Fri Dec 10, 2004 12:44 am
Fri Dec 10, 2004 4:43 am
Fri Dec 10, 2004 6:03 am
trubucksfan wrote:this post just got me thinking. It's kinda crazy what Kobe has done to the lakers organization. most teams in the league are trying to add talent to become a better team. everyone in the league would kill to have someone of shaqs talent to play alongside them. instead they are building down to make the lakers "kobes team" idk it just seems a little backwards to me.
Fri Dec 10, 2004 7:58 am
Fri Dec 10, 2004 8:32 am
Fri Dec 10, 2004 8:49 am
Fri Dec 10, 2004 9:25 am
Fri Dec 10, 2004 10:09 am
Fri Dec 10, 2004 10:23 am
Whats this Osama Bean Bryant thing? Someone fill me in please...
Fri Dec 10, 2004 12:47 pm
trubucksfan wrote:i guess if the lake show didnt have enough money theres really nothing to be discussed, i mean either the moneys their or its not. Buss is just being kind of weird saying he wants to get taht 80's style back, i mean whats more important, looking good,or winning a ring?
he coudl have got somebody real good in return for kobe to help his team win another chip' but i guess i can feel where buss is coming from.
i wouldnt want to be shaqs bitch after he calls me out all the time and resign him, mans got pride. your prolly right, if bryant wasnt such a villianous individual people wouldnt be so white and black about it thered be some more grey in their.
im ot one of those guys who thinks id be a great gm or something cuz there is alot of stuff taht goes on behind the scenes. your post makes me feel at least a little better about that situation. nice to see someone that knows their shit and isnt saying a bunch of senseless,emotional stuff.
Fri Dec 10, 2004 12:59 pm
Fri Dec 10, 2004 1:00 pm
MaD_hAND1e wrote:Whats this Osama Bean Bryant thing? Someone fill me in please...
and Dre, where did you get those quotes from? whats the context?
Fri Dec 10, 2004 1:09 pm
Fri Dec 10, 2004 1:12 pm
trubucksfan wrote:lol,BSPN,i dont put much weight into anything their b-ball shows say. maybe im arrogant but most of the time i think i can formulate a better, less unbiased opinion than they give.
Fri Dec 10, 2004 1:12 pm
trubucksfan wrote:yeah this thing has gotten way out of hand,from the headlines about this topic you would think that kobe said karl malone was a terrorist or something. the only thing he was trying to say is that with all the speculation about malone.its hard for his teamates not to be distracted and look over their shoulder everytime a new report about him coming back to the lakers leaks out.
Fri Dec 10, 2004 1:36 pm
Dre Naismith wrote:- Dr. Jerry Buss our owner was interviewed on Sportscenter and said plain and simple that he was ready for a change. He wanted the team to return to an eighties style of ball where we'd get up and down the floor, etc. etc. We weren't going to do that with either Shaq or Phil around.
BTW, Charles Barkley and Kenny the Jet Smith agree that Karl is bullshitting! They also agree with me that NOTHING Kobe said was wrong. I just heard them weigh in on this about 30 minutes ago on their half time show.
Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:19 pm
Robby wrote:Dre Naismith wrote:- Dr. Jerry Buss our owner was interviewed on Sportscenter and said plain and simple that he was ready for a change. He wanted the team to return to an eighties style of ball where we'd get up and down the floor, etc. etc. We weren't going to do that with either Shaq or Phil around.
Robby: No but they were going to win champinships and pretty much have certain playoff success which means extra games, extra tv exposure, and extra money. Now what do you think is more important for the owner: playing uptempo or success, fame and money?
We hadn't won for two years straight and there were no guarantees that we'd win anymore. Yeah, sure those guys would have been contenders for years to come but Buss decided to look at things critically. It wasn't just the aesthetic appeal of uptempo basketball, your points come off a bit inane.
Did he want to pay Shaq an inordinate amount of money until he was 39 years old? A sum of money because of Shaq's grandfathered contract status that would guarantee that the supporting cast would be of the Mark Madsen, Slava Medvedenko, Kareem Rush variety? Thanks but no thanks.BTW, Charles Barkley and Kenny the Jet Smith agree that Karl is bullshitting! They also agree with me that NOTHING Kobe said was wrong. I just heard them weigh in on this about 30 minutes ago on their half time show.
Robby: So you must be right if Charles Barkley and Kenny Smith agree with you. Charles also said last year the Spurs were going to beat LA and we saw what happened. He's also a guy who said he was misquoted in his own autobiography so he's not exactly a credible guy.
No that wasn't my point at all, I was merely pointing out that I wasn't standing on an island with my thoughts and views. It wasn't about giving Charles of all people this bulletproof credibility but showing that there are in fact members of the media who don't feel that Osama Bean Bryant did anything wrong. I agreed with their assessment and shared their views in the thread.The bottom line is this: Kobe and his court problems were a much much bigger distraction last year and guy who constantly showed his support for Kobe was Karl Malone. Even after LA traded Shaq and Kobe signed his big contract, Malone supported him. Now when the situation is reversed, what does Kobe do but backstab Karl. And if you don't see it, then learn to read between the lines. As for Kobe's apologies, John Rocker also apologized after his comments but that didn't mean his attitude changed; he had to do it for PR, just like Kobe.
Now you're comparing Kobe's comments to John Rocker of all people?![]()
Very vacuous on your behalf wouldn't you say? Yes Kobe apologized but because he was surprised at the outrage and fervor his remarks caused. Karl is full of shit, and if you don't see it then learn to read between the lines Robby.
How did Kobe backstab Karl Malone? Did you even listen to the link provided by yours truly? Where in those comments would you deem it being a backstab move on the part of Osama?Charles also said last year the Spurs were going to beat LA and we saw what happened.
Fri Dec 10, 2004 5:18 pm
Fri Dec 10, 2004 5:32 pm
Fri Dec 10, 2004 6:56 pm
TheCambyManVol3 wrote:Interesting. First Kobe was very respectful towards kareem rush and him leaving, wishing him the best and all that. With Malone though..
Question:"Your newport neighbour, Karl Malone, I know you guys run into each other when you two meet outside in your purple and gold bathrobes, to pick up the morning paper. Uh Whats Karl told about when he is going to return or if he is going to return?"
Kobe's reply: "Uh you know what I really don't know Mike. Umm, yeah, I don't think he's commin back though"
Ok this is really nothing. But lets be honest here, did kobe need to even say the last sentence? He said he didn't know... and then he says he doesn't think he'll return. Its a minor cheap shot. I personally would not be offended by it, and Karl has been known to take exception of things taken out of context.
But the whole situation is a whole lot of nothing. If Malone wants to go elsewhere, fine. Nothing can stop him and nor does he need an excuse. But did he really find it insulting? Maybe, who knows what Malone thinks. Kobe did apologise, but he didnt need to say it in the first place. Its a "situation" that could have totally been avoided.
Fri Dec 10, 2004 7:25 pm
The frustrating thing about Kobe is the fact that he really lives in his own little world, a "Kobe World" if you will. And in that Kobe World where he resides often times common sense never enters the fray. I'll never deny that he came off sounding like a jerk, especially with that "guys are giving ME 100%" bullshit. C'mon, Kobe! I thought maybe, just maybe you'd grown up a bit and realized that the planet earth will continue to rotate on it's axis even when you're dead and gone. But no, he's still as arrogant and self-involved as ever.....
But that isn't the issue here. The issue is whether or not he "Backstabbed" Malone like BSPN wants us to believe. And to that I give an emphatic and resounding NO. On to the issue of Malone now, it's just my personal opinion and frankly an assumption but I think Karl is full of more shit than your average port-o-potty. He realized that this was the perfect springboard to leap away from this team without looking disloyal to Laker fans.
Now, one might retort that he's a grown ass man who can do whatever he wants, so why would we need an excuse to go elsewhere??? That he's long in the tooth and his window for winning a championship ring is smaller than actor Verne Troyer, so why shouldn't or couldn't he go elsewhere to win that elusive hardware? To that I say check back a few months when he promised Laker fans that he wouldn't play anywhere else but Los Angeles Shaq or no Shaq. He's obviously a man of his word and didn't want to appear disingenuous, so now he gets a "pass" from his earlier comments as he weighs in one where he should go now to win.
Nothing of course, but when you're Kobe Bryant nothing is always something!
Fri Dec 10, 2004 7:55 pm
Dre Naismith wrote: "Bean" is actually Kobe's middle name.
Fri Dec 10, 2004 8:55 pm
TheCambyManVol3 wrote:Now, one might retort that he's a grown ass man who can do whatever he wants, so why would we need an excuse to go elsewhere??? That he's long in the tooth and his window for winning a championship ring is smaller than actor Verne Troyer, so why shouldn't or couldn't he go elsewhere to win that elusive hardware? To that I say check back a few months when he promised Laker fans that he wouldn't play anywhere else but Los Angeles Shaq or no Shaq. He's obviously a man of his word and didn't want to appear disingenuous, so now he gets a "pass" from his earlier comments as he weighs in one where he should go now to win.
Karl has a history of that. Remember in the lockout, he vowed never to play for Utah again, and he wanted to be a laker. How good of a team would the Lakers have had if that went through: Shaq, Malone, Rice, Kobe, Derek Harper (or fisher). But thats off the point. Malone has a long history of going back on what he has said, and im not hating on him. I think he has had the best career any power foward has had in the nba's history. He doesnt need to make excuses, although it looks like he has here.
So true, I forgot about what he said during the lockout. I'm not angry at Karl whatsoever just annoyed and disappointed.Nothing of course, but when you're Kobe Bryant nothing is always something!
That is so true... just let these guys play. Its sorta funny how Peja can say how he doesnt want to play in sacramento, and espn hardly follows it. Kobe says one thing about malone, and look at what happens.
Fri Dec 10, 2004 9:00 pm
MaD_hAND1e wrote:Dre Naismith wrote: "Bean" is actually Kobe's middle name.
So... is this to say that his pops real first name was Jelly? since they called him Jelly Bean Bryant... and his son is Kobe Bean Bryant.......
Fri Dec 10, 2004 10:59 pm
Forests of paper, miles of videotape and months of audio recording have been devoted to singing Karl Malone's praises. Oh, he took a few hits for not closing the deal on a title in Utah, especially with Michael Jordan literally plucking the ball, and thereby the trophy, from his grasp in '98. Some opposing players also have suggested he plays dirty, a justifiable allegation with all the knees and elbows he's laid on them over the years.
Other than that, though, it's been one long, 19-season lovefest.
And still it's not enough.
Who is more to blame in the Kobe Bryant-Karl Malone feud?
Kobe Bryant
Karl Malone
Proving that the Lakers are like "Law & Order" -- the names change, the drama remains -- Malone has replaced Shaquille O'Neal in the role of the Big Sensitive. Kobe Bryant is once more the protagonist, (note from Dre: shouldn't this be antagonist? Sorry...) this time for suggesting Malone's indecision about whether to play -- and where -- is unfair to the Lakers players he might displace. Bryant also said his "intuition" tells him Malone isn't coming back after undergoing knee surgery last summer.
Karl somehow took all that to mean Kobe didn't want him back. How, I'm not sure, but his response, via his agent, Dwight Manley, was: That's it, I really wanted to come back and play for the Lakers but now I can't because Kobe doesn't want me.
Malone would like the whole world to give him a hug.
What?
Now, I've known Karl for a while. We've had our share of private one-on-one conversations over the years. He's even taken me for a spin in a monster truck outside of Vegas and grinned like a madman after gunning it up a dirt ramp and catching air. I didn't scream, nor did I lose control of any bodily functions, but he got me and he knew it. I respect that he's made the absolute most out of his God-given talents, that he has a variety of interests outside of basketball.
But none of that leaves me any less perplexed at his need -- no, make that demand -- to be appreciated to the fullest.
This is certainly nothing new. Malone has routinely taken great offense to slights, real and imagined. Remember when he made it known that his hotel or transportation at the '97 All-Star Game were beneath him? Remember how he lost his taste for All-Star Games altogether when Kobe then waved off his pick?
Malone and Jazz owner Larry Miller routinely jousted, the dispute always being that Miller was taking Malone for granted. It was either an insulting contract offer or ignoring his trade demands or disrespecting him with a skit last January in the Delta Center that insinuated Malone missed being in Utah.
I chalked all that up to being in a small market and the lid coach Jerry Sloan keeps on individualism of any kind. Malone's transformation when he reached L.A. seemed to confirm that notion. He not only took an $18 million pay cut to join the Lakers, he accepted $1.5 million while Gary Payton took the bigger available free-agent slice of $4.9 million. His thin-skinned reaction to questions deemed critical disappeared. He subjugated his game without complaint, so much so that Kobe felt compelled to remind him he was the league's second all-time leading scorer. He openly talked about his and the team's struggles. He talked about how incredibly blessed he felt simply to be playing. He sounded sincere -- and secure.
He doesn't sound like that anymore. He sounds like someone who feels he's being overlooked again, which is extraordinary -- and a little sad -- coming from an 11-time All-NBA selection, two-time league MVP, 14-time All Star and member of the league's 50 Greatest Ever Team.
Truth is, Kobe's comments were exactly right. Malone is being unfair to the other Lakers by not making his intentions known. They are a young team coming together. It would help them to know if a player of Malone's caliber will be joining them. In fact, it's easy to hear Malone in his team-leader days saying the same about someone holding the Jazz hostage.
Besides, what's left to ponder? Manley says his client has recovered 100 percent from surgery and is ready to go. Who puts himself through the kind of rehab required to play again, at 41, and then opts to retire anyway?
Every indication from Malone, meanwhile, is that he doesn't want to move his family or play for another team. If he wanted the best shot at a championship, he would've signed up with San Antonio months ago. If he wanted to be a big fish in a smaller pond, he would've gone to Minnesota. If he wanted to play last year's role, he could've gone to Miami.
So why not simply end all the goofy intrigue? (And if it weren't still a mystery to everyone, including the Lakers, Kobe never would've felt compelled to say what he did.)
This comes off as another ruse to squeeze every last bit of courtship and love from all concerned. Malone even reopened the door that Manley slammed shut, essentially saying he wouldn't use such "strong words" about not returning. Which means for the right amount of additional love he'll go ahead and do what he planned all along.
No matter what Malone does, his official accomplishments as a player won't be diminished. His place among the 50 Greatest is secure. He'll have a plaque in the Hall of Fame. But in the unwritten annals, in the minds of those who keep their own scorecards on what players were, this latest little outburst assures that his thumbnail sketch will include: Great Player. Manly Man. Drama Queen.