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Postby Laker Socks on Sun Jul 02, 2006 10:44 pm

Can you elaborate further on that?

your comparing Lamar to Kukoc? :lol:
That is the worst comparison ever. :lol:
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Postby Fenix on Sun Jul 02, 2006 11:02 pm

Radmanovic-Kukoc is even worse. What are Lamar's strengths? Ability to play both forward positions + point forward, ballhandling, passing, playmaking. What were Kukoc's strengths? Exactly. Lamar is a better rebounder and defender, but Kukoc was/is much smarter player and probably a better scorer.
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Postby Laker Socks on Sun Jul 02, 2006 11:16 pm

Even worse?

Both Rad and Kukoc have the same skillsets. Lamar has a much different skillset than Kukoc. Kukoc has the same handles as Vlad Rad. Rad and Kukoc are both perimeter players. Lamar makes his living attacking the basket.

Kukoc was a point forward? Well, i've never really followed Kukoc after his career in chicago, so did he play point forward in milwaukee?

Again, Lamar's game is nowhere near kukoc's. that's not even debateable. as for Kukoc-Radmanovic, same skillsets, both perimeter oriented with the ability to attack the basket, both players dont stand out in the rebounding category and both cannot play point forward.
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Postby Fenix on Sun Jul 02, 2006 11:30 pm

Radmanovic's ballhandling is nowhere near Kukoc's.
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Postby Laker Socks on Sun Jul 02, 2006 11:43 pm

Really? It is compared to the difference between Lamar-Kukoc's handles. :lol:

When you compare players, you compare their skillsets and their style of play. Not just one or two strengths. :wink:

Anyway, you may not agree with me, but would you agree with this guy:
http://www.ibiblio.org/craig/draft/2001 ... ovic.shtml
More than 100 scouts and GMs packed into Hoops gym in downtown Chicago yesterday afternoon to see the private workouts of Alabama freshman Gerald Wallace and Stanford sophomore Jason Collins. However it was the third wheel, Vladimir Radmanovic who stole the show. The 6-10 Yugoslavian put on a dazzling show of shooting and ball handling that had teams buzzing by the end of the 60 minute workout. Radmanovic is the latest "hot prospect" in the draft. He has the size and body to play power forward and the shooting range and ball handling skills to play shooting guard.
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Postby Fenix on Mon Jul 03, 2006 12:07 am

OMG, RLY? He actually did some ballhandling drills alone in the gym? He's better than Magic! The point is: in games, he doesn't show that. I don't care if he can shoot 70% from 3 while taking a dump, he can't do it during games.
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Postby scrub on Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:44 am

I would be impressed if he could shoot 70% from three point land taking a dump. I mean thats pretty hard to do. To concentrate on a dump is one thing but also concentrating on a shot thats another.
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Postby kingtrobe807 on Mon Jul 03, 2006 3:04 am

In a day filled with innumerable twists, the local basketball landscape shifted, sighed and eventually settled as Vladimir Radmanovic left the Clippers for the Lakers, Tim Thomas left Phoenix for the Clippers, and Sam Cassell stayed where he was last season — as a Clipper.

The Lakers moved quickly on the first day of free agency by snatching away a piece from their cross-town rival and agreeing to terms Saturday with Radmanovic, a three-point shooting forward who has made a career of stretching defenses.

The Clippers reacted swiftly after Radmanovic and Cassell apparently reneged on agreements to stay with them, then reaching terms with the sharpshooting Thomas and making a push for free-agent guard Bobby Jackson as a backup plan in case Cassell left.

But Cassell, the 36-year-old point guard and undisputed on-court general of the Clippers last season, late Saturday agreed to a two-year, $13-million contract, keeping intact a Clippers nucleus that lasted longer than the Lakers in this year's playoffs.

Free agents cannot officially sign contracts until July 12. Radmanovic and Thomas must pass physicals before signing, which are not expected to be problems.

Throughout the day, Cassell was weighing three options: a two-year, $13-million offer from Atlanta, a two-year, $11-million offer from the Clippers and a three-year, $12-million offer from Denver. After learning Atlanta was the highest bidder, Clippers Coach Mike Dunleavy told Cassell to give him a number to get the deal done, sources said.

Cassell mentioned $13 million and Dunleavy said he probably could do it, but this would be Cassell's last chance. Dunleavy received approval from Clippers owner Donald T. Sterling to increase the offer, and Cassell agreed to remain with the team he helped lead to new heights last season.

The move capped a dizzying 24-hour period in which the Clippers were informed Cassell and Radmanovic accepted and then rejected multi-year offers, sources said.

Radmanovic, 25, later agreed to a five-year, $31-million contract with the Lakers, who used their full mid-level exception, the same package the Clippers had offered. Milwaukee and Phoenix are believed to have offered similar deals to Radmanovic, who can terminate his Lakers contract after the fourth year.

"I feel badly for the Clippers," said Radmanovic's agent, David Bauman. "They didn't do anything wrong. That's the shame of it all. They did everything in their power to sign Vlade. It's based on a gut feeling he had about his situation."

The Clippers recovered by signing the 6-foot-10 Thomas, who revived his career with Phoenix late last season and agreed to a four-year, $24-million deal early Saturday morning.

Radmanovic, who extends defenses by luring players away from the basket with his outside shot, has career averages of 10.1 points, 4.6 rebounds and 38.1% shooting from three-point range.

He chose the Lakers over the Clippers in part because he could get more playing time, his agent said. Dunleavy, in a phone conversation late Friday night, could not guarantee Radmanovic would be a starter.

"We feel very comfortable that Vlade's going to have the option to play with a bona fide star, that there will be an opening for him to start and play significant minutes at the forward spot" with the Lakers, Bauman said.

Radmanovic was also impressed by a conference-call pitch from Kobe Bryant, Magic Johnson, Vlade Divac, Lakers General Manager Mitch Kupchak and Lakers Coach Phil Jackson. "He thinks they'll win championships," Bauman said. "This kid is jazzed to be going to the Lakers."

The Radmanovic deal means the Lakers no longer have enough salary-cap space to dole out a maximum contract in the summer of 2008, when there's a slight chance big-name players could be available.

So the Lakers went with Radmanovic, who initially agreed to terms with the Clippers when they called a minute after the free-agency period began Saturday at 12:01 a.m. on the East Coast.

An hour later Bauman contacted the Clippers and said Radmanovic was having second thoughts and was concerned about sharing playing time with swingman Corey Maggette. Dunleavy, who could not fully allay Radmanovic's concerns, then went after Thomas.

In Game 6 of a first-round series against the Lakers, he made a three-pointer with 6.3 seconds remaining that sent the game into overtime. The Suns won at Staples Center and routed the Lakers in Game 7 at Phoenix.

Radmanovic is not considered a physical player and has problems using his 6-10 height to his advantage. He will, however, probably have numerous open shots as teams double-team Bryant.

Radmanovic felt underappreciated in Seattle and rejected a six-year, $42-million offer before last season, instead signing a one-year, $3.1-million contract.

The Lakers, aware that point guard Smush Parker struggled in the playoffs, are now expected to pursue a ballhandling guard with their biannual exception, which allows for a two-year contract totaling about $3.5 million.
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Postby scrub on Mon Jul 03, 2006 5:41 am

Now that Cassell has signed I'm convinced a little that Thomas may do well off the bench. Clippers look solid next year again probably reaching the second round.
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Postby Laker Socks on Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:25 pm

Fenix wrote:OMG, RLY? He actually did some ballhandling drills alone in the gym? He's better than Magic! The point is: in games, he doesn't show that. I don't care if he can shoot 70% from 3 while taking a dump, he can't do it during games.

Are you freakin serious? :lol:
Have you seen this guy play for more than 1 or 2 games? :lol:

He's just as good as Toni Kukoc when it comes to dribbling ability. That's not saying much because neither players have above average handles.

The point of this discussion is, Vlad Rad plays more like Kukoc than Odom plays more like kukoc. :roll:
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Postby Fenix on Mon Jul 03, 2006 3:06 pm

Actually yes, I have, many times and no, he does not. Kukoc was a playmaker and was able to score in variety of ways, Radmanovic more or less just a spot up shooter. Sure, both are 6'10, 6'11, white and athletic, but other than that, they don't have a lot of common.
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Postby Silas on Mon Jul 03, 2006 4:37 pm

Radmonvic chooses to be a spot up shooter. When he's at his best its when he attacks the rim, because when he does that he not only scores inside (which he's good at off the dribble-drive) it can open up space for his jump shot because players back off. Radmonovic can score in a variety of ways, he just doesnt always choose too.

He is a great ball handler though, hes just awfully inconsistent.
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Postby Jugs on Mon Jul 03, 2006 4:48 pm

Kukoc > Lamar and Radman put together.
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Postby Laker Socks on Mon Jul 03, 2006 5:10 pm

Fenix wrote:Actually yes, I have, many times and no, he does not. Kukoc was a playmaker and was able to score in variety of ways, Radmanovic more or less just a spot up shooter. Sure, both are 6'10, 6'11, white and athletic, but other than that, they don't have a lot of common.

You claim to have watched him muliple times yet you cant even describe how Radman plays. :shake:

Radmonvic chooses to be a spot up shooter. When he's at his best its when he attacks the rim, because when he does that he not only scores inside (which he's good at off the dribble-drive) it can open up space for his jump shot because players back off. Radmonovic can score in a variety of ways, he just doesnt always choose too.

Seattle was a team that NEEDED its players to chuk up 3's to win games. The clippers asked him to spot up which resulted in him shooting a lot fo 3's.

BUT, despite being asked to become a spot up shooter, this is a guy that cuts to the hoop and attacks the basket when you dont back off him.

What does her and Kukoc have in common? Offensively, both players run the floor pretty well for a tall euro, both players play facing the basket and they both can be effective even when their 3pt shit is off. That's because both players can attack the basket.

Yes, Kukoc is a much better defender and has better court vision than Radman but basically, same skillsets, same playing style. That's why a Radman-Kukoc comparison makes sense. Hell, even their expected role in the tri is gonna be the same, Kukoc opened up the floor and complemented the wing player(MJ) and the initiatior(Pip), Vlad Rad is expected to have the same role. Now do you understand?

Kukoc > Lamar and Radman put together

Please elaborate further.
It sounds stupid considering Lamar>Kukoc
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Postby Dean on Mon Jul 03, 2006 6:02 pm

Hes bandwagoning the Croatian guy.
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Postby Jugs on Mon Jul 03, 2006 6:08 pm

Bandwagon? No, not really.

But, in terms of success, Kukoc > Lamar.
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Postby Laker Socks on Mon Jul 03, 2006 9:21 pm

Well, in terms of success Kukoc>Duncan so that's not saying much. :lol:
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Postby Drex on Tue Jul 04, 2006 11:11 am

In terms of winning as a role player, Kukoc > Lamar
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Postby Laker Socks on Tue Jul 04, 2006 6:30 pm

And so? What does that prove? :roll:

In terms of winning as a role player, Steve Kerr > Lamar Odom.

Does that prove anything?

Jesus. :shake:
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Postby gergerjai on Tue Jul 04, 2006 10:57 pm

winning aside, Odom really hasnt shown that hes a better player than kukoc was :?
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Postby jonnyboy261 on Wed Jul 05, 2006 1:26 am

:delete:
Last edited by jonnyboy261 on Fri Aug 11, 2006 3:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Silas on Wed Jul 05, 2006 2:06 am

Smush will start unless they find someone different. The lakers GM said he wasnt expecting to give Farmar much playing time because he's only 19.
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Postby Drex on Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:04 am

Steve Kerr > Lamar Odom

Odom doesn't play like Kerr. Odom plays like Kukoc. Stay on-topic :crazy:
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Postby BlueHornet on Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:58 am

[quote="Fenix"]point forward, quote] What the hell is a point forward. you mean power forward?
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Postby Jackal on Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:38 am

Scottie Pippen, Kevin Garnett and Lamar Odom can be classified as "point forwards". Basically they are Forwards, but handle the responsibility of bringing up the ball and setting up the offense. No one has ever been as good as Pippen was, but the point was to mold Odom into that kind of role for the Lakers.

Hence the Point Gaurd + (Small/Power) Forward = Point Forward. No need to be that hostile.
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