What do you guys think about Carmello Anthony?

[maes]

It's because Melo's game got WORSE from his rookie year, where as Wade & LeBron made big improvements their sophomore year. LeBron & Melo went in opposite directions.

Melo shot the 3 at 32% as a rook, 27% as a sophomore. LeBron shot 3s at 29% as a rook, 35% as a sophomore. And the freakboy is currently shooting the 3 at 53% so far (!!)

It's the all-important "upside" that scouts keep repeating. That's why Melo didn't go until #3, even though his game was as good as LeBron's that year and far better than Darko's, people thought Melo was as good as he's going to get.

People STILL think Darko can break out...Dumars was flooded with Darko trade offers over the summer.

[air gordon]

LeBron shot 3s at 29% as a rook, 35% as a sophomore. And the freakboy is currently shooting the 3 at 53% so far (!!)

i hope he doesn't fall in love with the 3. he's already averaging over 6 attempts a game (and only assisting 4.7 assists per game)

[Bruce]

Hehe, I don't like Melo, that's why I'm really liking this thread...

Lebron at his age has far more discipline than Melo, until Melo learns that he won't get very far... evidence of this of course is in the way he handles off-court, his mediocre (avg at best) d, the way he bullies himself on onfense to create his shot. Maybe it's partly the fault of Denver coaching for not helping him polish his game.

[John WB]

Well, from what I've seen of him so far it looks like he's improved his shot this year over last year.

[Metsis]

You guys have said it already, but there's something about Carmelo that really bothers me and the rest of you too... It's hard to put a finger on it, but somethings missing... He seems like a kid lost in a mans world or something. He seems out of place... He does not have the demeanor of professional player... While on the other hand LeBron and Wade are oozing the stuff...

Carmelo just doesn't have what it takes, or so it would seem... Sulking in the olympics on the bench was a horrible vision... His off the court weed incidents are totally unprofessional and he just does not have that fire in his eyes... Every great player of any sports needs to have that fire than sense of urgency and drive in their eyes and I just don't see that with Carmelo...

If you look at Jordan pics from the 90's... You can tell, this guy is built for winning it all and the fire in his eyes tells a story of great battles, victories and defeats and how far he is willing to go for those victories.

To put it shortly... Carmelo does not look like a winner! That's what bothers me about him... That is what has always bothered me about him. He really needs to sort himself out and he needs to find that fire that will start to drive him toward greatness... Until then, I will continue not liking him, no matter what kind of numbers he puts up.

[Andrew]

At the moment, I feel he's very much a Glenn Robinson mold of player, not necessarily in the way he plays but in so much as he's a scorer that puts up other numbers, appears destined to make a few All-Star teams and will be a "name" in the league but doesn't posess the leadership or true "superstardom" that players like Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson, Larry Bird and so on enjoyed and players such as LeBron and Wade are starting to enter. Personally, I don't really like or dislike him as I do with other players.

[Matthew]

Glenn Robinson wasnt a bad player, but i dont see the comparison to be honest. It took Glenn Robinson years to get into the playoffs. In the 2 season melo has been in the league 2 season and the playoffs in both seasons. Just becuase he is a good midrange shooter doesnt mean he wont improve on other facets of his game.

I wish people just watched him play without instantly judging him.

[Andrew]

Melo's Nuggets are better than the Bucks of the mid 90s though. Like I said, my comparison isn't based so much on the style of game as the nature of those players and the tier they are in when talking about the top players in the league. But I also think there is one distinct similarity in that if you have to pick one facet of the game that Melo and Big Dog are good at, they're both scorers.

[air gordon]

You guys have said it already, but there's something about Carmelo that really bothers me and the rest of you too... It's hard to put a finger on it, but somethings missing... He seems like a kid lost in a mans world or something. He seems out of place... He does not have the demeanor of professional player... While on the other hand LeBron and Wade are oozing the stuff...

Carmelo just doesn't have what it takes, or so it would seem... Sulking in the olympics on the bench was a horrible vision... His off the court weed incidents are totally unprofessional and he just does not have that fire in his eyes... Every great player of any sports needs to have that fire than sense of urgency and drive in their eyes and I just don't see that with Carmelo...

If you look at Jordan pics from the 90's... You can tell, this guy is built for winning it all and the fire in his eyes tells a story of great battles, victories and defeats and how far he is willing to go for those victories.

To put it shortly... Carmelo does not look like a winner! That's what bothers me about him... That is what has always bothered me about him. He really needs to sort himself out and he needs to find that fire that will start to drive him toward greatness... Until then, I will continue not liking him, no matter what kind of numbers he puts up.

i don't understand how people have already figured out anthony. lol the guy is only 21 and entering his 3rd year in the league. cut the guy some slack and give him some time to mature.

lebron james and dwayne wade seem to be much more mature beyond their years but that is a credit to them, not a slight on anthony.

jordan didn't win his 1st title until his 6th or 7th year. up until then people questioned whether he had "it". the same could be said about shaq, isiah thomas, hakeem olajuwon, etc

I wish people just watched him play without instantly judging him.

i agree

the way he bullies himself on onfense to create his shot

so what's your point? it happens all the time. some players are just more physical then others. this is more of a credit to him if anything

[Scotty]

I definately think he's improved his scoring ability, but even though i go 4 Denver theres a few things that piss me off about the way he playes. e.g- watching players score

[Bruce]

jordan didn't win his 1st title until his 6th or 7th year. up until then people questioned whether he had "it". the same could be said about shaq, isiah thomas, hakeem olajuwon, etc

->I don't even have to check for the offcial stats but MJ, shaq and the dream were averaging in the mid to high 20's when they were 21. Thomas made 22 in his rookie year i think, each one of them very far from melo's 17-18 ppg, and 2+ assists.

the way he bullies himself on onfense to create his shot

so what's your point? it happens all the time. some players are just more physical then others. this is more of a credit to him if anything

-> for instane the hop step he always does, it get's him deep into the paint, but there is no bail out for that play... when he does that play either he makes that shot or he looses the ball. It's not very smart.
Most of the bulkier inside defenders need only to stand and raise there hands at the right moment. and melo would end up loosing the ball or forced to take a really bad shot.
Anyway, he TRIES to be physical, but he ends up forcing inside shots. Bullying on offense shaq stlye is effective, bullying melo style not.

[Metsis]

i don't understand how people have already figured out anthony. lol the guy is only 21 and entering his 3rd year in the league. cut the guy some slack and give him some time to mature.

lebron james and dwayne wade seem to be much more mature beyond their years but that is a credit to them, not a slight on anthony.

jordan didn't win his 1st title until his 6th or 7th year. up until then people questioned whether he had "it". the same could be said about shaq, isiah thomas, hakeem olajuwon, etc

He is only 21... I know, but he came in with a high profile and bunch of big promises... And he has not yet delivered. He does not show those exceptional traits that set apart the good players from the superstar players. He just does not have HIS game yet... He isn't remarkable at anything... He seems bland and uncaring about things... He just is. He's already had two years to make the Denver team eat from the palm of his hand, but he hasn't done squat to make his presense felt... He is just a scorer... He can put up some nice numbers, but that is it... He needs to wake up from his slumber and see that he needs to lead the team to do the things he is pressured to do... He needs to lead the team if he ever wants to be someone in this league.

Carmelo needs to find that fire within himself to push him to greatness... I just don't see it... By the looks of it, he is another Glenn Robinson in the making... A good player, but will never become anything spectacular. If he wants to be something spectacular and someone we will remeber 30 years from now, he seriously needs to find that something that makes him believe that he can do it... This is all in his head... The stuff he does, makes me question if really wants to play the game or not... He needs to find that reason for playing as he has all the tools available to be a great player, but he just needs to realize that himself...

There are plenty of people who have not been considered great in their early years, but have emerged since... Sometimes it takes time and hopefulyl Carmelo can find the key within himself and turn it hard and get it going...

But the question was, what do you think of Carmelo now? Wasn't it... Right now, he isn't anything spectacular... Will he ever be? Now that would be a great question and one that remains to be seen.

But right now, he is on his way to becoming the next Glenn Robinson... A good player and a scorer, but nothing more.

[putodelagoa]

I don't get the Glen Robinson comparison... How about Adrian Dantley or Bernard King?
What I don't like about Carmelo's game is his body language. He's deceively fast, a good finisher down low, explosive going to the basket, and sometimes he tries his post game. That's not Big Dog to me...

Now he just has to learn how to defend and be smart on the floor. Not an easy task, as his rookie like mistake showcased, after that shot taken with 15 seconds to play that cost them a Win.

[air gordon]

mdertz- it's irrelevant that those players scored more then carmelo anthony at 21. the fact remains that a lot of the nba all time greats didn't come in and light up the league and faced the same or similar criticsm that anthony is currently getting

If you look at Jordan pics from the 90's... You can tell, this guy is built for winning it all and the fire in his eyes tells a story of great battles, victories and defeats and how far he is willing to go for those victories.

yep, from the 90's. it took some time for jordan to evolve into the player he became

anthony has been shooting a great % since karl came over and is a frequent visitor to the ft line. i wouldn't say his style isn't working/is forcing it

metsis: anthony is a casualty of the nba and the media's hype. what were you expecting for him to do? what was he supposed to deliver? from the top of my head, only larry bird and magic johnson delivered right away, leading their teams to postseason success immediately

you're right that he doesn't have his "game" yet. coming into the league, his best asset was scoring- good handles, good strength, good first step but didn't possess top notch nba athleticism. has a good feel for a game but isn't a playmaker. am i missing something? was he all of a sudden supposed to turn into a great overall player once he set foot on a nba court?

lebron james hasn't made the playoffs in his 2yrs in the league and he plays in the "weaker" conference and with an all star center. the team has been "eating out of his palm" with no results

carmelo anthony has made the playoffs in both his years and last year, he was one of the major reasons, if the major reason, why they made it. there are no all stars, no all nba players, all defensive teams players, etc

him losing weight, buying into coach karl's coaching, settling less for jumpers is a step in the right direction

the glenn robinson comparions are just cop outs. i've asked this before why nlsc users compare him to big dog and they just respond "yeh well he's a ballhog like him"

[magius]

metsis: anthony is a casualty of the nba and the media's hype. what were you expecting for him to do? what was he supposed to deliver? from the top of my head, only larry bird and magic johnson delivered right away, leading their teams to postseason success immediately

add tim duncan to that list.

the glenn robinson comparisons stem from two things, the similiar stats:

carmelo
first year: 21.0 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 2.8 apg 426 fg% 322 3pt% 3.3 topg 1.2 spg
2nd year: 20.8 ppg, 5.7 rpg, 3.1 apg 431 fg% 266 3pt% 3.4 topg 0.9 spg

robinson
first year: 21.9 ppg 6.4 rpg 2.5 apg 482 fg% 321 3pt% 3.9 topg 1.4 spg
2nd year: 20.2 ppg 6.1 rpg 3.6 apg 454 fg% 342 3pt% 3.4 topg 1.2 spg

(judging from these stats, in fact, if robinson and carmelo were in the same draft class, one would say robinson has more potential than carmelo.... its easy for us to say that carmelo has more potential than glenn did ala he drives more, etc., but in truth that is more psychological than anything.... carmelo young, robinson old.)

the second is their similar draft classes. while both melo and glenn had excellent rookie years, at least one player overshadowed them.... in glenns case it was 2 - hill and kidd. in melo's case its bron for sure, wade maybe. in both cases its a point forward and a guard. strange.

in fact, in the future the bron wade melo (milicic?) draft class will probably be remembered as one of the best (on par with jordan hakeem?), and the kidd robinson hill would be like a mini-replica of it. hopefully history doesnt repeat itself, in that bron doesnt get injured, and wade enjoys playoff success. but unfortunately, personally, i do think it will repeat istelf in the case of anthony. it feels like he is content being good rather than great, and i dont think he has the work ethic to justify an improvement of his skillset.

[air gordon]

keith van horn and rasheed wallace have had similar stats as well.. i wouldn't call them similar players though

why would you use nba stats as your comparison for draft value? it's easy to say carmelo anthony has more potential then robinson because he lead his college team to the championship in only his freshman year.

what are you taking about- psychological??

[Drex]

Probably he's talking about the way they both play.

[Bruce]

the second is their similar draft classes. while both melo and glenn had excellent rookie years, at least one player overshadowed them.... in glenns case it was 2 - hill and kidd. in melo's case its bron for sure, wade maybe. in both cases its a point forward and a guard. strange.

in fact, in the future the bron wade melo (milicic?) draft class will probably be remembered as one of the best (on par with jordan hakeem?), and the kidd robinson hill would be like a mini-replica of it. hopefully history doesnt repeat itself, in that bron doesnt get injured, and wade enjoys playoff success. but unfortunately, personally, i do think it will repeat istelf in the case of anthony. it feels like he is content being good rather than great, and i dont think he has the work ethic to justify an improvement of his skillset.

what an ASTUTE observation!!! Milicic might be on his way on becoming the next Eric Montross (also in the same draft class) if he does not shape up...

[Metsis]

A lot of what goes on on the basket ball court is psychological... You might say, that guy is faster than that guy or that guy is stronger or that guy can leap higher or that guy can shoot the lights out, but it all boils down to psychology...

Look at Iverson for example... He's had his share of injuries and gets knocked around more than anyone else alive and yet he still keeps on pushing the ball and going to the rim relentlessly forcing the issue. The man just doesn't give up... He's got this game down 100%... If he were 6'7" tall, he'd be one of the best ever seen in this league... Looking at Iverson in his early years, he was fearless and didn't settle for anything and did anything and everything on and off the court to get the team points needed to go as far as possible. Iverson is an impact player... Even Shaq has said that it's amazing how much punishment the little guy takes during games and yet he keeps on rolling. It's all in his head... He just refuses to give up an inch of the floor to anyone... He has the psychological side of the game down...

While on the Carmelo subject... I see a good player, but no desire, no fire, no sense of urgency to get the job done... Carmelo won the NCAA trophy and has gone to the play-offs in his first two years... I'm not sure that that's a good thing... I think he's had it too easy. It's all been given to him and he hasn't had to battle his way up... Losing is a big lesson and it needs to be learnt. I think Carmelo would be better, tougher and would have been more ready mentally for the NBA if they had lost in the final match for NCAA title... He would have had to realize, that damn I didn't win and would have had to find that vengeance, "chip on his shoulder" or what ever you want to call it and get back in there and be a bad-ass player and show the god damn world on how this game is played...

Iverson on the other hand... He's had his sneakers handed to him at every turn... People have probably always said that he's too small and he couldn't do that on the next level etc. He's had to face that "you ain't shit" attitude his whole life and career and has had to prove him self over and over again to get where he is...

Everyone needs adversity to grow stronger on the psychological side... And if you aren't strong on the psychological side, you ain't got what it takes. LeBron came into the league as the "dynasty" guy... He hasn't been able to deliver it by himself... But yet he is worlds ahead of Carmelo since he has had to face people putting him down. And has had to grow mentally due to it...

After drafting Jordan, Rod Thorn said that "he's okay, but I wish we would have gotten a big guy..." The team was dissappointed to get Jordan... He took that chip and placed it on his shoulder and showed them...

Winning immeadiatly is no measure of how good you are... I have not expected LeBron or Carmelo or Wade or Bosh or Milicic to win anything after two years... All of the guys are still developing into the players they will be... But Carmelo does not appear to have that eagerness to get there... Or work ethic like someone said it... He is in no hurry to get better when he should be working his ass off to show everyone that he's better than LeBron... Better than anyone...

I play basketball on a low level, but still I can tell you that the psychological side of things rule all! If your head is not in it and you don't have that urgency and desire, you will not accomplish anything greater...

Carmelo really needs to figure these things out... He should find a reason to play harder, to play stronger, to play more "in your face" type of ball... That's what he lacks... That's what good players need to become great!

The window for becoming great isn't getting any bigger... Carmelo needs to get this through his head and do what he needs to be done. His window for greatness is still there, he just needs to make the jump... A leap of faith... He needs to believe!

[Balla69]

i haven't seen TOO much of carmelo's game yet,
but i what i saw of him projected visions of G-Rob,
its kool you guys saw that too

which sucks, because i love melo
Syracuse champ, Kewl Style, Attitude like Fark, I'm Fly and i know it

sorta like a young kobe swagger but weeded and mellowed

I can't put my finger on his game, but if he developes mad handles i'd think he'd changed peoples perception of him.

Michael Jordan, Kobe Bryant, Carmelo Anthony
my favourites!

[Balla69]

He's fat and he has way too much pressure on him as LeBron's sidekick superstar. He isn't a great scorer and I never saw why he got the attention that he did when he left college. He wasn't the leader of that Syracuse team, McNammara was. Carmelo just took a lot of easy shots in college. The Antoine Walker comparison is perfect.

That's the word. But he isn't as fat as he seems. Actually, he got in a pretty good shape this season. I remember being astonished when the reports from the 2003 predraft camp said that he had only 8% BF, and he only lost weight from back then. But that doesn't change the fact that I dislike him. He just doesn't have that true superstar thing going on, you know what I mean? It's that difference between players like Antoine, Stackhouse, Glenn Robinson (...) and guys like Kobe and T-Mac. He's simply not the shit.

i feel you

yea, but i think carmelo should just make it.
i think he is good for the league, by being himself.
and he did not take easy shots in syracuse

think about him being from a FRESHMAN
to being a 20+ a night kinda guy

just because lebron did it from high school and how good melo is

that fact gets shadowed a lot

i still believe in him

[air gordon]

this little psychological rant you went on. actually my response was to maugius comments: "its easy for us to say that carmelo has more potential than glenn did ala he drives more, etc., but in truth that is more psychological than anything"
does he mean it's in our heads that we think anthony will be better then robinson? it's psychological to be driving more to the basket??

While on the Carmelo subject... I see a good player, but no desire, no fire, no sense of urgency to get the job done... Carmelo won the NCAA trophy and has gone to the play-offs in his first two years... I'm not sure that that's a good thing... I think he's had it too easy. It's all been given to him and he hasn't had to battle his way up...

you cannot be serious. they guy has won at college's highest level and has made it already to the NBA's postseason in his 1st 2years and you're saying that's a bad thing. that is ridiculous

what has been "given to him"?? and him playing on a severely sprained ankle in the title game showed he had that desire,fire, sense of urgency you think he lacks

Losing is a big lesson and it needs to be learnt. I think Carmelo would be better, tougher and would have been more ready mentally for the NBA if they had lost in the final match for NCAA title... He would have had to realize, that damn I didn't win and would have had to find that vengeance, "chip on his shoulder" or what ever you want to call it and get back in there and be a bad-ass player and show the god damn world on how this game is played...

a college game doesn't make or break a nba player's career, work ethic & attitude. geez- imagine how much better jordan, magic johnson, etc would have been had they not won the NCAA championship

LeBron came into the league as the "dynasty" guy... He hasn't been able to deliver it by himself... But yet he is worlds ahead of Carmelo since he has had to face people putting him down. And has had to grow mentally due to it...

lebron james is obvioiusly the better overall player then him. but he's worlds ahead in what? receiving critcism? ihands down, anthony is the one who has received more crticism then james. i don't think lebron james has grown mentally as you claim. in cleveland's last few games while they were still in contention for the playoffs last year, it was lebron james who was ballhogging & turning over the ball.

Winning immeadiatly is no measure of how good you are... I have not expected LeBron or Carmelo or Wade or Bosh or Milicic to win anything after two years... All of the guys are still developing into the players they will be... But Carmelo does not appear to have that eagerness to get there... Or work ethic like someone said it... He is in no hurry to get better when he should be working his ass off to show everyone that he's better than LeBron... Better than anyone...

i see a double standard. earlier you're talking about "He's already had two years to make the Denver team eat from the palm of his hand". c'mon man. it's one or the other. make up your mind

are you reading any of my posts or are you just waiting for your turn to speak?? as mentioned previously, anthony was reported to losing 20lbs in the offseason, has shot 47% from the field since george karl has taken over, bought into his coaching, taken less 3's & midrange shots, and has driven more to the basket

The window for becoming great isn't getting any bigger... Carmelo needs to get this through his head and do what he needs to be done. His window for greatness is still there, he just needs to make the jump... A leap of faith... He needs to believe!

again, carmelo anthony is only 21. it will take time. many of the all time great players didn't win their 1st title until they reached their late 20's, early 30's.

[Metsis]

I'm not saying that losing the NCAA title is better than winning it... I'm just saying that Carmelo looks like he is asleep all the time and all that weed smoking can't be good either... He just seems not to care. He played with a sprained ankle... Who hasn't? I certainly have.

But what I have gathered is that during his NCAA title run, he was a part of a great team and had other people getting things done too and it wasn't like Carmelo brought in the title with him... Like someone said, someone else was the leader on that team...

Then he gets drafted to Denver which made considerable changes to get better and again he was on a team that was already good with or without him... The fact that he has made the play-offs during his first two seasons is pretty much about the team and not about Carmelo's personal ability...

I think it's great that he buying into Karl's system and listening to him for advice etc. You are never too young or old to learn more... But I think his eventual rise to stardom would make a huge upswing if he was put into a position where he has to carry a team, where he has to answer to the media why they lost again and again and how will they change to end all the losing...

What I'm saying is that Carmelo has never had to take the brunt of the responsibility of winning or losing the games... He needs to wake up and realize that this is it... This is when you have to take the team and lead it, to make something rememberable of himself... I think he would benefit from getting more responsibilities on the team... I think he needs to be challenged to do more... He needs that initial nudge to the right direction and he will soar from that, but right now, it seems he is just too content at being where he is... And he shouldn't be before he is the greatest player in the league!

You won't get anywhere if you don't aim to get anywhere... Put the goal too high and you will amount to something in the end...

[Balla69]

em, maybe you are making too much by presuming his demeanor.

i can see a little looking at a stoned kinda 'mellowed' guy might make u think he's a tree hugging hippy

but being a mellowed person by nature does not make a player better or worse.
i know vince as well is pretty laid back and seem like that

what you are talking about is presuming a more vocal and leadership role
lebron wants it, kobe wants it, because they like that jordan role. winning or losing on their own hands, own terms, shouldering the responsibilty

maybe you shouldn't be thinking he is content or whatever

has he told you what his aim was? how high his goal is?

i wouldn't worry too much about that right now, when the time comes and opportunity to step in and take that big shot/steal/rebound

he'll get the chance

[magius]

his little psychological rant you went on. actually my response was to maugius comments: "its easy for us to say that carmelo has more potential than glenn did ala he drives more, etc., but in truth that is more psychological than anything"
does he mean it's in our heads that we think anthony will be better then robinson? it's psychological to be driving more to the basket??

i meant its only natural that we feel anthony has more potential than robinson had because he's the young guy of the moment. no one goes up to your grandpa and says, "son, you have a lot of talent....", but i bet you that when your grandpa was younger they did (hopefully). remember..... robinson was drafted ahead of hill AND kidd, and jason kidd had an awesome college career. i also meant that the younger a player is the more people tend to make a connection between athleticism and a great driving game. i do not think melo is a great driver, but he has a good post up game. i do not think he plays like glenn robinson, but i do think he will have a career similar to his or jamal mashburns.