Question for patch developers

[Brien]

I am developing a new tool in addition to EAGraph that is only dedicated to fsh files (not vivs). EAGE has evolved over time and the graphic import engine cannot handle the new file formats.

This new tool will allow creation of fsh files from scratch, or importing of graphics into existing fsh files.

Here is an image of an early version of this tool:
http://www.bsu.edu/web/bsmith2/images/fshEd.jpg

My question is: "How do you handle transparency in your images?"

Specifically, if you create a new image (say a bitmap) that you want to import into a fsh file, how do you use an external image editing program to create an alpha channel (in true color images). Furthermore, no tool I am aware (except EAGraph) allows editing of transparency in 8 bit per pixel palette images.

I am aware of how fshtool does it:

1. 24 bit bmps are extracted with a supplied 8bpp alpha channel
2. 0r, 8bpp bitmaps are extracted with a palette data file

This alpha channel information (in both cases) is only useful if you are creating new images that have transparent areas in the same place, or have the same colors appearing as transparent. Completely new shapes would require a totally different alpha layout.

Ideally, you should be able to create a graphic image that has a native alpha channel and use that to import (e.g. 32 bit bitmap, TGA, TIFF, or PNG images).

Correct me if I am wrong here, but what the NLSC community needs is two tools.

1. An image-editing tool that edits the alpha channel of images, or allows editing the transparency of 8bpp palettes.
2. An import tool that can faithfully import information into all types of EA graphics. (e.g. courts, shoes, jersey letters, etc)

Your opinion is greatly appreciated.

[bchogan]

This is the way I've been editing the transparency for my court patches; using rfshtool, I edit the "normal" full color bmps of the texture first, then, if the image is now different from the orignal texture and has different transparency locations, I edit the transparency file as well. This allows for the creation of semi-transparent gradients, like around the edges of the images, reducing the appearence of "jaggies." It is kind of a pain to have to edit all the files that rfshtool outputs. But when I used to use eage to edit transparencies, I would have to edit each color that I wanted to be transparent or semi-transparent, which is more time consuming. Although, I used to be able to save the transparent pallete from one graphic and load it onto other images (if I was editing multiple images with the same pallete), and I've currently been unable to do this with eage (which makes editing jersey numbers more difficult).
So I would day that "an image-editing tool that edits the alpha channel of images, or allows editing the transparency of 8bpp palettes" as you said, would make editing transparencies much easier and quicker.
Maybe you could include a magic wand type tool with a feather option that would allow for selecting areas and deleting their transparency, for jaggie-free edges.
Having an import tool that works with all ea graphics types would, of course, be greatly appreciated, too.
Thanks for asking our opinions on what to create, and for creating eage and whatever subsequent editors you happen to release.

[nba2kstuff]

due to the voluminous amount of graphic files that we have to work with, our approach to the solution for many of these technical problems employ command line based technlogies, instead of graphical user interface based ones.

on cleanup and final polishing touches, the graphical user interfaces based programs are most especially valuable and useful! but when trying to mass convert 100s-1000s of files, the GUI approach is too time consuming.

as a result we developed technologies which allow the extraction of transparency mattes and transparent regions areas within graphics files formats which support transparency and opacity levels.


so in essence, these series of programs allow the extraction of alpha transparency mattes, as well as doing the multi-scale bitmap resizings for the various FSH graphic objects. the quality of the scaling varies but seems to work and look acceptably

for example here is the command line used to extract the channel matte for subsequnt binding into the FSH binary object data structre.

Code: Select all

nbamake -extract Opacity -matting 0000.psp 0000-a.bmp


like this, options exist for rescaling and muti-scale bitmap generation as well. while the tools are slow and bulky( buggy also lol!). they at least work (most of the time)!

and make the impossible seem possible

peace!

[Brien]

I edit the transparency file as well. This allows for the creation of semi-transparent gradients, like around the edges of the images, reducing the appearence of "jaggies." It is kind of a pain to have to edit all the files that rfshtool outputs. But when I used to use eage to edit transparencies, I would have to edit each color that I wanted to be transparent or semi-transparent, which is more time consuming.

I see. If the color file is separate from the transparency file, how do you edit the transparency file? That is, without having the two together, how can you be sure how the overall image will look.

Maybe you could include a magic wand type tool with a feather option that would allow for selecting areas and deleting their transparency, for jaggie-free edges.

This was my thought as well. Just open a 24 bit bitmap, edit as you see fit. The add an alpha channel. Then use a magic wand (with feathering) to create your alpha channel on the fly. Unless I am missing something, this MUST be easier than editing TWO SEPARATE files.

Having an import tool that works with all ea graphics types would, of course, be greatly appreciated, too.

Well, that is somewhat of a pipe dream, it just sounded good when I wrote it.
However, I think I can come pretty close.

Thanks for asking our opinions on what to create, and for creating eage and whatever subsequent edit ors you happen to release.

Thanks for the reply.

[Brien]

due to the voluminous amount of graphic files that we have to work with, our approach to the solution for many of these technical problems employ command line based technlogies, instead of graphical user interface based ones.

on cleanup and final polishing touches, the graphical user interfaces based programs are most especially valuable and useful! but when trying to mass convert 100s-1000s of files, the GUI approach is too time consuming.

Clearly when running files in batch, executables that accept command line arguments work best. However, programs with GUI interfaces can do everything that console (ie. "command line") apps can. That is, I can program a GUI to accept command line arguments.

for example here is the command line used to extract the channel matte for subsequnt binding into the FSH binary object data structre.

Code: Select all

nbamake -extract Opacity -matting 0000.psp 0000-a.bmp


..but if the GUI or the console app can read the psp file, it could import BOTH the color channels and the alpha channel in one step. If you ran the above above in a batch file with 1000 iterations, you still must open 2X the number of files as opposed to simpy importing a psp file in each step.

[bchogan]

I edit the transparency file as well. This allows for the creation of semi-transparent gradients, like around the edges of the images, reducing the appearence of "jaggies." It is kind of a pain to have to edit all the files that rfshtool outputs. But when I used to use eage to edit transparencies, I would have to edit each color that I wanted to be transparent or semi-transparent, which is more time consuming.

I see. If the color file is separate from the transparency file, how do you edit the transparency file? That is, without having the two together, how can you be sure how the overall image will look.

I usually take the original image, select the background image with the magic wand (with a bit of feathering) and copy that to a new image. Then it's just a matter of changing the color to grey scale, lowering the brightness & contrast so that the background is now black, and then making the foreground, which is still transparent at this point, white (that can be done be having an image layer that is all white beneath the background layer, then merging the image). If I want the whole image to be semi-transparent, I make the foreground image of the transparency file some shade of grey. At the end of the process, I load the original greyscale pallete (previously saved) to the new transparency image file. I don't know if it's completely necessary, but I assume it's better for it to use the original 8 bit pallete.
If the graphic is just a single color text, like for arena names on courts, it's much easier. All you need to do is type the text in white on a black background (or copy an image of the text if it's a special font). That's for the transparency image. The regular image can just be a solid color.
This sounds more complicated than it is, and I can do the process pretty quickly, but if there was an easier process, I'd use it.