading to the Raptors' practice court. But publicly, O'Neill accepts that his star doesn't have a hard-hat mentality. "I just see him as a young player who is still developing," O'Neill says. "The burden of a star can sometimes be overwhelming. Everyone expects you to come through every time. You can't." Carter understands that now. More than that, he's comfortable with it. It doesn't hurt that expectations have slipped. The Raptors,
once dark-horse title contenders, will be lucky to make the playoffs. Carter, the leading scorer on the gold medal-winning 2000 Olympic team, was a prequalifying fill-in last summer for the 2004
squad. His jersey is still a top-20 seller, but it was once one of the top two. Though he still has a signature Nike shoe, LeBron is now clearly the center of Nike's basketball universe. "This is a great position to be in," Carter says. "I don't have to be
considered the best player, I don't have to be the most popular. Being in the middle is great for me."

Heretical as it sounds, Carter will no longer buy into the play-like-there-is-no-tomorrow credo. Play hard? Sure. Chase a title? Super. Destroy your body and forfeit the pleasures of a normal life for the sake of winning, when there's no guarantee that will be enough? No thanks. "The thinking with the doctors and teams is to get you healthy and back on the court," says Michelle Carter, his mother and business manager. "But the great misnomer is 'healthy.' They patch you up. I tell Vince to listen to his body. You're Vince, I say, not invincible."

It would be easier to convince the Carters that their priorities are out of whack had Vince

It's possible the source of Carter's All-Star popularity is
selfishness. Maybe the masses think that, by making sure he's around
All-Star Weekend, there is at least the chance of getting another
demonstration like the one that earned him the half-man,
half-amazing tag. They want to see him hang from the rim by his
elbow after jamming the ball with his entire arm inside the basket,
as he did at the 2000 dunk contest. Could it be that in Carter's
case, the promise of style has trumped the potential of substance?
"If you're starting a team, there are probably eight or nine guys
you'd take ahead of him," Rockets GM Carroll Dawson says. "But this
is a league where athletic ability has moved to the forefront. You
come to watch people do what you can only dream about. And he does
that, maybe better than anybody."
Mom prefers the new Vince precisely because she wants him able to do
what everybody else can. She sees Raptors GM Glen Grunwald hobbling
around on a bad knee, injured after his playing days at Indiana U.
were over, and pities him because he can't play with his
18-month-old son. She sees a different future for her own son. "I
don't want him to live for this moment," she says. "I want him to
live for a moment in 2012."
Similarly, forfeiting a few hours of rest before the seventh game of
the 2001 Eastern Conference semifinals to walk in his graduation
ceremony remains, to this day, a no-brainer.
"I wouldn't trade seeing him come down the stairs in his gown for
all the money in the mint," Mrs. Carter says. And whatever his
scoring average, she doesn't think it can match the value of Vince
personally answering e-mails submitted to his website every few
weeks.
"A lot of people take a guy being genuine and humble for being
soft," Rose says. "That's a mistake. A lot of people want the things
he has, and I like the way he handles them with humility."
Funny how stuff like that can still matter. Djanka, the studio
manager at the photo shoot, knows nothing about basketball, but she
too has an opinion about Carter. "That face," she says sharply,
jabbing at the Polaroids, "will sell a lot of magazines. You know
why? Sincerity. If you've been around this business for a while, you
know what sells. People look at the eyes. They know a good soul when
they see one."
"That," she says, finger poised to squash Carter's mug again, "is a
good soul."

by **Vins15** on Sat Feb 21, 2004 10:02 am

Welcome to the world of Penny Hardaway....this is all i can say :cry:

by **Stevan** on Sat Feb 21, 2004 1:06 pm

Despite the protest, he tries, and is rewarded with two buckets in the paint. But it's too late. Detroit holds on, 95-91.Neither the process nor the outcome matters to Debbie Bjorgaard and her 11-year-old son, David, sitting six rows behind the Pistons bench. Tonight's tickets are a gift from mother to sonCarter is his favorite player. David is easy to spot among the sea of Pistons fans; he's the one wearing the No.15 Raptors jersey. "It's one of the jerseys I can let my son wear," Debbie says. "He has Kobe's,too, but we've had to put that away."

lmao

I think an article like this will just add to the 'fragile' or 'soft' tag Carter has. He's a nice guy apparently, so credit to him for that. Not really that devoted to basketball, but I guess he has that choice.

by **DipSetVC** on Sat Feb 21, 2004 1:14 pm

He may be the next Penny Hardaway but his talent and ability that he showed in his first three seasons in the league exceeded Penny's by far. He was, heck, he still is more popular than Penny ever was, even in those crummy ass "Lil Penny" days. Now we can add his name next to Penny Hardaway and Grant Hill when thinking of players who's promising careers were completely ruined by injuries.

by **Robby** on Sat Feb 21, 2004 1:28 pm

DipSetVC wrote:He may be the next Penny Hardaway but his talent and ability that he showed in his first three seasons in the league exceeded Penny's by far. He was, heck, he still is more popular than Penny ever was, even in those crummy ass "Lil Penny" days. Now we can add his name next to Penny Hardaway and Grant Hill when thinking of players who's promising careers were completely ruined by injuries.

I'd have to disagree with that. Penny in his prime was better than Vince because he could so many things other than scoring. Penny not only was a great playmaker but also a much better defender than Vince. As for the popularity, Penny had to play in the shadow of MJ in his prime, Shaq, and Charles Barkley. Vince hasn't had to go up against competition like because MJ was a shell of himself in Washington and many of Shaq's fans hate him now for leaving Orlando. As for the lil Penny ads, I, along with the folks at ESPN, believe that was one of the best marketing campaigns for Sports stars. And it was much better than the little doll Sprite is using for their commercials.

by **DipSetVC** on Sat Feb 21, 2004 1:29 pm

The key about Penny being "better" than Vince : He played with Shaq, plain and simple.

by **VCFAN** on Sat Feb 21, 2004 2:17 pm

Vince was way better than Penny in his prime and now. Penny was never voted top for an all- star game like Vince. Penny was never compared to MJ like Vince has been. Vince has completely stunned the world with his dunking abilities. Penny has never done anything like that!!!!!!

by **fgrep15** on Sat Feb 21, 2004 2:31 pm

Actually Penny was compared to Jordan, and Penny was a very good All-Round player, he didn't have the rebounding, and the scoring, but he was a better passer, and defender, and was a very efficient scorer shooting over 50% in his 2nd and 3rd years.

He was also on the All NBA First team in 1994-1995 and 1995-1996, and on the All NBA Third team in 1996-1997.

After Shaq left he didn't really do anything anymore, he got injured the season after Shaq left, and the season after that his rebounds increased, but his scoring and shooting were nothing amazing. His last good season was 1999-2000, he had good rebound and assits numbers, and good shooting, but he scoring was nothing to brag about and he was also injured for a large part of the season.

I dunno, I'd say in his second year (and maybe third), he was better than VC in his second year, but we can argue he had Shaq, and VC still beat him in scoring and rebounding. But then again he would'nt get as many shots b/c of Shaq, but look what happened when Shaq left, he didn't score 20 or more ever again (injuries though).

by **Matthew** on Sat Feb 21, 2004 3:07 pm

But Penny reached his prime with shaq alongside him. It's unfair to use the years that he wasn't around shaq, becuase injuries had taken its toll.. I think the best way to decide this is by All nba first team selections:
Penny 2, Vince 0.

Vince was way better than Penny in his prime and now. Penny was never voted top for an all- star game like Vince. Penny was never compared to MJ like Vince has been. Vince has completely stunned the world with his dunking abilities. Penny has never done anything like that!!!!!!

Correct me if im wrong, but i dont think Larry Bird ever was the top vote getter in the asg. If this is true, does that mean Grant Hill is a better player than larry legend?
fgrep15 has covered the jordan comparisons that penny recieved.. and just becuase a player stuns the basketball audience with athletic ability doesnt mean he's better... that would be like saying Ben Wallace is better than tim duncan becuase he is more exciting.

by **Matt** on Sat Feb 21, 2004 8:42 pm

as far as memory serves, when Shaq was injured, Penny took over the Magic.........he scored 22ppg w/o Shaq and had good rebounding and assist numbers. + the steals.

by **Boyk** on Sun Feb 22, 2004 1:15 am

stack42 wrote:as far as memory serves, when Shaq was injured, Penny took over the Magic.........he scored 22ppg w/o Shaq and had good rebounding and assist numbers. + the steals.

and im sure penny got the magic to the playoffs the year shaq left??
i think??

and penny was way better than vince, vince only lead the all-star voting coz hes a very exciting player, but exciting doesnt make u a great player.

Penny was the better defender(probably still is) passer and leader, and yes Penny was compared to Jordan and said to be the best in the NBA at that time, behind jordan

by **Stevan** on Sun Feb 22, 2004 12:39 pm

The year after Shaq left, Penny just about single handedly took the Heat to 5 games in the first round, as discussed in a couple of other threads recently. I'd take Penny, even though I didn't like him much during his peak, he was pretty good.

by **Bill Russell** on Sun Feb 22, 2004 2:25 pm

I'd like to officially declare that I'm a Vince Carter fan now.

by **Stevan** on Sun Feb 22, 2004 10:32 pm

I'd like to officially declare that I'm a Vince Carter fan now.

Is that because he's a good boy, and hasn't been arrested or anything yet? Because you know he could visit Colorado and all that could change :lol:

Though I'm not really a Carter fan, I must say it's good for a franchise player to be a guy who doesn't get in trouble, and also (just in time) gives up his all-star spot to god. (y)

by **Nick** on Mon Feb 23, 2004 5:21 pm

Back to Penny and Carter...

Anybody who says Vince in his prime is better than Penny in his prime is a VC fan and/or doesn't know about Penny.

Here's something that you should take note of...

After the 1995/96 season Penny was an MVP candidate. In fact he was third in MVP votes that season. THIRD!! Third over players like Hakeem Olajuwon, Scottie Pippen, Karl Malone, Gary Payton, Shaquille O'Neal, Charles Barkley, Magic Johnson etc. etc.

(Y)

by **fgrep15** on Mon Feb 23, 2004 5:28 pm

Nick wrote:Back to Penny and Carter...

Anybody who says Vince in his prime is better than Penny in his prime is a VC fan and/or doesn't know about Penny.

Here's something that you should take note of...

After the 1995/96 season Penny was an MVP candidate. In fact he was third in MVP votes that season. THIRD!! Third over players like Hakeem Olajuwon, Scottie Pippen, Karl Malone, Gary Payton, Shaquille O'Neal, Charles Barkley, Magic Johnson etc. etc.

Yea that was just some ignorance on some people's parts, in Penny's 1st to 3rd years, he was better, after the injuries he just kinda kept getting injured and declined to nothingness.

by **DipSetVC** on Tue Feb 24, 2004 12:03 am

Damn, sure are alot of VC haters up in here...

by **Matthew** on Tue Feb 24, 2004 8:04 am

So by thinking(and proving) that penny was better in his prime than vince was is hating.. lol :proud:

by **DipSetVC** on Tue Feb 24, 2004 9:12 am

NBA_Fan_23 wrote:So by thinking(and proving) that penny was better in his prime than vince was is hating.. lol

Nope, not at all

. I'm just sick and tired of all the VC hating over the last three years.

by **Old School Fool** on Tue Feb 24, 2004 9:48 am

Vince isn't turning into PENNY....

You still see the SICK SLAMS....

When VINCE starts acting like Michael Jordan did in 2002 by Only Doing Lay-Ups and doing One Handed Dunks that looks like Peja dunked then you know Vince's time has come

by **fgrep15** on Tue Feb 24, 2004 11:27 am

DipSetVC wrote:Nope, not at all . I'm just sick and tired of all the VC hating over the last three years.

Yea, me too, but what can you do.

by **Vins15** on Tue Feb 24, 2004 3:26 pm

fgrep15 wrote:
DipSetVC wrote:Nope, not at all . I'm just sick and tired of all the VC hating over the last three years.

Yea, me too, but what can you do.

ditto...VC is proving all us believers wrong...he just keeps getting worse at his game and more injures...

Article on Vince Carter (a little long)

Article on Vince Carter (a little long)

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