2016 NBA Champions:Cleveland Cavaliers

[air gordon]

yeah i was referring to the physicality. seemed to me the officials were letting them play through contact for both teams. any specific mistakes you are referring to aside from the Iggy drive?

i was actually talking about Green. both he and Iggy have been the catalysts. Frye has been part of cleveland's best lineup during the playoffs but can't find much time on the floor because Green can defend him and will punish him on offense.

surprised no mention of the little physical encounter between Green and James yet

[Andrew]

I thought they were inconsistent in the "let them play" mentality. LeBron and Love both got hammered inside on a few plays, as did Green at the other end, and nothing was called. At the same time, they were calling some really soft fouls where the defender went straight up and made very little contact. And of course, there was the blatant missed call at the end of the first half, which resulted in Walton getting a technical. It's all well and good to pocket the whistle, but it seemed like they weren't sure what they wanted to call a foul, and what they didn't. Like I said, it didn't really decide the game or anything, but I thought it looked a bit shoddy to say the least.

I was definitely talking about Curry's Finals MVP credentials being less than stellar, so we obviously got our wires crossed there.

Green got inside LeBron's head, plain and simple. I don't recall ever seeing LeBron react like that. He'll complain to officials, but aside from that, it's rare to see him lose his cool as he did there.

[mp3]

isn't this 90's style of play your preference?

90s style of play? What, missing layups left and right, shooting under 40% in the paint, and launching 60+ threes? Not exactly.

I have no problems with the physicality, but the officiating was oftentimes inconsistent, illogical, or just downright wrong. It didn't decide the game, but the officials looked pretty incompetent, and that's certainly not to my preference.

agreed with green as the mvp. weak? nahh.

Perhaps weak is too strong of a word (ironically), but I don't think his performance has been particularly impressive. He now leads the team in scoring after that 38 point game (a number that was inflated by the stats padding at the end), and is averaging five rebounds and 4.8 assists, but he's also averaging 4.5 turnovers, hasn't shot the ball particularly well (especially by his standards) for most of the series, and hasn't really played MVP basketball for three out of the four games. If not for the play of guys like Green, Livingston, and Iguodala, the series could well be tied 2-2, or even 3-1 in the Cavs' favour. He hasn't looked like himself for 75% of the series so far.

Compare it to the great performances we've seen in past NBA Finals series, and I don't think it's nearly as impressive. Assuming he has a fine game in Game 5, I think he's got a legitimate case to be the MVP of this series. However, three very lacklustre performances and two good ones, including two games where another player put the team on their back, is not a particularly strong Finals MVP performance. Extremely weak, or completely undeserving? I probably wouldn't go that far, depending on what happens in Game 5, but like I said, it would be one of the weaker Finals MVP performances overall, compared to what others have done.

Yeah the refs to me have being terrible all year round and more so in the playoffs, I was watching game 4 and the Cavs Tristan Thompson made and up and under for an and1 in which he clearly picks up his pivot foot twice and nba.com was stupid enough to put it as the 5th top play of the day.

[Andrew]

I agree. The running gag is that they barely call travelling in the NBA anyway, but there have been some pretty egregious non-calls in that department, which look even sillier when they call travel on plays that are travels, but more borderline than what they've let go.

That's what I find annoying. Call it loose, call it tight, but call it consistently, whichever way you go with it.

[ThePointForward]

2K/VC jumping the gun with congratulating GSW too soon via 2K16's NBA Today

I called it.

[air gordon]

yeah agree on the non call at the end of the 2nd qtr was a big hiccup. for once it would be nice to see the players get a technical after they bitch/complain on a foul issued to them. Curry actually stops playing on a few occasions and ljames it seems has never committed a foul in his career and is always being fouled for each drive to the basket.

for these finals, i don't think a few missed calls have made the officiating bad overall.

didn't catch the groin shot by Green until the slow mo replay. hope he's not suspended.

[NovU]

the cavs should have won this game

i am beginning to think Lue and ljames are the problem. Irving isn't a PG. he's a scorer and he's been doing that efficiently in the last 2 games. he's even playing some defense. james is hesitant. he gets into the lane with single coverage and he still passes out. he can play that bully ball card anytime he wants but he doesn't.

My friend was telling me how LBJ became invisible and timid in this series and reminded him of LBJ versus Dallas Finals. He was only able to pad his stats when outcome was already decided.


I agree Irving is a scorer and not a pure PG even tho he plays the position. His Win Produced stat funnily improves among the SGs.

Problem with Irving is that he's one trick pony and average or below average in everything else he does. On nights his shots aren't falling, he's a liability. Other contenders virtually have better 2nd best players, and some have even better 3rd. KD has Bestbrook/Ibaka, Curry has like countless better teammates who are above Irving, CP3 also has two betters, Kawhi's team is balanced but Aldridge is still better than Irving. Imagine this team without LBJ. Irving as the best player, this team's lottery bound. And your best player(s) matters more in the playoffs.

[skoadam]

irving has played like shit in these finals. its like he thinks he can win it all by himself. point guard is supposed to drive the offense, not stall it

you cant be real point next to lbj...you cant be real pf next to lbj, you cant be real c next to lbj, you cant be real sg next to lbj.
If it will end 4:1 (im not so sure after green suspension) for me MVP is still Iggy.

[air gordon]

I agree Irving is a scorer and not a pure PG even tho he plays the position. His Win Produced stat funnily improves among the SGs.

Problem with Irving is that he's one trick pony and average or below average in everything else he does. On nights his shots aren't falling, he's a liability. Other contenders virtually have better 2nd best players, and some have even better 3rd. KD has Bestbrook/Ibaka, Curry has like countless better teammates who are above Irving, CP3 also has two betters, Kawhi's team is balanced but Aldridge is still better than Irving. Imagine this team without LBJ. Irving as the best player, this team's lottery bound. And your best player(s) matters more in the playoffs.

i don't dispute Irving's flaws. they just aren't glaring until Cleveland is out of the East. isn't the greatness of ljames supposed to make players like Irving and Love better than they actually are? shouldn't Lue not call iso's/at the least run pick and roll when they are on a scoring drought? or maybe not play iriving, james, smith the entire 2nd half?

let Love play like Love used to play + Irving + at the least a replacement level type player(s) with james salary... should be a playoff team

[CT4]

Gonna bet that NBA will kidnap all Warriors players before game,take random dudes from street,give them masks and throw them out on court just so NBA can get more money by having Game6,7 ,but Cavs will still find way to lose

[Sauru]

god i fucking hate how they call that that shit in the nba. james initiated all the contact and they call the foul of the defense. its fucking annoying as shit

[Andrew]

Well, LeBron and Kyrie both showed up tonight. Love did not. Tremendous effort to force the Warriors to close it out in six.

I will say that that unanimous MVP selection is looking a bit shaky, right about now.

[zz21]

Can't wait for Kyrie's new colorway rightly named "41 on the unanimous MVP's head". And make them all white cause lord knows they would look better than the curry 2's.


Edit: Kyrie turned 24 last month. Reminder for the next few years.

[CT4]

Well if there are people who still say Cavs have a big 3 then they are wrong.Love=non existent,last seen? In Minnesota.

[Sauru]

yeah love is getting a first class ticket out of town during the offseason

[stereoxide]

Max contract Barnes was non-existent in the 4th quarter missing wide open threes.

[Andrew]

Kevin Love's family hasn't seen a disappearing act like this since Brian Wilson had his breakdown in the 70s.

[Stress Fracture]

I will say that that unanimous MVP selection is looking a bit shaky, right about now.

It was a shaky choice to begin with.

[Andrew]

I do think Westbrook at least deserved a few first place votes, and there were certainly MVPs in years gone by who probably should've been unanimous - LeBron and Shaq came close, as it is - but more and more, it's looking like Green is the key to their success.

[air gordon]

Max contract Barnes was non-existent in the 4th quarter missing wide open threes.

Indeed. Seems like Barnes all series was hitting shots ending a cavs run or momentum builders for GSW

Hats off to ljames and the much maligned irving

[ThePointForward]

When LeBron went back to Cavs, I was thinking he should take Bosh with him (and I believe Bosh claimed he would go if LeBron wanted him to), instead of getting Love.

Then Bosh started having serious health issues and missed many games (including this year's playoffs) and Love looked like "at least he's playing".

On the other hand... it wouldn't really matter in the end.

[Andrew]

Should've taken Wade, if anyone.

[ThePointForward]

I don't think Wade would go...

Also he'd have two scoring guards.

This offseason I could see LeBron going after Whiteside or Dwight Howard.

[Andrew]

I don't think there was any way Wade was leaving either, or will likely be joining him in Cleveland this offseason for that matter. I just meant if there's anyone who he should've taken - if it were possible - from those Heat teams, it'd be Wade.

[Jeffx]

No love for Kevin Love. I actually feel bad for the guy.

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