It's Over..Don't even try ...Kobe MVP

[Clinton]

look at modern basketball games, look at iverson and t-mac, those guys put up big numbers almost every game but u knw they dont do it for self fame because they knw they already have all that, they do it for the team and r important team players

yeah, Kobe is doing it for himself to get more fame. TMac and Iverson don't want fame, they are doing it for the team. Typical hater comment. Kobe is playing better then those two and getting more wins for his team. That's what I call doing it for the team. On any given night TMac or Iverson could jack up 30+ shots and get 3 assists, but you only like to point it out when Kobe does it.

[em]

Kobe is playing better then those two and getting more wins for his team. That's what I call doing it for the team. On any given night TMac or Iverson could jack up 30+ shots and get 3 assists, but you only like to point it out when Kobe does it.

what..2 more wins? yes on a given night any (superstar player) could jack up 30+ shots..but since were on the topic of Kobe, T-Mac and Iverson..heres a look at their last 5 games on shot attempts..
T-Mac
@ NJ: 16/27 - 46 pts.
Bulls: 15/32 - 52 pts.
NO: 9/26 - 24 pts.
@ Tor: 11/24 - 36 pts.
@ Phi: 11/26 - 37 pts.
62/133 - .466%
shot attempts per game.. 26.6

A.I.
Cle: 7/23 - 23 pts.
@ Cle: 12/23 - 41 pts.
@ Chi: 12/24 - 28 pts.
@ NJ: 10/24 - 32 pts.
Orl: 8/22 - 20 pts.
49/116 - .422%
shot attempts per game.. 23.2

Kobe
Sea: 13/34 - 41 pts.
Por: 15/32 - 40 pts.
@ Utah: 15/29 - 40 pts.
Hou: 19/38 - 52 pts.
NY: 14/31 - 40 pts.
76/164 - .463%
shot attempts per game.. 32.8

do i need to say anymore?.. whos averaging over 30+ shots a gm now?

[Boyk]

and that is what pisses me off bout kobe and his "fans"..how come in the old forum there wasn't this many kobe fans? and how u see his name, his number, his initial and number in ur usernames, sigs with him and 4 peat, mvp and crap like that..why now? sheesh..cant be so obvious here..

ive had this nick since way before the old forum.
my email has it, my yahoo ID and nearly everything i sign upto.
triple-double virtual gm(which i dont play anymore)

i already explained y people have kobe names, all these new oens who have come from nowhere, fianlly relise how good kobe is, and they bandwagon(no offense to you new guys but it seems like that).

and about that fame later in this thread, WTF!!!
hes 24 and a 3 time champion, has a record for 3's in a game only 24 years old.......i think he already has made a big name for himself.

is it really kobes fualt he cant back down from a challenge???
that shows a great competitor right there. just cause he didnt back down from 40pnt challenge he is now trying to get more fame, and now being a ballhog.............pfffft!! lol you people make me laugh

he was challenged by the sonics who started to play stronger D and he decided to step up to it. i dont see no problem in that

[Clinton]

whos averaging over 30+ shots a gm now?

But who is the one who has averaged 44ppg for the last 9 games?

[Rens]

Over the span big_stud was talking about, Kobe averaged 42.6ppg on 32 shots, and T-Mac had 39ppg on 26.6 shots per game. Iverson had 28.8 ppg on 23.2 shots.

[em]

But who is the one who has averaged 44ppg for the last 9 games?

dude..u take MORE u make MORE hope u knw that..

[em]

Over the span big_stud was talking about, Kobe averaged 42.6ppg on 32 shots, and T-Mac had 39ppg on 26.6 shots per game. Iverson had 28.8 ppg on 23.2 shots.

yes, more shots more points..just common sense..last nite he held the ball back the last secs because he knws the streak has to end there..there aint no way he could get 8 more pts in less than 40 secs..if there was still at least 2 mins he wouldve jacked up sum more..

[Boyk]

i doubt he would've actually hater.

he played completley different agaisnt the clips than he had the past 9-11 games.
anyway, for the non-haters, has anyone noticed how many steals hes been getting??
i mena 5 vs the clips and im sure ive see another 5 and 4 around throughtout the streak, unless its just my imagination ???

[em]

i doubt he would've actually hater.

he played completley different agaisnt the clips than he had the past 9-11 games.
anyway, for the non-haters, has anyone noticed how many steals hes been getting??
i mena 5 vs the clips and im sure ive see another 5 and 4 around throughtout the streak, unless its just my imagination ???

he play completely different? how is it different when he wanted to get his 40 and thought he would get it again last night wth the Clippers? just look at it, the Clippers?? dont u think he couldve scored at least 50 on them? look at the way he started out..1-5.. he took 2 quick fouls in the first.. the Clippers double him from the outside so he had to pass the ball..he couldnt penetrate against their defense so he had to past and time wasnt on his side because he started with only 4 pts in the first (i think it was at least..)..8 in the second, pretty low numbers..dont think he would make it if u just look at it that way..he didnt have a chance of getting it last night so he knw he had to give it up and also he didnt want to be criticize for hogging the ball a second straight gm..

[.]

yes, more shots more points..just common sense..last nite he held the ball back the last secs because he knws the streak has to end there..there aint no way he could get 8 more pts in less than 40 secs..if there was still at least 2 mins he wouldve jacked up sum more..

He had 32 points with 2:30 remaining wich is enough to score 8 points. So youre wrong because he didnt jacked up a shot

[mkool8]

Shaq also had a good game (33 points), so Kobe didn't need to score 40 to get the win.

[benji]

Kobe is playing better then those two and getting more wins for his team. That's what I call doing it for the team. On any given night TMac or Iverson could jack up 30+ shots and get 3 assists, but you only like to point it out when Kobe does it.

Well...Kobe does have Shaq...Sixers are better than the Lackers right now and the Magic aren't far behind.

Iverson
49/116 - .422%
shot attempts per game.. 23.2

Somethin's going on with Ivy right now...shooting less, but shooting better...maybe it's the Olympics thing?

[benji]

I apologize. I made an error earlier in this thread.

there was no 3sec rule back in the day with wilt

There infact was a three second rule. It was enacted in 1945.

1945 - Defensive goaltending is banned; Players are now allowed five fouls before fouling out (previously the limit was four); 3-second violation enacted.
1950 - The 1-and-1 free throw rule is adopted.
1951-52 - The NBA extends the width of the foul lane from six to 12 feet. (for Mikan)
1954-55 - The NBA introduces the 24-second shot clock to curtail stalling tactics. (Mikan again)
1958 - Offensive goaltending is banned. 1-and-1 goes into effect on the seventh foul of the half.
1964-65 - The NBA extends the width of the foul lane from 12 feet to 16 feet. (for Wilt)

[magius]

i hate how kobe fans call anyone who does not idolize kobe a kobe hater.

I for one dont hate him in any ay shape or form, i just really do believe that he is not as good as some people would have him be.

Shaq makes Kobe a helluva lot better. Period. Shaq makes who ever he plays with better..... example: Penny and the whole old orlando squad. What happened when Shaq left Orlando? They sucked. Which is exactly what will happen to a Shaq-less lakers, need proof? Watch the first part of the season when Shaq was injured.

Kobe, to me, is a slightly bettter penny hardaway. But then again, shaq himself improved after his orlando days...... maybe penny (in his early days) could've jacked up 28 ppg with an improved shaq.

it would be nice to see the numbers vince carter would put up with shaq on his team.

oh yeah, and i dont hate kobe

[em]

He had 32 points with 2:30 remaining wich is enough to score 8 points. So youre wrong because he didnt jacked up a shot

dude he couldve but it wasnt his night, 11 for 26 (42%) Clippers was defending him well so he had no chance..u say 2:30, he still had 32 after all that..but if u saw the game (which u did)..he didnt get a shot because the Lakers were running their plays and didnt give him the ball much..when he did get it, 2 Clippers were on him..u see him trying to drive in but near the sideline about to go out of bounce? then the Clippers just stole the ball from him? yes a turnover for kobee..alot of things prevent him frm getting 40 last nite..time was against him..it was running down whenever the Clippers had the ball..they keep it for at least 15 to 20 secs each possession i think..also kob-ster didnt want to embarrass himself any further so he just quit..

[em]

i hate how kobe fans call anyone who does not idolize kobe a kobe hater.

ditto..theyre just lamers..

Shaq makes Kobe a helluva lot better. Period....What happened when Shaq left Orlando? They sucked. Which is exactly what will happen to a Shaq-less lakers, need proof? Watch the first part of the season when Shaq was injured.

exactly! absolutely correct..yeah what happen to the "lackers" when shaq was out eh? did kob-ster run the show? no he didnt!

oh yeah, and i dont hate kobe

i do..i got reasons to be..hes too much of a ball-hogg, i wouldnt want him on the team for anything..t-mac would be the best teammate (even Shaq agrees..) if i have to choose one..kobee makes me sick..kobee makes every "lacker" hater sick..but at least i dont keep it to myself..kobee is just like iverson when he won mvp..the more shots he takes, more points..duh! more points means selfish..not a team player..lame because he is a ball-hogg and nothing more..o i forgot to say loser..?

[scubilete]

i do..i got reasons to be..hes too much of a ball-hogg, i wouldnt want him on the team for anything..t-mac would be the best teammate (even Shaq agrees..) if i have to choose one..kobee makes me sick..kobee makes every "lacker" hater sick..but at least i dont keep it to myself

He he he he, . Is that the way you have felt for the last 3 years? I'm really sorry, I mean, all Lakers fans are sorry to hear that, there's just one way to fix that matter tho, why don't you join us so you can start feeling much better?, lol.

[Boyk]

lol i jsut relised something.
it seems that nearly every kobe hater is a jordan lover.

lol, i sense a little jealousy here lol


and i want the exact link, or some place where i can get the qoute on when shaq said that t-mac would be a better teamate??
if ya cant get it for me then ya lying obviously.

and its not like its kobes fualt that lakers are a worse team without shaq, look at his teamates lol, none of them(bar fisher and george) could average double figures on a nightly basis. and even fisher and george would barey get over that double figure mark, so that argument is just ridiculous.

i bet the lakers wouldnt do so well if kobe was injured and shaq was by himself either(unless shaq got the ball everytime down the floor in the paint and would just throw it down on there hole)

now you cant start comparing Penny and Kobe, i mean for one, penny was a point guard and kobes a shooting guard(keyword there "shooting")
and also the magic had other players than just penny and shaq. they also had nick anderson getting them 15-19 a night(far more production than the lakers 3rd option) dennis scott also getting 12-16 a night.
so dont start bringing up that sort of nonsense.
and when shaq left, penny had better players than kobe, i believe seikaly got them 17ppg 9rpg in 96/97. and they had scott anderson etc. etc.

[em]

lol, i sense a little jealousy here lol

jealous of kobee? no man..who would want to be called a ball-hogger?? i knw i wouldnt like that..

and i want the exact link, or some place where i can get the qoute on when shaq said that t-mac would be a better teamate??
if ya cant get it for me then ya lying obviously.

me lying? no dude..shaq said it himself last season..if ur such a laker fan u should knw..i dont have the link but it was on espn a few times that day..but im sure most of the people on here can say im right because they heard shaq said "t-mac is more of a team player and he would love to come back to orlando to play with him"..

and its not like its kobes fualt that lakers are a worse team without shaq, look at his teamates lol, none of them(bar fisher and george) could average double figures on a nightly basis. and even fisher and george would barey get over that double figure mark, so that argument is just ridiculous.

blame jerry buss or mitch KETCHUP..err i mean kupchak..whateva his name is..

i bet the lakers wouldnt do so well if kobe was injured and shaq was by himself either(unless shaq got the ball everytime down the floor in the paint and would just throw it down on there hole)

pretty sure they would do better with just shaq..no one can really defend him from getting inside..

now you cant start comparing Penny and Kobe, i mean for one, penny was a point guard and kobes a shooting guard(keyword there "shooting")

u nuts? penny plays shooting too u knw? he is the suns shooting guard rite now isnt he?

and also the magic had other players than just penny and shaq. they also had nick anderson getting them 15-19 a night(far more production than the lakers 3rd option) dennis scott also getting 12-16 a night.

main reason..KETCHUP!

so dont start bringing up that sort of nonsense.

it aint nonsense dude..

and when shaq left, penny had better players than kobe, i believe seikaly got them 17ppg 9rpg in 96/97. and they had scott anderson etc. etc.

whateva..

[bishibashiboy]

jealous of kobee? no man..who would want to be called a ball-hogger?? i knw i wouldnt like that..

haha im jealous of him..wouldn't you want to make his salary over yours??..i know i would any day!

blame jerry buss or mitch KETCHUP..err i mean kupchak..whateva his name is..

your reply totally avoided his main point

u nuts? penny plays shooting too u knw? he is the suns shooting guard rite now isnt he?

haha no he isn't..he's their permanent resident on the injured list..much like most of his career

and also the magic had other players than just penny and shaq. they also had nick anderson getting them 15-19 a night(far more production than the lakers 3rd option) dennis scott also getting 12-16 a night.

main reason..KETCHUP!

he has a point here that you ignored here buddy...and what Buss and Kupchak are doing (or rather NOT doing) is irrelevant..because the end result is the Lakers have a weak supporting cast this year..and there's a limit to how much Kobe can do for a team..if they get a wide open shot (and they had PLENTY of those during their early stretch of the season) and they brick it..how can you hold Kobe responsible for that?

and when shaq left, penny had better players than kobe, i believe seikaly got them 17ppg 9rpg in 96/97. and they had scott anderson etc. etc.

whateva..

again you avoided his point..and by your response i'm sure people can tell that you have no defence against what he said a/b Penny having better supporting players in Orlando before, than Kobe has now in L.A.

btw, i'm not a Kobe LOVER..but i just don't understand why so many people hate him for what he's doing..if he passes a lot and his teammates all brick their shots..the Lakers lose..if he takes matters into his own hands, you ppl call him a ballhog. So what's the solution???..give me ONE good solution to this..and as most ppl said above..the bottom line is that the Lakers are winning..either with Kobe shooting 30+ times a night..or him scoring "only" 30 points as he did tonight against the Pistons..
The only way you can really judge what Kobe can do alone is once Shaq leaves and Kobe has his own team that's built around HIS abilities..if "his" team goes 2-9 or whatever..then you guys have a more convincing point.


As for Mvp..I go for KG..verrry consistent this season

[Drex]

So what's the solution???..give me ONE good solution to this..

Trade the whole Lakers team, except Shaq, Kobe and Phil. (and Horry[for thr clutch time])

[benji]

and what Buss and Kupchak are doing (or rather NOT doing) is irrelevant..because the end result is the Lakers have a weak supporting cast this year..

Well, if Buss didn't want to save $$$ and Kupchak could properly evaluate talent, the Lackers would have a much better supporting cast for Shaqobe.

[bishibashiboy]

So what's the solution???..give me ONE good solution to this..

Trade the whole Lakers team, except Shaq, Kobe and Phil. (and Horry[for thr clutch time])

actually i was referring to what Kobe can do to please all you people..because my point was no matter what he does someone will always criticize him no matter how he plays; much like KG.

and what Buss and Kupchak are doing (or rather NOT doing) is irrelevant..because the end result is the Lakers have a weak supporting cast this year..

Well, if Buss didn't want to save $$$ and Kupchak could properly evaluate talent, the Lackers would have a much better supporting cast for Shaqobe.

well that's true..but still..the subject of this thread is that what Kobe is doing with his limited supporting cast is mvp-worthy..NOT the fact that the supporting class is below average due to poor management. The fact that you agree fox fisher horry and the rest of the Lakers (other than Shaq) suck nuts is further evidence that Kobe leading them back into the playoffs is quite an accomplishment.

[magius]

everyones talking about a supporting cast being built around shaq and not kobe..... well it doesnt make sense. You could put any player in the league you like around shaq and shaq'd create space for them and make them better.

and then theirs all that stuff about how tmacs supporting cast was built around him.... thats nonsense. Only now (with the gooden trade) are they building around tmac.... you call outside shooters (garrity, miller) and crap centres (deqlerq) a supporting cast for a shooting guard?

Now that tmac has somewhat of an inside presence in gooden, the magic (and tmac) are exploding..... kobe in comparison has THE inside presence in shaq. So....who's tmac's supporting cast now.... gooden who will probably go for 18ppg in orlando now, giricek at 15ppg, garrity at 11ppg, and amrstrong at 10 ppg. If i take away gooden and giricek (since you guys always like to take away shaq when talking about the lakers supporting cast---and gooden and giricek dont even come close to equalling shaq by the way) and what do you have???? NOTHING!!! garrity and armstrong could easily equal fox and fisher. Tmac is doing more with less.

And also, the lakers would still be a playoff team without kobe...... but without shaq?..... no way in hell. How do i know this? because kobe was not always as good as he is now and shaq still won games for the lakers.

again, i dont like michael jordan (some guy said mj fans hated kobe, thats pretty presumptious) and i dont hate kobe....... i just dont think he's as good as some of you like to believe

i compared penny to kobe not because he is/was as good (though that could be controversial), but because I was pointing out what happened to penny and orlando AFTER shaq left. Penny slowly started to suck, orlando lossed. Thats what will happen to kobe and the lakers if shaq leaves. Though i think kobe will always be good for around 27 5 and 5... which is very good.

and also, yes penny had a better supporting cast, BUT shaq wasnt as good then as he became when he won the championship.

anyway..... can u imagine how powerful the lakers would be if they hadnt traded campbell and jones for glen rice??!!!!! christ......

[Drex]

actually i was referring to what Kobe can do to please all you people

have a 9-game streak of 20+ assists, lol, that was the funny part of my post.

because my point was no matter what he does someone will always criticize him no matter how he plays

and my point is:
Kobe-hater: he's a ball-hog
kobe-lover/defender: no he's not, he doesn't have a supporting cast, the team needs him.
To explain my point, all the Kobe-haters says that he doesn't pass the ball, he's a ball-hog, etc; and the answer is that his teammates suck.
Well, 'coz the rest of the Lakers are not good, they (the Lakers GM) should trade them for good players, so Kobe can pass the ball more and still be a 28+ ppg.

(For the third-time in my "posting career", sorry for the bad english, i'm thinking to put that in my avatar, lol)