MVP Race 2017

[I Hate Mondays]

Meh, even though Westbrook will win the MVP this season, I am cheering for Harden. Sure, people enjoy good scenarios. "Look at him and what he can do without Durant. He is carrying his team. He broke the record!!" etc. etc. He averages a triple-double, that's outstanding (even though half of his rebounds this season were allowed by his bigman teammates. They know what was going on, the historic figures Westbrook was going for, so they'd often step away from a rebound to let Russel grab the board). Put Harden in his exact same spot, the outcome might've been the same.
Even though Harden plays for a team with a totally different feel for the game, his stats are very, very similar. He's only two boards/game shy from averaging a triple-duble by himself. That's because he know his role and lets other guys do the boards work. He lead a team to the 3rd place in the WC. He leads the 2nd best offense in the NBA right now (the Thunder are at the 16th spot). I do agree with the beard, even though I am no bandwagoner. Winning is more important. At the end of the day, hero-ball teams have 0 chances in the playoffs. Smart offensive playsets(while still mantaining a high usage rate for the best player on the team, just not hero ball) have better chances.

[Phil89]

Or maybe his teammates just know how good he is at setting up transition scoring opportunities when he gets the ball in his hands quickly. OKC are 3rd in the NBA for fastbreak points this season.

Besides, Westbrook doesn't need any help to get rebounds. Guy is an insane competitor for his size.

[air gordon]

So really- how many of the rebounds Westbrook's teammates gave him? And howany turned into miscommunication and the opponent got the rebound instead?

Or how about rebounds from missed free throws? Should we discount those?

[Dee4Three]

Donovan said he likes Westbrook getting the rebound and starting the break, he is unstoppable on the break.

Not even counting stats, lets forget stats for a moment. Lets say his stats were exactly the same as Harden, Westbrook is still my MVP. Him leading THAT TEAM to almost 50 wins, with the injuries they sustained (Oladipo missing 16 games, and Kanter missing 11 games), is amazing. The current Rockets roster without Harden is still formidable, they have so many good pieces.

Westbrooks all out leadership and effort, in my opinion, is unmatched this season. Harden is a fantastic runner up, and had a great season.

[I Hate Mondays]

Or how about rebounds from missed free throws? Should we discount those?

Yeah those were awesome. I should've left the rebound part out of my statement. Still in for the other part of my post.

Deep4three, I get you man but that's just my opinion. I see Westbrook as a terrific player, but I think Harden could've done the same things in his spot, with the same injured teammates. Carrying a bad team to the playoffs is irrelevant for legit MVP voters. (see Anthony Davis a couple of years ago).

Phil89, you probably want to punch me right now, lol. I've been discrediting Westbrook in the same threads you post since the beginning of the season. Sorry man, I have to see Westbrook carry his team in the playoffs vs. the Rockets, that's the only way I'm keeping my mouth shut for good. Bonus, will change my profile pic and use a Westbrook pic as a tribute if that happens.

[Dee4Three]

That is where we differ.

I think if you swapped them, the Thunder would not be nearly as good. Harden is surrounded by many veterans (Ariza, Nene, Ryan Anderson, Lou Williams, Even Eric Gordon now), all of those guys play important roles on the team. I think the veterans take to Harden much better, he has guys around him that have been around awhile, know how to handle him, and just flatout know how to play.

Taj Gibson didn't come to the Thunder until later in the season, but he is really the only veteran presence on that team that logs a decent amount of minutes. Even Steven Adams is only 23. I think Hardens demeanor and play style wouldn't have fit as well in OKC if you swapped them, as in, I don't think they are a 40 win team with Harden.

So, not only do I think Westbrook deserves it because I legit think he is the best player in the league, but I think if you swap places, the Thunder do worse, and Westbrook still wins 50 with the Rockets.

Again, Harden was awesome this season. But I think Westbrook on ANY team with his energy, and leadership, would be a very good team.

[Dee4Three]

I also want to mention Westbrooks intensity on Defense. When you watch both play, Westbrook is making plays on the defensive end, which fires his team up in a big way. If Westbrook gets beat, it's not because of effort or him getting lost.

I love Westbrook on both sides of the ball, I can't say the same for Harden.

Harden on defense is basically the NBA 2K17 defense for most of the game.

[Stress Fracture]

If Westbrook wins this year, you gotta have to wonder why Harden didn't win it in 2015. Except the triple double average, he literally dragged Houston to the 2nd seed that year with key players missing bunches of games.

Call me a homer or what, but it is just like that.

[BPDHoplite]

Jimmer Fredette!!!!!! Didn't specify which league

[Phil89]

Phil89, you probably want to punch me right now, lol. I've been discrediting Westbrook in the same threads you post since the beginning of the season. Sorry man, I have to see Westbrook carry his team in the playoffs vs. the Rockets, that's the only way I'm keeping my mouth shut for good. Bonus, will change my profile pic and use a Westbrook pic as a tribute if that happens.

Not at all. The point of this forum is to debate and discuss stuff like this.

It just kinda annoys me when people feel the need to criticize Westbrook in order to argue Harden's case for MVP. Fact is they both deserve it this year. Co-MVP would actually be really cool (if possible).

Btw I'd have no problem if Harden wins it. I just personally feel that Westbrook deserves it more.

If Westbrook wins this year, you gotta have to wonder why Harden didn't win it in 2015. Except the triple double average, he literally dragged Houston to the 2nd seed that year with key players missing bunches of games.

Call me a homer or what, but it is just like that.

I agree, that's a valid point.

But it's unfair to use that as an argument against Russ winning it this year. It's not his fault the voters did what they did in 2015.

[Andrew]

If Westbrook wins this year, you gotta have to wonder why Harden didn't win it in 2015. Except the triple double average, he literally dragged Houston to the 2nd seed that year with key players missing bunches of games.

Call me a homer or what, but it is just like that.

Harden definitely had a case in 2015, but as you noted, he didn't have an historically significant season numbers-wise. It's definitely a factor, as it emphasises just how much Westbrook did for the team this year, how such an impressive all-around effort led the Thunder to the record they've managed. Also, while key players for the Rockets did miss chunks of the 2015 season, it'd still be fair to say that their roster was better than this year's Thunder squad.

Beyond that though, all eyes were on the 67-15 Warriors, and Stephen Curry's step up from "guy who can really shoot" to "guy who can carry a team to a great record"; the best in team history, until they went 73-9 the very next season. It's unfortunate for Harden that his strongest MVP bids have come in seasons where another player has done something really impressive and has a strong case for MVP themselves.

[Phil89]

Cool to see Oscar Robertson at the game in OKC tonight. He gave his vote on the MVP (or maybe he was just playing to the crowd lol)

phpBB [video]

[Phil89]

Do we really have to wait until June 26th to find out who won? That seems pretty ridiculous.

[air gordon]

More money opportunities for the league

I do wonder how much better Westbrook would be if he was afforded the spacing harden has

No slight on harden of course. Its more a selling point for Westbrook. Aside from dipo, there isn't much shooting out there. Lol kinda reminds of Dominique Wilkins storming down the lane while lane cloggers like tree Rollins, Kevin Willis, and cliff Levingston are getting out of the way

[Phil89]

Enes Kanter wrote an article in support of Russ winning MVP.

It explains a bit about Westbrook the person/teammate, rather than just focussing on the stats of Westbrook the player.

[Murat]

This shows me how great a team they are. They are all united for a man's MVP chance, not even considering about their careers. Kanter and Adams could take the rebounds themselves for a possible fat contract, but instead they help Westbrook.

Enes is a villain in his homeland, but props to the guy

[Kevin]

Enes is a villain in his homeland, but props to the guy

Was this because of his drama about his father?

Westbeast will probably win the MVP, no doubt.

[Murat]

Enes is a villain in his homeland, but props to the guy

Was this because of his drama about his father?

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/1711 ... th-threats