Lebron: Already better than Kobe?

[J-Smoove]

this thread will never die..

[The GOAT]

It was dead. For two days.

[beau_boy04]

Maybe Kobe is better than Lebron now but by next year we would all be chanting Lebron MVP!!!!! Plus, Lebron is becoming the youngest player to achieve all kind of stuff... youngest player to score 1000 and 2000 points, youngest to enter the league, youngest to record a triple double, etc etc...

By the way, why are we even comparing Lebron to Kobe? when in reality we should be comparing him to Michael Jordan? MJ at Lebron's age was never this good though he was a better defender.

Expect big things from Lebron in the playoffs and expect absolutely nothing from Kobe because they are out of the playoff picture as of now. And considering the way the Lakers are playing as of late I don't see them getting into the playoff. Bye bye playoff for the Lakers.

[Strike Freedom]

Kobe is still better at the moment..
It's hard to compare btw Lebron n Jordan at this age, i suppose..

cuz Lebron learnt from watchin MJ and other oldie players played and improved..
but MJ had to learn by himself..
He didn't have a pattern to follow..
But his offense skills is way better ...

besides look at these stats.. Jordan in his first 3 years...Did Lebron do that?
apart from assists.. Jordan didn't do very well.. but you know in the old days..
winning is more important..

84-85 CHI 82 games 28.2 pts 2.39 steals 5.9 assists
85-86 CHI 18 games 22.7 pts 2.06 steals 2.9 assists
86-87 CHI 82 games 37.1 pts 2.88 steals 4.6 assists

[fgrep15]

but MJ had to learn by himself..
He didn't have a pattern to follow..

Ever heard of a Dr.J?

[Fresh8]

MJ was the next Dr J... and many were the next MJ... lol

[beau_boy04]

Yet another distinction for Lebron (the guy soon to take the NBA to another level)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7454832/

Hollerrrrrrrr

[Fresh8]

^ good list most influential people is.. Yao was on that before...

[Chris_23]

this thread will never die..

[Dogg]

and yes, you call me a spammer

[beau_boy04]

No playoff for the 2 best swingmen in the league and since the regular season is over and you won't be able to see them in action until next season and this is my conclusion:

better overall shooter - kobe

better shot selection - lebron

better passer - lebron

beter post game - kobe

better rebounder - lebron

better scorer - close but i would say kobe

better court vision - lebron

better clutch player - kobe

better defender - kobe

[beau_boy04]

And these are the final stats:

Lebron
27.2 ppg 7.4 rpg 7.2 apg 2.21 spg .472 field goal% 35% 3pt Teams Record:42-40

Kobe
27.6 ppg 5.9 rpg 6.0 apg 1.30 spg .433 field goal% 33% 3pt Teams Record:34-48


Interesting note:
-Michael Jordan won the Defensive Player of the Year award once bc he was great in steals and others including Larry Hughes (leader in spg this season) is being mentioned as being the best defender this season. Now I don't know guys are still bashing Lebron for being a poor defender and Kobe being a better defender even though he averaged less steals per game... I don't get it.

-I don't think Lebron is better than Kobe right now but he certainly has better upside and that's why people are choosing him over Kobe.

-Kobe has better hangtime and creative and its a better dunker than Lebron. Also, remenber when your man Lebron backed down from the dunking competition? you can't do that man!!!! you're the most marketable guy in the NBA for God's sake.

-Lebron gets more rebounds because of his size and height and coz he's a small forward therefore he's closer to the basket most of the time while Kobe plays SG. Kobe is still a pretty good rebounder though.

-Just because Lebron averages more assits doenst mean he's a better passer. Kobe has been injured part of the season, so has Lamar and others and you can't blame Kobe for not averaging more assists, I mean what can you expect ? Kobe passes them the ball and they dont make it, who's fault is it? Kobe's fault? come on man !!!!

[fgrep15]

Yup, for this season I'd have to go with Lebron though because Kobe played weak defense this season, and he hasn't been clutch for the most part. Lebron has been more clutch than him, better in every other area, and though a bad defender, Kobe didn't defend well on or off the ball himself. Overall I'd still say Kobe is a better player, but that should change by next season...

Here are some numbers to chew on:

Kobe's best overall month of the season was when he averaged:
29.2 PPG | 7.3 RPG | 7.9 APG, but he shot 39.1% FG, 32.3% 3PT, and averaged 5.3 TPG.

His best scoring month he averaged: 29.4 PPG on 47.1% FG, 38.3% 3PT, and only 4.3 APG. Every month where Kobe averaged 6+ APG, he also averaged 4+ TPG. The 2 months where he averaged 7+ APG, he averaged 5.3 and 4.9 TPG.

Lebron never averaged up to 4 TPG in any month this season. His highest turnover average was 3.8 TPG, and he averaged 8.5 assists that month. The middle three months of the season, Lebron averaged 8.1, 8.5, and 8.0 assists respetively, to 3.3, 3.8, and 2.7 turnovers. His lowest assist average month was March at 5.7 APG to 3.3 turnovers, and he also scored 29.9 PPG on 45.6% FG and 34.1% 3PT.

His best scoring month quantity wise he averaged 32.3 PPG on 45.5% FG and 36.1% 3PT. Efficiency wise, he averaged 26.5 PPG on 52.0% FG, and 40.0% 3PT. His best overall month he averaged:
32.3 PPG | 9.8 RPG | 7.1 APG, and the shooting numbers I already posted.

Lebron knows how to handle in game pressure, double and triple teams etc, while also scoring, finding the open man, and involving his team a lot [and I mean a lot] better than Kobe. Kobe can do it well once in a while, but he's not close to consistent in doing it. They both recieve equal amount of defensive attention and pressure, but Lebron just does about everything better in those circumstances. Committs less turnovers, scores just as well and a lot more efficiently, and averages more assists

Lebron is just showing even more composure, and really surpassing Kobe in on court decision making already. Really if Lebron get's good man to man defense, I don't think Kobe will be able to hang on because he's already a superior all-round, and overall offensive player, and he's 6 years younger. Also if Kobe's defense, clutch ability and efficiency don't pick up next season it will put a lot of questions into how large his margin really was as the "best swingman in the league".

-Michael Jordan won the Defensive Player of the Year award once bc he was great in steals and others including Larry Hughes (leader in spg this season) is being mentioned as being the best defender this season. Now I don't know guys are still bashing Lebron for being a poor defender and Kobe being a better defender even though he averaged less steals per game... I don't get it.

If you actually think Jordan won DPOY because of steals, you better go check again. Larry Hughes is not a shut down defender, but depending on the matchup he can shotdown opposing SG's from time to time. He's a much better defender than just a stealer, stealing does not equal good defense, though it's a good part of defense.

-Just because Lebron averages more assits doenst mean he's a better passer. Kobe has been injured part of the season, so has Lamar and others and you can't blame Kobe for not averaging more assists, I mean what can you expect ? Kobe passes them the ball and they dont make it, who's fault is it? Kobe's fault? come on man !!!!

Lebron is a superior passer to Kobe, that's not even arguable, you'd only have to watch on game of both of them playing to realize this. Lebron has vastly superior court vision, and is a much more efficient passer. Kobe is not an efficient passer, he should not play the role as primary distributor because he's not good at it. He's really not near the passer Lebron is.

You make it sound like Lebron's teammates shoot 100%. A few things to note, Kobe has a fair amount of three point shooters, he can get a good amount of assists on three point kickouts. The Cavs have no consistent outside shooters, and no one who spreads the floor. The Cavs have Ira Newble, Eric Snow, and Tractor Traylor playing significant minutes, and none are know for their shooting ability.

The Lakers have superior shot makes to the Cavaliers, they have three point threats, and other players who are capable of making shots.

[Chris_23]

After I read "because Kobe played weak defense this season" I didnt bother reading the rest, since that was pure BS.

Kobe is one of the main candidates for the DPOY

And LBJ's clutch is crap, god how awful he was the second half of the season when he needed to BE the clutch player. Damn.

[GloveGuy]

The final games of the season are more important than the final minutes of one game. Lebron didn't get it done. Neither did Kobe. That's why neither of them are in the playoffs. The Cavs were looking to get home court advantage at one point, now look at their state.

On the defensive end, Kobe is still superior than Lebron. End it. Lebron might get more steals because of his physical advantages, but he's not the shutdown defender that Kobe is.

Fgrep, your stats and shit about Lebron's composure are quite meaningless, because there's no denying that Lebron fucked up. He should be in the playoffs right now. And don't give any shit about poor teammates and management -- great players don't lead their teams to such disgraceful second halves.

A lot of it goes for Kobe too, but when you look at it, this was his first year as the Man -- Lebron's second. Yeah it seems weird seeing that Kobe's been in the league longer, but he has just as many skills and attributes as Lebron does. They can both be great, but neither have demonstrated the ability to lead their teams and make their teammates better.

Game pressure, composure, and court decision are all irrelevant, because if what you say is true, Lebron would be facing Dwayne Wade and Shaq tomorrow.

And too add more -- I just don't see it in Lebron. Watching Kobe deal with failure in his first years in the NBA, I could tell that he was crushed and I knew that he was going to come back better, and that's what he's done. I have little doubt that he's going to come back next year knowing what he has to do to help his team win. Lebron just hasn't demonstrated that will to win, that competitiveness that great players exhibit.

[topballa90]

Lebron is better then Kobe,lol
Lebron being compared to MJ,lol
The NBA looks for the next MJ to quickly,let Lebron be Lebron

[fgrep15]

After I read "because Kobe played weak defense this season" I didnt bother reading the rest, since that was pure BS.

Kobe is one of the main candidates for the DPOY

And LBJ's clutch is crap, god how awful he was the second half of the season when he needed to BE the clutch player. Damn.

you mean because you went by NBA.com's garbage? Please, watch some games, Kobe wasn't the same defensive player he's capable of being this season. He played good in the beginning of the year, but in the middle of the season, and towards the end, he didn't play good at all defensively.

lol @ one of the main DPOY candidates, NBA.com just didn't know who else to put and put Kobe in on previous reputation.

I'm not here to support Lebron or something because I'm no fan of the guy, but the second half of the season, he played good, hit big shots, did a lot for the team. Though his defense was still bad, he was even criticized in one of the Cleveland papers on his end game defense. He put up 32-10-7 in the last month of the season when they were battling to get in, though they should've been securing a spot instead. The deciding game in their playoffs fate though was when they lost to New York with Lebron shooting 7-25 and 4-13 from 3PT range, that was the real X-Factor game.

GloveGuy I don't know what you're getting at, you made no argument at all, Kobe isn't in the playoffs either? Nowhere did I say Lebron was the most composed player in the league or close to is, I said he's more composed than Kobe was on the court. Just because he's better than Kobe at something doesn't mean he should be in the playoffs

To me the whole first year as the man thing is not a good argument. What about when Tmac can from Toronto and was supposed to be paired with Grant Hill, but was put as the main man on the Magic. He didn't falter and shoot low percentages, or commit a massive amount of turnovers, or any nonsense like that, and he hadn't previously averaged 30 PPG or gone to the Finals 4 times. Kobe is way too good and experienced a player for us to be making weak excuses like that for him. He's a fighter and he'll bounce back next season, but their's no need to soften it up, he didn't have a good year, plain and simple.

I really don't know what you're arguing though?

[maes]

Steals generally indicate a natural quickness and ability to play passing lanes, it doesn't necessarily mean you're good at stopping your assigned man 1v1. Bruce Bowen is always a DPOY front-runner and he has virtually no steals, no blocks, or any other stat.

As for leadership, both Kobe & LeBron are on bad teams. The difference is that people want to play w/ LeBron and there's talk of LeBron's presence drawing in strong Free Agents and coaches, even PJ. OTOH, Kobe drives away strong players like Shaq and Karl Malone and the statistically the best coach in history, PJ. Team leadership-wise, they're going in opposite directions.

If he can't get even Chucky Atkins to follow his lead, what hope of getting a young, actual impact player to?