Chicago Bulls Thread

[Andrew]

Would you be in favour of bottoming out and trading away Butler along with everyone else, assuming of course they could actually get some unprotected picks or something reasonably good for him?

[air gordon]

Would you be in favour of bottoming out and trading away Butler along with everyone else, assuming of course they could actually get some unprotected picks or something reasonably good for him?

Yes

[Valor]

Would you be in favour of bottoming out and trading away Butler along with everyone else, assuming of course they could actually get some unprotected picks or something reasonably good for him?

Yes

Yes +1

Assuming they fire GarPax and Hoiberg as well of course.

[Andrew]

I'm admittedly hesitant to give up on Butler and I'm doubtful they'd actually pull off a good deal, but if it gets rid of GarPax...well, it might just be worth it. Starting over would be painful, but in some ways, perhaps it'd be less painful than these bandaid fixes that offer a glimmer of hope, but ultimately don't pan out.

[NovU]

I dunno. I wouldn't trade Butler. In my world, he is close to unmovable if the purpose is solely to tank like 76ers did. Because it beats the purpose. Entire lottery rebuilding process is to get someone like Butler and build upon it. Giving up on superstar in prime prematurely usually dont pan out too well in hindsight. Keep him and explore ways to tank with him on roster. The Heat did it with young Wade and got Beasley. In fact, you can tank smartly even with superstar on roster and rebuild. For instance, you can lose via simply tweaking rotations. Teams been doing it for decades in subtle manner. Isnt Butler's talent way too hard to come by to give up?

[Andrew]

My preference at this point would be to keep him, and only trade him if it's going to bring them some great talent in return (more likely eventually, through unprotected lottery picks). But I do see the merit in what AG and Valor are suggesting. If they did go for a full rebuild, then there's a good chance their hand would be forced with him anyway, since it's unlikely he wants to be a part of that as he's entering his prime.

If nothing else, Rondo needs to go, and to really rebuild properly, GarPax need to go as well. The former seems quite likely, but the latter, unfortunately, does not. Credit where it's due: they've made some good picks, a couple of trades have been alright, and as far as their recent history is concerned, I think it was worth rolling the dice on Wade (Rondo, clearly not so much). They even hired Thibs in the first place, so you've got to give them that. However, even if they have shown some competence in their moves, they've also had plenty of bad ones, and contributed to the dysfunction with their power plays and pettiness. Yet, they're still in charge.

That's the nagging thought I have. Even if they did blow everything up and bottom out, could they do anything worthwhile after that? Would their reign of terror come to an end, and someone else get a chance? How many more bad years and mistakes would have to be endured before they were sent packing?

[Moz]

That's the nagging thought I have. Even if they did blow everything up and bottom out, could they do anything worthwhile after that? Would their reign of terror come to an end, and someone else get a chance? How many more bad years and mistakes would have to be endured before they were sent packing?

If you'll ask Jerry Krause probably if their body can't take anymore the rigors and stress of the job that they're having health issues because of it and thus the only option is for them to resign...

Forman already hinted that he doesn't want to go on full rebuild (or perhaps Reinsdorf just don't want to) so perhaps we'll just see them keep on reloading the roster for the sake of having a playoff bound team. Although they said back then that they'll not fire Thibs... There's a pretty tempting standing offer from the Celtics for Butler (Crowder, Smart + 1st rounds from Nets for 2017 and 2018) so let's see what will happen on the trade deadline.

[air gordon]

Take that deal and run

Forman already hinted that he doesn't want to go on full rebuild (or perhaps Reinsdorf just don't want to) so perhaps we'll just see them keep on reloading the roster for the sake of having a playoff bound team. Although they said back then that they'll not fire Thibs... There's a pretty tempting standing offer from the Celtics for Butler (Crowder, Smart + 1st rounds from Nets for 2017 and 2018) so let's see what will happen on the trade deadline.

Firman doesn't want to rebuild because it would be admitting failure in the roster he built and the coach he hired.... which should get him fired

I dunno. I wouldn't trade Butler. In my world, he is close to unmovable if the purpose is solely to tank like 76ers did. Because it beats the purpose. Entire lottery rebuilding process is to get someone like Butler and build upon it. Giving up on superstar in prime prematurely usually dont pan out too well in hindsight. Keep him and explore ways to tank with him on roster. The Heat did it with young Wade and got Beasley. In fact, you can tank smartly even with superstar on roster and rebuild. For instance, you can lose via simply tweaking rotations. Teams been doing it for decades in subtle manner. Isnt Butler's talent way too hard to come by to give up?

Fair point. Finding another player equal to butlers talent in the lottery is no guarantee. However I have no faith in the current management to build around butler and the new cba makes it difficult to sign away the would be FA's from their current team. Roll the dice on the Brooklyn picks

They already wasted one year now. This season is irrelevant. Should have blown it up after Rose was traded

[Andrew]

Snagging a superstar in free agency is easy. All you have to do is come back from 3-1 down to beat them, and they'll jump ship at the first chance.

Of course, that does require making the Playoffs first. Plan B, GarPax. Or whatever letter we're up to now.

[Valor]

So apparently we've sunk as low as the Dolan-run Knicks, cause GarPax are doing the same shit - spying on the players. Randy Brown you bloody snake. Fire everybody I say, EVERYBODY. All the coaches, all the assistants, the entire front office, I don't even want the same cleaners there, this is absolutely disgraceful.

and if that wasn't enough...there's more. Apparently GarPax wanted Thibs to play Tony Snell over Jimmy Butler because Butler didn't agree to the cheap extension offer before restricted FA so his value will drop

[Andrew]

Randy Brown-Noser, amirite?

Just so incredibly low and despicable.

[Valor]

Randy Brown-Noser, amirite?

Just so incredibly low and despicable.

Nicely done.

I know Reinsdorf never fires his Managers, whether it's with the White Sox or the Bulls, but he has got to bloody step in this time and clean house. If he doesn't I don't think we'll be anywhere near #7 for the next decade.

[Andrew]

I can't imagine it's an appealing scenario for free agents.

[Valor]

I can't imagine it's an appealing scenario for free agents.

No, definitely not. I mean if I was a FA I wouldn't go after hearing this story, and I love the Bulls.

Here's the story in written form for those who might not want/be able to listen to the audio

[Andrew]

Interesting to see people disbelieving the story in the comments on that article. I mean, I guess we can't verify it's accuracy 100%, but given all the other stories that have emerged over the years - and the fact they date back to previous front office regimes in the championship years - it's more than plausible to say the least. I'm certainly inclined to believe it.

[Valor]

Interesting to see people disbelieving the story in the comments on that article. I mean, I guess we can't verify it's accuracy 100%, but given all the other stories that have emerged over the years - and the fact they date back to previous front office regimes in the championship years - it's more than plausible to say the least. I'm certainly inclined to believe it.

I'm pretty much laughing at how ignorant people are when they begin to defend GarPax, whether it's on realgm or comment sections of facebook posts.

[Andrew]

In all fairness, some of them might not be actively defending GarPax as much as questioning whether or not this particular story is accurate, or exaggerated. That said, I'm not sure why any Bulls fans would be inclined to disbelieve it, at this point in time.

[Valor]

In all fairness, some of them might not be actively defending GarPax as much as questioning whether or not this particular story is accurate, or exaggerated. That said, I'm not sure why any Bulls fans would be inclined to disbelieve it, at this point in time.

That's fair, but yeah I dunno why they would question it. It's not that far fetched when you consider how Paxson once got into a fight with the coach he hired....or fired Ron Adams purely to mess with Thibodeau.

[mp3]

I think what I mean by my practice comment is I wonder what level of involvement he has with practice, some veterans who have being told they don't need to practice today don't turn up at all while others are there at training and being vocal.

[air gordon]

Ok fair enough, MP3

More oil on the fire! Yes!

Butler shook it off when asked about it. He could have left no doubt by denying it flat out but I don't see him do any favors for management at this point haha

What's interesting to me is that something like this was leaked to the media. Isn't this resillio guy an ESPN guy/national guy?

I believe there is some truth to the story. I wouldn't put it past those clowns to try something like that. Butler was up there as amongst leaders in minutes played so Thibs put that snell garbage talk to rest quick


Hey Valor-
Reinsdorf finally committed to a full rebuild with the Sox. Kahn looks like he is finally in charge. There's still hope!

[Valor]

Hey Valor-
Reinsdorf finally committed to a full rebuild with the Sox. Kahn looks like he is finally in charge. There's still hope!

Well, it only took the Cubs winning the title to give him some incentive; but what bothers me is that Ventura had to step down himself after yet another embarrassing season - Reinsdorf just doesn't fire his managers.

But yes, there does seem to be a tiny light at the end of the tunnel. We got some good prospects back selling Sale and Eaton so yeah, things will look up in a few more seasons.

[air gordon]

U could say Pax and Kenny have similar roles. Difference being Kenny truly earning himself a lifetime job for winning the world series

Def been a tough year being a Sox fan. Glad we won the dance before the Wrigley trash did

[Andrew]

The Thunder game had some bright moments, at least. They had it going in the second half, so that was fun to watch at least.

[Valor]

Not that relevant to the NBA but this article about the Super Bowl bound Falcons really describes everything that is right with a successful franchise and highlights everything that is wrong with the Bulls.

Friendship, comradery, teamwork, cohesiveness, unselfishness, positive culture. Pretty much everything we've been missing since GarPax builds the "team" off hype to sell to the fans instead of building a team to win.

[air gordon]

Haha no more reminders. Isn't hard to find articles like that haha

Surprised the bulls got one out of the this tough 6 game road trip