Gilbert Arenas having a SICK night

[John WB]

He's like AI. And look at Wade, another Pg only 2 spots below him. No one'd call him a ballhog. And Arenas doesn't have Shaq, Zo, Jason Williams and Tonie on his team. Yeah he has Jamison and it's not like his scoring has gone down, plus Hughes is gone and he is the primary scorer.

[SnitchDevil]

Wade is a shooting guard.

You wanna talk about the supporting cast?
Arenas has Jamison, Caron, Haywood, Jared freakin Jeffries, Jarvis Hayes
Kobe has Lamar Odom, Chris Mihm, Smush Parker and GULP Kwame Brown
AI has Iguodala, C-Webb, Dalembert and Korver

[fgrep15]

% of teams shots

Kobe - 32.6%
Iverson - 31.9%
Lebron - 27.1%
Tmac - 26.6%
Arenas - 26.1%
Dirk - 25.2%
Allen - 24.8%
Wade - 24.4%
Vince - 24.4%
Pierce - 23.3%
Brand - 22.5%
Carmelo - 22.2%
Redd - 22.2%

How many point guards do we have in this list? Yeah, that's right.

Point is a point guard is supposed to take less shots than a sg, he's supposed to drop more dimes than a sg. But wait, here's Arenas, averaging more shots than dirk, allen, wade, vince, pierce, brand, melo and redd. He's on his way to catching up on t-mac. Dude, the guy is a frakin pg, call him a combo guard or whatever but he's still the one running the offense and he's still the one tasked to set up his teammates.

Their's Iverson, and guess what? They're the 2 best scoring PG's in the league, their's a reason Arenas is up there. In that list only 3 guys are beating him in TS%, Lebron, Brand and Redd, when you're scoring that efficiently, no one should be complaining about how many shots you take, especially when your coach wants that to happen so the team has a chance of winning.

I'm not sure you watch the Wizards much, Arenas is the best and most efficient scorer on the team. Jamison has been shooting under 40% the last week to two, and the team runs the offense so Arenas can get shots. Caron Butler is the only other reliable option, and since he's been starting, he's been getting his touches.

Arenas plays off the ball a lot while Chucky and Daniels run the offense. Jared Jeffries also runs the offense while Arenas plays off the ball at times. This isn't just Arenas running down the court and deciding to jack up shots, the coach is running these plays for him. The team has no post option, Jamison can post up, but doesn't, Arenas is responsible for a lot of things offensively, and no one is arguing he's a true PG, but he's still averaging 6.2 APG.

Antonio Daniels has played 21.6 MPG in 27/28 games, and Chucky Atkins has played 19.6 MPG in 25/28 games. They've played a combined 1074/2688 [40%] minutes in the season at both the guard spots. That's an average of 38.4 MPG. When Chucky is on the floor with Arenas he'll normally be the set up guy while Arenas plays the SG. With AD, they share ball handling duties, but about 60-40 for AD as Arenas plays more SG because AD is not in the same caliber as a scorer and shooter. Their's 48 minutes in a game, and these guys are in for 38 of those 48 minutes, which means Arenas is not the main distributor when they're on. Let's say Chucky and AD play together some times while Arenas is out, or not even together, but are just on without him, so the 6 mins Arenas is off is subtracted. So for 32 minutes while Arenas is on the floor, either Chuck or AD is on with him, then Arenas only has about 10 MPG where he's the primary distributor on the floor.

It's also easy to just say blah blah does this, but looking at things in depth can shed a new light on the situation.

Arenas has Jamison, Caron, Haywood, Jared freakin Jeffries, Jarvis Hayes

Jamison and Caron are good. Hayes is injured and decent, and Haywood and Jeffries are not offensive options, but okay players.

[Amphatoast]

maybe the knicks should do the same with marbury and let him be a high scoring point guard like arenas. He has the talent to do it

[Matt]

and suffer with Nate Robinsons attrocious defense?

[SnitchDevil]

when you're scoring that efficiently, no one should be complaining about how many shots you take, especially when your coach wants that to happen so the team has a chance of winning.

The same thing can be said about Kobe. Oh and he's a sg too, he isnt tasked to run the offense.

Point is we were comparing Kobe and Arenas "hogging the ball". My point is Arenas isnt less of a "ballhog" than kobe. And the stats you posted have proven my point.

[fgrep15]

...but Kobe is not scoring nearly that efficiently. I'm not saying Kobe shouldn't be taking the shots, though his scoring less points than shots attempted when taking a high volume of shots is not nice, but Arenas is not near Kobe's level of ball hogness. He's not even a ball hog really, and doesn't stray out of the offense nearly as much as people seem to think.

Arenas has taken 30+ shots once this season, Kobe has taken 30+ shots 12 times.

Arenas has taken 25+ shots 4 times this season, Kobe averages more than 25 shots a game, and has taken 25+ shots 19 times this season.

I'm not sure exactly what stats prove your point, please enlighten me, just telling me they do means nothing to me. Your only basis of argument is the whole PG thing, but clearly Arenas does not play that role due to the makeup of the team. So basically we're comparing them as scoring guards, not as a PG and a SG, and Arenas takes 6.5% less of his team shots, and shoots more efficiently.

Arenas: PPS - 1.35 | Sheff - 50.7% | TS% - 55.4%
Kobe: PPS - 1.24 | Sheff - 46.0% | TS% - 51.2%

Kobe's TS% is almost the same as Arenas' shooting efficiency. Arenas has 4.2% on him in terms of scoring efficiency, and 4.7% in terms of field efficiency.

[ShAuN]

Whats the Sheff? and the TS%??

[fgrep15]

Shooting efficiency is taking into account the value of 3 pointers, and TS% taking into account the value of three pointers and your ability to get to the line and make FT's.

[ShAuN]

In that case Arenas OWNS Kobe

But if Arenas was as consistant as say Kobe or Pierce even, then Arenas would be getting like 32ppg, 47fg% and like 7apg

[SnitchDevil]

Arenas OWNS Kobe? WTF are you smoking shaunie?

Again fgrep, Kobe has lamar Odom, Chris Mihm and Kwame Brown to pass the ball to, Arenas has who?

You want to talk about efficiency? Our recent game against Utah could say it all. We flat out sucked without Kobe, Lamar and co. justified Kobe's shot attempts. How about Gilbert? Once again, call him a scoring guard, that doesnmt change the fact that he is the team's POINT GUARD. Wanna talk about efficiency? How's the wizards doing in the leastern conference? How's my lakers doing in the tough tough west? Yeah, that's right. efficient indeed.

[fgrep15]

You want to talk about efficiency? Our recent game against Utah could say it all. We flat out sucked without Kobe, Lamar and co. justified Kobe's shot attempts. How about Gilbert? Once again, call him a scoring guard, that doesnmt change the fact that he is the team's POINT GUARD. Wanna talk about efficiency? How's the wizards doing in the leastern conference? How's my lakers doing in the tough tough west? Yeah, that's right. efficient indeed.

At least use a good example. The Lakers lost by 4 points to a Utah team who with Kirilenko are 13-8 which would rank them 7th best in the league record wise. I'm not sure how they justified his attempts, they spread the ball around more, Odom had 18-12-8, they shot 50%, only committed 10 TO's, and you even had guys like Mihm, Cook, Geroge and Walton stepping up.

Why are you arguing against yourself here, you're not proving your point through that AT ALL. Better defense and making FT's [shot 60%] would've won that game for the Lakers, their offesne was better than it normally is even.

You want to talk about efficiency? Our recent game against Utah could say it all. We flat out sucked without Kobe, Lamar and co. justified Kobe's shot attempts. How about Gilbert? Once again, call him a scoring guard, that doesnmt change the fact that he is the team's POINT GUARD. Wanna talk about efficiency? How's the wizards doing in the leastern conference? How's my lakers doing in the tough tough west? Yeah, that's right. efficient indeed.

I'm not sure if you ignored my post(s), but the whole point was that Arenas DOES NOT play point guard for most of the game. He actually plays it for about maybe 1 whole quarter each game. About 78% of his minutes are spent playing off the ball and as a SG, not as the PG.

In that case Arenas OWNS Kobe

But if Arenas was as consistant as say Kobe or Pierce even, then Arenas would be getting like 32ppg, 47fg% and like 7apg

No he doesn't, their's the whole defensive side of the game where he's not close to Kobe. Also he's not less consistent than Kobe, their's a reason he's a higher efficiency, if he was taking more shots he would average 32 PPG, but he doesn't need to. If he was the primary playmaker for his 41 MPG he would average 7+ APG, but he's not because the team doesn't have the personell to have him do that.

[air gordon]

lol don't even bother with the GAMe

[SnitchDevil]

cut me some slack limp. fine, fine, im a biased laker jocker. happy now?

[ShAuN]

Damn, anyone watch the Rockets VS Wizards game on NBA TV? Arenas is crazy. Just had 44 points. Sucks the Wizards suck ass right now

[SnitchDevil]

Calm down shaunie. Anyone can score 44 points on that old geezer david wesley.

[air gordon]

no

[ShAuN]

Calm down shaunie. Anyone can score 44 points on that old geezer david wesley.

OMG kid get over it, Kobe is more of a ball hog than Arenas......I dont see Kobe getting 44 on Wesley.....And plus it was Alston

[SnitchDevil]

Shaunie,

OMG kid get over it, Kobe is more of a ball hog than Arenas

Umm, no. and Kobe>>>>>Arenas. Only a stupid mindless idiot would think otherwise.

I dont see Kobe getting 44 on Wesley

That's because no coach would be stupid enough to put David Wesley on Kobe.

And plus it was Alston

Are you suffering from lack of common knowledge or something? Alston is a worst defender than Wesley.

And you call me a kid?

[Fenix]

You're pathethic. Not everyone are idiots if they don't agree with you. Did you ever head for a term 'constructive debate'?

[SnitchDevil]

There was nothing constructive about our debate.

Seriously kid, get a brain.

[Matt]

another good night another loss.

[SnitchDevil]

another good night another loss.

You better not be posting this in the laker thread.

[Joycean Summons]

There was nothing constructive about our debate.

That was exactly what he was saying.

[Matt]

Arenas should try passing the ball.