Trade - Nets: Joe Johnson; ATL: Morrow, 1st round pick, junk

[uly]

the east should really build a strong team, of course they are on the same conference of the defending champions.. with the addition of Allen..

[air gordon]

The problem is that I don't see neither of them as a proven all star, but more of borderline at best even when they were at their best. And certainly I would consider them as over the hill players. There are lots of other quality players out there, possibly at cheaper cost. By that, I don't mean they're not improved nor their roster doesn't look respectable. But the cap space isn't appealing anymore. It makes it harder to sign Howard now, which I thought was very important. Certainly not impossible, but I think things could have been better if the moves were smarter. Overall, this is no guarantee team, more like the Knicks than the Heat, whereas the Heat knew what they were getting when they put the team together.

sorry, lebron james and Chris bush's arent available every offseason lol. Stop dodging the question- who should have the nets gone after? Who is younger/cheaper that was available? As the previous poster said- Williams wanted quality veterans. Nick young and Omer asik were not going to cut it.

And how likely was Howard going to the nets? Could prokerov afford to wait on something to happen? Ferry takes over the hawks and days later he was able to unload joe Johnson. Does deron Williams committ to staying while Howard holds the franchise in limbo???

And look at Dallas. Cuban for the first time goes against his philosophy and saves up cap for his offseason. They have struck out and now may end up with ramon sessions. Lol

[Andrew]

Joe Johnson (30) and Gerald Wallace (29) are "over the hill"? They're overpaid (Johnson more so), they're not going to get any better than they are now, but at worst they're entering the tail end of their prime. They're still putting up numbers that are fairly consistent to what they were posting a few years back.

[NovU]

H8 doing this on tablet.

Over the hill in terms of their best days being behind imo. Probably overstatement but not by far as their stats have been not too well recently.

Air gord. There r good players like gordon, green, hibbert, from top of my head whom they coulda gone after instead. Overpaying those with upsides would be a better option. And instead of one, its two overpaid players now with the nets affecting a salary cap.

[Andrew]

Their stats last season were about on par with the stats they've been posting for the past few years. Again, they are at worst heading towards the end of their prime. In a few years, things could be a bit more dire and their contracts will look even worse, but for now there's enough talent to contend for a low playoff seed.

[graybakflip]

The problem is that I don't see neither of them as a proven all star, but more of borderline at best even when they were at their best. And certainly I would consider them as over the hill players. There are lots of other quality players out there, possibly at cheaper cost. By that, I don't mean they're not improved nor their roster doesn't look respectable. But the cap space isn't appealing anymore. It makes it harder to sign Howard now, which I thought was very important. Certainly not impossible, but I think things could have been better if the moves were smarter. Overall, this is no guarantee team, more like the Knicks than the Heat, whereas the Heat knew what they were getting when they put the team together.

sorry, lebron james and Chris bush's arent available every offseason lol. Stop dodging the question- who should have the nets gone after? Who is younger/cheaper that was available? As the previous poster said- Williams wanted quality veterans. Nick young and Omer asik were not going to cut it.

And how likely was Howard going to the nets? Could prokerov afford to wait on something to happen? Ferry takes over the hawks and days later he was able to unload joe Johnson. Does deron Williams committ to staying while Howard holds the franchise in limbo???

And look at Dallas. Cuban for the first time goes against his philosophy and saves up cap for his offseason. They have struck out and now may end up with ramon sessions. Lol

+this

sad to say many people just look at the nets as a "forever-rebuilding" team.. it's not like that now, they've chased/targeted almost all of the super stars the last off seasons, starting from bron-melo-bosh-wade-amare(fire-extiguisher-killer) and so on..luckily they gambled w/ deron for a rental(now secured) for like 1 1/2 seasons..another info is that GM's of atl and nets(ferry&BK) were "luckily" the best-of-freinds, they were teammates before(forgot the team), so they've helped each-other out,atl save cap, nets grab quality all-star in JJ..i think there are no "proven quality star" out there w/ what the nets had this off season that could make deron likely to stay..

Joe Johnson (30) and Gerald Wallace (29) are "over the hill"? They're overpaid (Johnson more so), they're not going to get any better than they are now, but at worst they're entering the tail end of their prime. They're still putting up numbers that are fairly consistent to what they were posting a few years back.

great point about their consistency Sir Andrew..and also i believe that BK & proky intentionally(sort of like a plan) go over the cap so that they could build super team w/ dwight..i may don't fully understand the CBA/cap rules but as what the rumors/reports are saying, if/when they can find a 3rd team to receive humphries(dont know why orl dont want a double2 guy) + salary dump from orl(turk/jrich/baby), chances are good to go for the nets..

[graybakflip]

H8 doing this on tablet.

Over the hill in terms of their best days being behind imo. Probably overstatement but not by far as their stats have been not too well recently.

Air gord. There r good players like gordon, green, hibbert, from top of my head whom they coulda gone after instead. Overpaying those with upsides would be a better option. And instead of one, its two overpaid players now with the nets affecting a salary cap.

Really those are a good bunch of players, But then again every move BK made it's necessary for dwill to approve it..should they sign gordon(also his injury?) then loose dwill?(Dirk w/ what they had before is more interesting than those players you've said, he might choose dallas) about hibbert(, it's actually no need for them to take a shot for him, they have brook lopez(he may not be dwight, but he's ALOT more finesse on his offense), while they take chances w/ dwight(He Himself want's to be traded to NETS a looooong time agoo), these are well planned. about green, not sure what first name you prefer but they clearly want to resign g.green(best dunk last season), he was their "jeremy lin" and is so hyped to play again coming into brooklyn, sadly nets can't offer them more money even tho he stated himself that he might take a discount w/ the nets..

[air gordon]

Air gord. There r good players like gordon, green, hibbert, from top of my head whom they coulda gone after instead. Overpaying those with upsides would be a better option. And instead of one, its two overpaid players now with the nets affecting a salary cap.

gordon and green(jeff?) are big health risks. especially gordon whose games played have decreased each year he has been in the league. green didn't even play last year and still doesn't have a nba position. it is worse to give big contracts to 2 health risks

[NovU]

gordon and green(jeff?) are big health risks. especially gordon whose games played have decreased each year he has been in the league. green didn't even play last year and still doesn't have a nba position. it is worse to give big contracts to 2 health risks

That shouldn't justify JJ and GW's ridiculous contracts. And with those risks, they could come cheaper, and also younger enough.

Nobody's arguing that they aren't capable of making a run at the playoff spot nor a possible run in the playoffs. But the risk involved in these moves just seem bit too highly. What achievement do you guys think will satisfy the money and picks spent with the moves that were made? Number of wins? Dwight? Ticket sales lol? My opinion is that they won't come close to producing projected number of wins that both fans and management hoped for with these moves, in terms of dollars spent to buy a win, in which ultimately giving much less flexibility on cap space. As for another important matter of landing Dwight Howard, they possibly got further from it. They did retain Deron though. Do you honestly believe that this was the best they could do?

[air gordon]

What risks do you speak of? Green had a heart problem. Gordon can't stay healthy. Can you say with a straight face that is a smaller risk then paying proven players? Again, the Howard situation could have put the nets in a waiting game.

What is end game of the signings? Who knows. My guess is the new owner wants to put fans in the seats and start a winning culture for the franchise. You make it sound so easy to build a champion. Not every offseason ends like the heats 2010 anamolly

[graybakflip]

ok let's say nets didn't trade for JJ,and didn't resign crash..and they offered gordon(from what i've heard he wants to be @ PHX? and he's an UFA from hornets w/c whatever they offer might give)what would happen to dwill?(might leave to dallas w/c as a GM you dont like to happen) and jeff green?(Jeff Green might have a 40M$ offer for 4 years?hahaha making crash offer good now?) for a player who had what? heart surgery last season?, again, you have to overpay to get some "quality/consistent" players on your team if you want to compete..and gerald wallace/jj are proven all-stars(yep crash was once an allstar and all defensive team many times). gordon/jeff green(any other FA's) might have the talent, but IMO they wont be as good as what jj/crash is currently now and ever will be(c'mon this is not a game where we can make FA like lebron)..

and hey, 'bout dwight: "According to @WojYahooNBA, Kobe would be fine with Dwight teaming up with him, but doesn’t seem to want to call Howard.
Retweeted"

i still like the nets chances

[NovU]

What risks do you speak of?

Not meeting the expectations in win column for the resources spent. And possible loss of Howard though there was no guarantee.

Green had a heart problem. Gordon can't stay healthy. Can you say with a straight face that is a smaller risk then paying proven players?

Proven but at the same time not worthy of the contract. Again, it puts you in a perspective where you ponder where else those money could have been used.

What is end game of the signings? Who knows. My guess is the new owner wants to put fans in the seats and start a winning culture for the franchise. You make it sound so easy to build a champion. Not every offseason ends like the heats 2010 anamolly

Fans in the seats was half way done already with the relocation. I just don't think building a fringe playoffs is what they had in mind after all these shenanigans. The payroll is more comparable to contenders. Obvious enough intention here is to win. Possibly not the best possible action they could have taken.

[air gordon]

Expectations wouldnt be met if they offered a max contract to oft injured Gordon and heart problem green. how much better is the team with those 2 instead?? Does dWilliams even co mmitt to returning

Has Gordon or green even expressed an interest in playing for the nets????

maybe you are getting it- you have to overpay to get good players or get lucky with disgruntled all star forcing a trade. u nless you are the spurs. the only good players on cheap contracts are the studs on their rookie contracts.

[NovU]

Allow me to be extremely hypothetical just for fun sake, since disagreement is apparent.

Honestly I would very much max pay Eric Gordon(yes, I'd pay for potential) alone than having to carry both contract of JJ and GW. What GW brings to the team is something you have to expect from role players if you are building a contender. He should be the fourth or fifth or even bench player on the team under normal circumstances, and fourth ones should never get paid that much. It's plain bad. This fiasco wouldn't be as bad if it was JJ alone but coupled with GW's contract, it's a whole new story. In any case, JJ doesn't produce at the level he has been, the team will be stuck with two malicious contracts(in my book it's given that GW won't live up to the contract) rather than one. And that's what could make you the Knicks of the past. And this team also will need to re-sign Brook Lopez next season. That's three possible bad contracts. We possibly could be looking at the start of doomed era as soon as their new era opens up.

If GW was with the Chicago Bulls last season, playing time would have been truly scarce.

Going back to reality, I do believe this team is capable of making a playoffs with Deron Williams as a leader. I for one, want to see them succeed and prove me wrong. But I just can't see so much of positive vision that you guys are seeing right now, at least according to my thoughts.

[benji]

Anyone who gives Jeff Green more than the minimum needs their head examined.

The Nets could have only signed Eric Gordon to a max contract if they gutted the team to get cap space, the team never released its cap holds, and then New Orleans would have matched it anyway.

And this team also will need to re-sign Brook Lopez next season.

No, this season. Unless he plans on playing a year to become a UFA.

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_ ... oklyn-nets

"I was really close to going to Dallas," Williams, who signed a five-year, $98 million contract with the Nets, told reporters at Team USA training camp in Las Vegas, according to the New York Daily News.

"I actually thought that's where I was going to go," he said. "I had the meetings and it kind of changed my mind because once I got out of the meeting with Dallas and saw the way they were going and the team they were putting out there, and I saw that we just made a trade for Joe Johnson and I felt like that team for a longer time would be the better team.

"Joe got me over the hump. I've never played with anybody like him, a guy on the wing that can get his own shot and also get me involved and is a great defender. We could have one of the top backcourts in the NBA for sure."

[Andrew]

There you have it. Whether Williams assessment of Johnson's abilities is fair or not, it kept him with the Nets.

[graybakflip]

Anyone who gives Jeff Green more than the minimum needs their head examined.

The Nets could have only signed Eric Gordon to a max contract if they gutted the team to get cap space, the team never released its cap holds, and then New Orleans would have matched it anyway.

And this team also will need to re-sign Brook Lopez next season.

No, this season. Unless he plans on playing a year to become a UFA.

exactly

it's very simple, BK trade for JJ and crash in order to have a superstar coming into brooklyn this season, and unfortunately it did pay off(yup, sorry dallas)..and we all know that if you want to have a great team, you should have an owner that is willing to spend(i.e. lakers,boston,chi,dallas?(not anymore) etc), basically that's what proky/BK/deron's been doing this offseason..why worry when you have the richest sports owner(yep, that's not only in the NBA, i mean all of the other sports)..

w/ or w/o Dwight on nets, this Lopez guy is gonna be beasting this coming season, he's very undervalued(as what dwill said) by almost everyone..

ESPNChrisPalmer chris palmer
Kobe on Howard: “I want what’s best for him. Whatever makes him happy.”
12 minutes ago

what would that mean? kobe: go to brooklyn kid, LA is MINE..

[shadowgrin]

There you have it. Whether Williams assessment of Johnson's abilities is fair or not, it kept him with the Nets.

Having $25 million more than the Mavs offer doesn't hurt either.

[NovU]

My Jeff Green argument was an ugly one. I thought he would cost fraction of the JJ's contract, but looks equivalently ugly as GW's contract. Lolz. Had to avoid talking about him.

[graybakflip]

jeff green?why not this green?



bench players reaction amuses me

[air gordon]

disagreement is imminent because your arguments make no sense lol

If GW was with the Chicago Bulls last season, playing time would have been truly scarce.

for who? Jimmy butler. Are fricking kidding me? luol deng would have had the wrist surgery during the season if Wallace was on the team

i keep reading this "he won't live up to his contract" talk from. no shit, sherlock. players are overpaid. some live up to it less then others

[NovU]

The point was Gerald wouldn't even be the sixthh best man on the roster, and grossly is being overpaid for what he does.

And disagreement is imminent because your point is somewhat invalid. It's obvious the teams constantly have to overpay FAs but it doesn't make bad signings justifiable. If you think this was the best they could do, so be it. I don't.

[benji]

If you think this was the best they could do, so be it. I don't.

And what was?

[Spree#8]

I don't think that $10M a year for a guy who gives you 14/7/3 and is a very good defender is that much, in this league's reality. The length might be more of a problem than the salary, as his game is largely based on athleticism, but as of today, he's only about to turn 30 and should have at least 2 good years left. Right now though, I think his pay is fairly accurate, especially considering that DeAndre Jordan gets about the same amount, Jeff Green is rumored to be about to get similar money and Omer Asik will only earn slightly less than that from next season. It's really not even close to being one of the worst contracts in the NBA.

[NovU]

To me, he's more like a role player who was given too much money. Perhaps, it's accurate by today's market, but those excuses never stop to exist for bad contracts and was one of big factors why there was a lock out.

If you think this was the best they could do, so be it. I don't.

And what was?

I can't say for sure, too many factors(or non) to consider. But none of claims saying that this was a great move doesn't sound too convincing either. Most of them are along the lines of that these signings were necessary and got the job done which refers to enormous contract Deron was given. But the discussion sort of is moot as what's done is what's done. Time will tell if this was a good move or bad one or if they can make up for it by landing Dwight. Who knows.