Source: Dwyane Wade's contract talks with Miami Heat hit impasse

[air gordon]

I see what you're saying. I don't believe a player his age and injury history should get multi year contract. I'm sure Riley can get creative. Give him an easy job with the organization after his playing days.

I think James screwed the heat and in turn screwed Wade and Riley. It's a shit situation. Maybe it's a case of karma coming back to bite them in the ass.

Personally I don't feel bad for all parties involved

[NovU]

It's probably a tough world for Celtics fans like Sauru to understand. When was the last time any Celtic took less for the team. That franchise has been a dysfunctional pile of shit in recent era. Long loved franchise player gone to chase the ring with Russian boss, then to Washington for $$$. Yeah, that's how you bleed green. Heck, thanks to that massive fuck up, Ray bolted to give LBJ his second ring, game 6 lel.

[Sauru]

It's probably a tough world for Celtics fans like Sauru to understand. When was the last time any Celtic took less for the team. That franchise has been a dysfunctional pile of shit in recent era. Long loved franchise player gone to chase the ring with Russian boss, then to Washington for $$$. Yeah, that's how you bleed green. Heck, thanks to that massive fuck up, Ray bolted to give LBJ his second ring, game 6 lel.

one day you will actually try to have a discussion without resorting to childish insults. then again maybe you wont.

also please explain how the franchise is dysfunctional?

[NovU]

I didn't want to argue against your logic. Nothing would be 'sacrifice' then. What Timmy, and Dirk did was for themselves entirely? Both of them had much longer career than Wade and made shit load more money from salary yet, does that make less of sacrifice than Wade because they are shit rich money don't matter?

Reality is that these players went a step or two further than most of other players for the benefit of the team. That's a noble act especially for one franchise career players you guys rave about, which have become rare these days. This is not an insult but you couldn't obviously tell because none of Celtics took on this kind of sacrifice in recent era. If anyone did, you'd rave about that player as well.



But I see where you are coming from on the point that Heat owes nothing more than his worth right now. I don't think he's far off from his asking price then. Weren't you the guy that was understanding about Kobe's goodbye contract? Your stance seems to shift when it comes to Wade.

[mp3]

The Heat should pay Wade,he has done so much for the franchise with winning in 06 and then taking a paycut to form the big 3 to win 2 more rings.

This probably is his last big pay day and I know 20 million sounds like a lot but once you take away tax (50%) and agent fees (5-15%) he could walk away with 8 million from that deal which is still a lot of money but to an fading nba superstar that money would have to support his family for years to come and it's not like he can downsize his house and move onto the block somewhere he still needs the security.

Also to the loyal Heat fans it broke my heart watching Patrick Ewing leave New York and go to the Sonics that man should of retired a knick!

[Jackal]

Florida doesn't have income tax.

And I would agree that Tim/Dirk took less money because they wanted to win. They have made a shit load of money too and I'm pretty sure Dirk will have some front office job when he hangs it up.

What I don't understand about your logic is that you bash Kobe's contract (which I agree with from the teams point of view) but want the Heat to jeopardize the future because they "owe" Wade. Sauru points this out and you start moaning and bitching about him not understanding loyalty because Celtics this, Celtics that.

[Sauru]

This is not an insult but you couldn't obviously tell because none of Celtics took on this kind of sacrifice in recent era. If anyone did, you'd rave about that player as well.

numerous athletes from boston teams (we have more than just the celtics) have taken pay cuts to put a better team on the field. i have never bragged about or called the guy a saint. when a player takes less money all it means is winning is more important than making the maximum amount he can from his salary. you need to remember that in most cases these players still get a nice pay day and end up with lots of endorsement money. these guys are not hurting and if they are its honestly their own fault. taking a pay cut is not to help the team (owners) its to help the player win more games.

[mp3]

Florida doesn't have income tax.

It's appears there isn't any income tax, never knew that !

Mikes moving to Florida!!

[NovU]

Florida doesn't have income tax.

And I would agree that Tim/Dirk took less money because they wanted to win. They have made a shit load of money too and I'm pretty sure Dirk will have some front office job when he hangs it up.

So what? What is your point?

Ofc, Tim/Dirk/Wade took less money to win, to give a team better chance to win. Is there problem to this?

Or are you iterating sauru's moral standard and interpretation of the term sacrifice?

What I don't understand about your logic is that you bash Kobe's contract (which I agree with from the teams point of view) but want the Heat to jeopardize the future because they "owe" Wade. Sauru points this out and you start moaning and bitching about him not understanding loyalty because Celtics this, Celtics that.

One: Wade's not asking anything near max
Two: Jeopardizing and overpaying by little is two different thing.
Three: Wade is still young and played at high level this year.

You are overreacting because I presented irrefutable double standard shown from Kobe case. Let's be clear, I didn't bash Kobe's contract but his loyal defenders that raged at simple term "overpaid"(in terms of basketball, not business).

You see, the Heat are still very much in a position to remain competitive after paying Wade his money. It's just a much friendlier contract than Kobe's contract which entirely meant lottery and rebuilding while cashing in on Kobe's last legs.

numerous athletes from boston teams (we have more than just the celtics) have taken pay cuts to put a better team on the field. i have never bragged about or called the guy a saint. when a player takes less money all it means is winning is more important than making the maximum amount he can from his salary. you need to remember that in most cases these players still get a nice pay day and end up with lots of endorsement money. these guys are not hurting and if they are its honestly their own fault. taking a pay cut is not to help the team (owners) its to help the player win more games.

Let's hear some of those Celtics. Gimme some of Tim/Dirk/Wade in Green Version.



Pay cut generally is considered an unselfish act and sacrifice especially franchise players still in capable years. You are arguing against this fact with weak points. This is why it's just silly.


Say you have two equal talents but with distinctive personality. One is willing to take pay cut so that his team can retain his friend for the better chance at winning. The other one outright claims that he won't take a pay cut and scares off free agents. Which player would you criticize and commend?

Only thing you have right is that it's anyone's fault for doing anything, such as taking a pay cut, but same can be said about taking more money. That was just silly argument.

[Jackal]

Yeah, much friendlier contract.

Kobe's contract: 23 million/25 million.

A Wade associate has told people that Wade would welcome a contract averaging $20 million annually over the next three years.

[NovU]

Yeah, let's take this news for granted.

For what it's worth, Henry Thomas (Wade's agent) wouldn't confirm the report, so this could be yet another rumor.

You guys blow everything out of proportion way too much way too early. Hot damn, I mean it's not even offseason yet. But it's gotta be fun poking Wade and suck Kobe's nutsack.

[Jackal]

You're still in your defensive mode.

You can take the rumors thing as gospel saying his contract is much friendlier as if it's a fact etc but heaven forbid I do the same because it doesn't fit your narrative.

Besides what the heck are we even discussing at this point? Wade wants money and isn't getting that but you're saying he doesn't want that much? Why aren't the Heat just paying the face of their franchise the "flexible contract" which will let them contend given he's "young" and will probably "play at a high level" on his nonexistent knees? What's the hold up then?

[Sauru]

Florida doesn't have income tax.

And I would agree that Tim/Dirk took less money because they wanted to win. They have made a shit load of money too and I'm pretty sure Dirk will have some front office job when he hangs it up.

So what? What is your point?

Ofc, Tim/Dirk/Wade took less money to win, to give a team better chance to win. Is there problem to this?

Or are you iterating sauru's moral standard and interpretation of the term sacrifice?

What I don't understand about your logic is that you bash Kobe's contract (which I agree with from the teams point of view) but want the Heat to jeopardize the future because they "owe" Wade. Sauru points this out and you start moaning and bitching about him not understanding loyalty because Celtics this, Celtics that.

One: Wade's not asking anything near max
Two: Jeopardizing and overpaying by little is two different thing.
Three: Wade is still young and played at high level this year.

You are overreacting because I presented irrefutable double standard shown from Kobe case. Let's be clear, I didn't bash Kobe's contract but his loyal defenders that raged at simple term "overpaid"(in terms of basketball, not business).

You see, the Heat are still very much in a position to remain competitive after paying Wade his money. It's just a much friendlier contract than Kobe's contract which entirely meant lottery and rebuilding while cashing in on Kobe's last legs.

numerous athletes from boston teams (we have more than just the celtics) have taken pay cuts to put a better team on the field. i have never bragged about or called the guy a saint. when a player takes less money all it means is winning is more important than making the maximum amount he can from his salary. you need to remember that in most cases these players still get a nice pay day and end up with lots of endorsement money. these guys are not hurting and if they are its honestly their own fault. taking a pay cut is not to help the team (owners) its to help the player win more games.

Let's hear some of those Celtics. Gimme some of Tim/Dirk/Wade in Green Version.



Pay cut generally is considered an unselfish act and sacrifice especially franchise players still in capable years. You are arguing against this fact with weak points. This is why it's just silly.


Say you have two equal talents but with distinctive personality. One is willing to take pay cut so that his team can retain his friend for the better chance at winning. The other one outright claims that he won't take a pay cut and scares off free agents. Which player would you criticize and commend?

Only thing you have right is that it's anyone's fault for doing anything, such as taking a pay cut, but same can be said about taking more money. That was just silly argument.

you dont actually read what people write do you?

[Andrew]

my point of view is this. everyone is saying the team should pay him now as a loyalty contract since he kept taking pay cuts to win. well if the team was horrible and he was still a max player would anyone say he should stay with the team out of loyalty? it feels like peoples opinions are very 1 sided with this.

i am just saying that it my opinion that the heat only "owe" him what he is currently worth.

Oh, I'm not suggesting the Heat are bad for not wanting to overpay him in the name of rewarding his loyalty; they have to manage their cap moving forward, make the right moves, and assess his market value. I don't fault them for their stance, I just see where Wade is coming from with his.

[Sauru]

i also see wades point of view but his beef is not really with the heat its with lebron. if he knew lebron was leaving he does not in no way shape or form take a pay cut. if money was that important to him he should of made the most of it when he was worth it and not expect a sweetheart deal at the end of his career

[Andrew]

I agree, though being a fellow player and a close friend, he probably understands LeBron's decision and doesn't hold it against him, even if he's disappointed by it. It's easier to be angry at the employer, rather than the former co-worker who had to do what they felt was right for themselves and their family.

I get the impression that it'll blow over, and Wade will (perhaps grudgingly) take the money on offer in Miami.

[Sauru]

yeah most likely its just the media doing what it does best and hyping a nothing situation. in the end i would like to see him retire with the heat, i always like when players go from start to finish with a team

[NovU]

It's way too early to tell what's going to happen. But it's going to be tricky to find ways to retain Hassan and Dragic as well, as they look to earn a big contract for the first in their career.

Wade will probably settle for 3 year deal at $40-50 mil. Not sure how Dragic and Hassan will work their deals. Deng is a goner for sure at this point. Kinda wish the Heat didn't pay Bosh home team max.

[air gordon]

yeah most likely its just the media doing what it does best and hyping a nothing situation

I don't. All these leaks/unnamed sources the reporters get their information from. It's coming from the players side (their agents included) or from management

I won't speculate if wade and James are buddies or not, but I will put stock into those stories about Riley being shocked/upset over James leaving Miami.

Riley is a shark. Perhaps the most disloyal of them all. Wade should know who is dealing with. It may be easier to be mad at his employer, but Riley played a main part of getting the big 3 together in the first place. He will be shrewd and cold again if he has to in order to be player in the durant sweepstakes

in the end i would like to see him retire with the heat, i always like when players go from start to finish with a team

I share the same sentiments. In this era it's unlikely to happen

[Andrew]

It's way too early to tell what's going to happen.

True, but not too early to speculate.

As I said, if it's about the money, if Wade wants to get that last big payday...he'll probably have to make do with whatever the Heat offer. He's not going to get more money elsewhere. Therefore, I only see him leaving if he decides "Alright, to hell with the money. The Heat don't appreciate me? I will take less, to go elsewhere. Good luck building around Bosh!". I'm not sure that it'd come to that, though. It'd be tough to walk away from that much money, and however miffed he might be feeling now, I'd speculate that he's got a fair bit of residual loyalty to the team, affection for the city, and whatnot. With that in mind, my guess is that he gets over it and stays.

[NovU]

I think there will be plenty of takers at $45 million for 3 seasons(though $20mil per season would be another story). He averaged 21.5 points and 5 assists 4 rebound this year. People easily seem to dismiss that he's still one of the best number producer in this league and a player that can win you games single handed on good nights.

If all teams offered similar contract, Wade will probably choose the Heat but I wouldn't scratch out possibility of JeremyLin-Rockets kind of offers from other teams.

Initial rumor of 3year/45mil contract is not ridiculously unreasonable for players of Wade caliber. Given his production this year, it's safe to say 'risk vs reward' is worth it for at least for next couple years. Worst comes he's a cap relief trade chip in his third year ala Jeremy Lin.



Honestly I don't mind Wade taking Paul Pierce's route and moving forward to other teams for better chance at winning, or for money it doesn't matter. It'd be a nice change of scenery. And I gotta say gordie has a really good point on Riley.

[benji]

I wouldn't scratch out possibility of JeremyLin-Rockets kind of offers from other teams.

I would, he's not eligible for a poison-pill contract.

And teams wouldn't care about those set by the current cap anyway since they'll go from poison-pills to mid-level contracts in two years.

[NovU]

I was talking in terms of getting overpaid, at least more than most people's perception of player's actual worth.

I think $15 mil per season for 3 years of Wade would get those same guys upset.

[air gordon]

http://hoopshype.com/free_agency_2015.htm

Maybe, maybe not there will be a big market. It will always be a legit concern for any team giving him a multi year contract for him to still stay healthy.

[shadowgrin]

you dont actually read what people write do you?

Best post in the thread.