Chicago Bulls Thread

[air gordon]

Fair enough. I mean if GarPax actually had a legit plan to replace him then yeah I agree, time to cut bait...but they really don't so that's why I've been saying what I've been saying

I agree- GarPax never had a plan. They were in limbo with Rose. I say they were fortunate the Knicks deal came along. Also the Wade signing but that's another discussion haha

On other matters, Rondo just sucks, period. I laughed at those who were praising him to the heavens when we acquired him and when he got some assists in the first few games. Dude's pure trash, especially in Hoiberg's system.

He really is trash when playing against a team that plays actual defense.

I'll take canaan's outside shooting and crap defense over rondo's overall game

And of course he responds with a serviceable game. I'll give him credit for hitting that 3pter and some free throws in the 4th. Very fortunate Dragic was injured

How about Lopez aggressive play?! He likes playing against whiteside. Give that man a steak dinner

[Valor]

I think Rondo's had too much success and too many seasons of good statistical production to be written off as pure trash, but he hasn't impressed so far, no question.

That's the thing though, his success came with the Celtics big three, after that he was mainly putting up empty stats on losing teams. So is he actually good, or is he only a decent supporting cast who can look good with 3 hall of famers (one being possibly the best catch and shooter ever) around him?

I agree- GarPax never had a plan. They were in limbo with Rose. I say they were fortunate the Knicks deal came along. Also the Wade signing but that's another discussion haha

Pretty much, they traded away Rose and it felt like for a second they were content with Jose friggin Calderon, then Wade and Rondo became available so they scooped them up, then MCW became available so they scooped him up too. Pure luck and knee jerk reactions without giving a single thought prior.

He really is trash when playing against a team that plays actual defense.

I'll take canaan's outside shooting and crap defense over rondo's overall game

And of course he responds with a serviceable game. I'll give him credit for hitting that 3pter and some free throws in the 4th. Very fortunate Dragic was injured

How about Lopez aggressive play?! He likes playing against whiteside. Give that man a steak dinner

If teams aren't dumb enough to close out on him and maintain their defensive assignments Rondo is literally a detriment to the offense. I'll take Canaan over him too.

Lopez has been solid so far, I wouldn't say good/great, but solid. I still think this team is going to have to compete very hard just to make the playoffs.....but hopefully I'm wrong there.

[air gordon]

Its almost depressing to list the advanced stats of Rondo

How much credit does GarPax get for this off season? Not saying it was a great one. Imagine those fortunate circumstances dont happen. They have to be kicking themselves after they signed Rondo and then found out wade was available

It is a little ironic Lopez gets the boozer playing time. As long as the Bulls are crap on perimeter defense, Lopez will unfairly get criticized.

It's going to be an up and down season

[NovU]

Young Rondo was able to get into the traffic and earn trips to the line. Perhaps shooting ability of then Celtics big 3 made it easy for him.

Now he seems to be entirely one dimensional player that looks to assist hog. Is he figured out, is he old, is he just plain bad without shooters surrounding him? Worries became reality, I hope the Bulls shop for a better fit PG, perhaps Mario Chalmers will be avail later in the season.



Wade is playing ok I guess, for the season even though he's 35.

[Valor]

How much credit does GarPax get for this off season? Not saying it was a great one. Imagine those fortunate circumstances dont happen. They have to be kicking themselves after they signed Rondo and then found out wade was available

None, they got lucky with Wade (and then with unloading Snell for MCW). When you trade your former franchise player and say the team is going to go with youth....then turn around and sign 30 year olds who don't fit into your system you don't deserve any credit whatsoever imo.

Now he seems to be entirely one dimensional player that looks to assist hog. Is he figured out, is he old, is he just plain bad without shooters surrounding him?

That's just who he is and always has been. Big three made him look good, and he ran them out of town (Ray Allen, anyways). Look at him in Dallas and Sacramento, just ball hogging to get assists.

[Andrew]

For what it's worth, outside of Wade and Rondo, the Bulls are one of the youngest teams in the league. The idea of bolstering a young roster with capable veterans isn't a bad one, though in that respect Wade is looking much more capable than Rondo, obviously.

[air gordon]

Valor, I hope you stick around.

Novu, I hope they don't burn out Wade

Andrew, do you like Hoibergs playing rotation?

[Valor]

Valor, I hope you stick around.

Oh I'll be around, been a fan for 20+ years no reason to quit now. (I think after enduring guys like Eddy Curry and Ben Wallace we can all endure a little longer)

For what it's worth, outside of Wade and Rondo, the Bulls are one of the youngest teams in the league. The idea of bolstering a young roster with capable veterans isn't a bad one, though in that respect Wade is looking much more capable than Rondo, obviously.

I guess, but again, don't fit the system so whats the point (Mostly Rondo at this point, but I don't know if Wade's hot shooting can last...I can't see how he has turned into a shooter overnight, although early returns are promising).

At least Wade will show the kids how to properly behave as a professional, and in the case of Jimmy Buckets...how to be a proper leader and superstar.

[Andrew]

With Wade, even at this point of his career I think you have to take a chance of him, even if he isn't an ideal fit. Rondo was definitely a "name" signing, rather than a reflection of his suitability or recent play. We're seeing how well that's working out.

Andrew, do you like Hoibergs playing rotation?

I've missed some of the recent games (or haven't had the opportunity to watch them in the first place) and haven't really given it much thought, so I don't really have much of an opinion at this time. I did think Portis might get more of a run this year, guess he's not quite ready. As an aside, I still like his potential. I'll pay closer attention and comment further when I have something more to say.

[Valor]

Rondo was definitely a "name" signing, rather than a reflection of his suitability or recent play. We're seeing how well that's working out.

I rather we still have Nate Robinson instead of Rondo...hell, maybe even....Marquis Teague

[Andrew]

Aaron Brooks?

[Valor]

Aaron Brooks?

Oh for sure, and DJ too while we're at it. Was just jumping all the way to the worst one to highlight how I feel about Rondo

[air gordon]

Oh I'll be around, been a fan for 20+ years no reason to quit now. (I think after enduring guys like Eddy Curry and Ben Wallace we can all endure a little longer)

through thick and thin.. anything could change in a blink of an eye...

At least Wade will show the kids how to properly behave as a professional, and in the case of Jimmy Buckets...how to be a proper leader and superstar.

With Wade, even at this point of his career I think you have to take a chance of him, even if he isn't an ideal fit. Rondo was definitely a "name" signing, rather than a reflection of his suitability or recent play. We're seeing how well that's working out.

does the Wade signing seem like the Gasol signing? Pau has the championship pedigree, is the consummate professional, and was getting up there in age. The circumstances a little bit different obviously.

I've missed some of the recent games (or haven't had the opportunity to watch them in the first place) and haven't really given it much thought, so I don't really have much of an opinion at this time. I did think Portis might get more of a run this year, guess he's not quite ready.

Felecio was ahead but it looks like Portis claimed the 2nd big off the bench role. Hoiberg's left him in too long IMO for certain stretches for sure but at least he's trying to develop him. glad Hoiberg's showing some balls and giving Rondo the yank the fast few games in key stretches

[mp3]

10 hour Michael Jordan documentary anyone???

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/24 ... o-Networks

[Andrew]

I'll certainly check it out, if it comes to fruition (and I imagine it will). Still need to catch the OJ documentary, too.

[NovU]

does the Wade signing seem like the Gasol signing? Pau has the championship pedigree, is the consummate professional, and was getting up there in age. The circumstances a little bit different obviously.

Kinda. But I think Wade is there to stay. But yeah, anything could happen.

Tbh, I feel Wade should carry more load and burden, most importantly play better. He's the highest paid player on the team by large margin. Sure he's 35 but if the Bulls are gonna contend at high level, a lot falls on his shoulder. Butler and Wade(for now) I believe are good enough duo to build around though. At their best this duo should be the top of all East's backcourts including Lowry & whoever (maybe in exception of couple). Come the playoffs, they should be feared.

Felecio was ahead but it looks like Portis claimed the 2nd big off the bench role. Hoiberg's left him in too long IMO for certain stretches for sure but at least he's trying to develop him. glad Hoiberg's showing some balls and giving Rondo the yank the fast few games in key stretches

Aside from Rondo's shortcomings, another problem is that our bigs aren't nothing to clamour about. Kinda tough to rave when you look at other bigs from all serious contenders. It'll always be an uphill battle at 2 positions, when other team's bigs produce more and better.

[Andrew]

You can definitely draw comparisons between the Wade and Gasol signings. In both cases, they've signed a future Hall of Famer who's on the downside of their career, and would've been a more exciting acquisition several seasons ago. Both are still very capable players though, far from completely washed up and unable to contribute, and worth bringing into the fold for a couple of seasons. As I said before, I think you've got to take a chance on players like that. It's hardly the same as paying top dollar for someone who doesn't really want to be there like Ben Wallace, or settling for a consolation prize like Ron Mercer (sorry Fitzy, if you're lurking!).

[Valor]

through thick and thin.. anything could change in a blink of an eye...

Definitely, the wait is (hopefully) worth the reward

You can definitely draw comparisons between the Wade and Gasol signings. In both cases, they've signed a future Hall of Famer who's on the downside of their career, and would've been a more exciting acquisition several seasons ago. Both are still very capable players though, far from completely washed up and unable to contribute, and worth bringing into the fold for a couple of seasons. As I said before, I think you've got to take a chance on players like that. It's hardly the same as paying top dollar for someone who doesn't really want to be there like Ben Wallace, or settling for a consolation prize like Ron Mercer (sorry Fitzy, if you're lurking!).

I dunno though, I reckon Gasol was a more of a consolation prize from failing to sign Melo, obviously he's a really damn good consolation prize (Way better than Mercer!) but nonetheless he was still the fallback option. Luckily for us the Lakers didn't want him anymore so yeah, in that regard it's similar to the Wade situation; but at least at that time there was(?) a shot at signing Melo, whereas here there was nobody to go after until the surprising development in Miami.

[Andrew]

It's not exactly the same, sure, but there are similarities in the way it worked out, and the magnitude of the players involved (star on the downside of their career, yet still capable of playing at a very high level). Those are the main comparisons I'm drawing, there are obviously some differing circumstances.

[Valor]

It's not exactly the same, sure, but there are similarities in the way it worked out, and the magnitude of the players involved (star on the downside of their career, yet still capable of playing at a very high level). Those are the main comparisons I'm drawing, there are obviously some differing circumstances.

Yeah fair enough, I will say this though....neither one was/is a good fit in the team as far as personnel and system goes. Gasol made the D suffer cause they couldn't play Noah (or when they did, they had to pop him at PF and have him chase stretch bigs since Gasol couldn't), and Wade just doesn't fit the system. Obviously their individual qualities being such great players means they still contributed, but in the grand scheme of things I don't know if it really was a plus (and this is coming from a guy who loves both Gasol and Wade).

[Andrew]

It is an issue, definitely. At the end of the day though, I think a team still has to take a chance that a player of that level of talent will find a way to contribute, and ideally make some adjustments to accommodate them if possible. Those opportunities are too good to pass up; I'd rather they acquire someone like Gasol or Wade and have it not work out as well as hoped, than pass on them completely and not even give things a chance.

[Valor]

Oh for sure, it's just that every time I see one of these moves (or in the case of this off-season, two or three), I get the feeling that they are making them with the goal of job security instead of a goal to build a better team to compete for the title. Highly frustrating feeling as a fan.

[Andrew]

It goes back to the lack of foresight, the lack of a long-term plan. In all fairness, the situation with injuries hasn't helped, but there's been a lot of short-term solutions, and seeing what they can throw against the wall and get to stick.

[Valor]

Yeah, I guess that's better than tanking year after year and asking fans to "trust the process" (Sorry Philly fans)

[Andrew]

The Spurs have demonstrated the most effective blueprint of remaining relevant and competitive over a number of years and through different eras. The thing is, it's hard to copy that formula, because there's still a lot of luck involved. They managed to pair up two all-time great big men, both of whom had the character to transition into smaller roles so that they team could continue to win. Their best picks and Draft Day acquisitions panned out, and their key players have remained mostly healthy for most of their run together. They've made smart decisions, but they've also had luck in the Draft, and been fortunate enough to have players who are ready and willing to accept new roles as new stars blossom, and prove themselves capable of being the team's new stars. You can try to copy the formula to some extent, but you need to have the right team to start out with, and everything has to fall into place.