Just so disappointed... is this what everybody wanted?
Sun Nov 17, 2002 5:01 am
As a full scale pc basketball nut (I must have all bball games for pc... MUST..), I'm beginning to think EA did me a favour by not releasing live 2002... IMHO they have not gone anywhere but downhill (except in graphics) since Live 2000 ...
points are:
1) There does not seem to be a point to driving and dishing, or even passing in 2003, since the layups/dunks are pretty much automatic anywhere near the basket, whereas with 2000 you would not get the animation unless you had a clear path to the hoop. This is pure arcade garbage... Likewise with trying to find an open jump shooter, why bother when you can run towards the basket and throw up a running one hander with (just about) anyone. 2000 had its faults, but it was a MUCH better simulation of these two fundamentals of realistic basketball.
2) Um... the FG percentages... nuff' said. Now that I can try to jam those offensive rebounds, it would be nice if there actually were some.
3) I can live with having to get a dual analog stick since freestyle seems cool... but what the heck is up with being unable to change offensive/defensive button mappings...? after binding the steal key to shift for so long, having to use it on my crossover button just about broke my pinky
This would seem to be easily fixable so *crosses fingers*
3)it just breaks my heart that they can fix a few things, (such as the fact that in 2k/2k1 any ball that actually hit the rim would always miss and that you could not jump for offensive rebounds with the player under your control) and then turn around and break so many more. The blocks are over the top... the post moves seem useless/pointless (see first in list). stealing feels um... wrong. The speed... ohmigod the speed... I am not as young as I used to be... heck I remember NBA Jam in the arcades...but if you had only two per team... this would feel like that did (minus the big heads, but I'm sure there is a code
). I never played 2002 on a console, but was it this big a difference over 200/2001? why did they change the style..?! this is killing me. It seems like the court is smaller, even.
I have seen many posts defending this game based on the idea that it is not supposed to be a realistic simulation of basketball... Say what? NBA live is the ONLY franchise that has offered a semi-realistic portrayal of real basketball on the pc since LucasArts made TV Sports bball back in 198x something... And they have consistently marketed NBA Live as a basketball sim... maybe things changed when they started aiming more for the console markets, but then live 2000 was a playstation game wasn't it?
As you can probably tell, I am hugely frustrated with this game at the moment... I want to like it, since the graphics are sweet and I think they have actually improved franchise mode over live 2000, but the game is just unplayable as anything but a quick timewaster... It's nice to see Vince dunk again though... EVERY FRICKIN' TIME HE TOUCHES THE BALL!!!!
I have read a few mentions to editing the game settings to bring speed and fg percentage down... if anyone has figured this out as of yet, plz plz let me know... I did try the roster patch that was supposed to slow things down, but it does not seem to have had an effect, at least not of franchise mode, which is the meat of the game for me.
I'd be interested to hear some other opinions...
points are:
1) There does not seem to be a point to driving and dishing, or even passing in 2003, since the layups/dunks are pretty much automatic anywhere near the basket, whereas with 2000 you would not get the animation unless you had a clear path to the hoop. This is pure arcade garbage... Likewise with trying to find an open jump shooter, why bother when you can run towards the basket and throw up a running one hander with (just about) anyone. 2000 had its faults, but it was a MUCH better simulation of these two fundamentals of realistic basketball.
2) Um... the FG percentages... nuff' said. Now that I can try to jam those offensive rebounds, it would be nice if there actually were some.
3) I can live with having to get a dual analog stick since freestyle seems cool... but what the heck is up with being unable to change offensive/defensive button mappings...? after binding the steal key to shift for so long, having to use it on my crossover button just about broke my pinky
This would seem to be easily fixable so *crosses fingers*
3)it just breaks my heart that they can fix a few things, (such as the fact that in 2k/2k1 any ball that actually hit the rim would always miss and that you could not jump for offensive rebounds with the player under your control) and then turn around and break so many more. The blocks are over the top... the post moves seem useless/pointless (see first in list). stealing feels um... wrong. The speed... ohmigod the speed... I am not as young as I used to be... heck I remember NBA Jam in the arcades...but if you had only two per team... this would feel like that did (minus the big heads, but I'm sure there is a code
). I never played 2002 on a console, but was it this big a difference over 200/2001? why did they change the style..?! this is killing me. It seems like the court is smaller, even.
I have seen many posts defending this game based on the idea that it is not supposed to be a realistic simulation of basketball... Say what? NBA live is the ONLY franchise that has offered a semi-realistic portrayal of real basketball on the pc since LucasArts made TV Sports bball back in 198x something... And they have consistently marketed NBA Live as a basketball sim... maybe things changed when they started aiming more for the console markets, but then live 2000 was a playstation game wasn't it?
As you can probably tell, I am hugely frustrated with this game at the moment... I want to like it, since the graphics are sweet and I think they have actually improved franchise mode over live 2000, but the game is just unplayable as anything but a quick timewaster... It's nice to see Vince dunk again though... EVERY FRICKIN' TIME HE TOUCHES THE BALL!!!!
I have read a few mentions to editing the game settings to bring speed and fg percentage down... if anyone has figured this out as of yet, plz plz let me know... I did try the roster patch that was supposed to slow things down, but it does not seem to have had an effect, at least not of franchise mode, which is the meat of the game for me.
I'd be interested to hear some other opinions...
Sun Nov 17, 2002 10:15 am
I have to agree with the fast break aspect of this game. After I got the game, I played a few games and got beat 160-150 in 12min. I understand how your feel when every time you miss a shot, cpu will run like crazy and dunk. The way the computer is running fastbreak is unstoppable since your pg, sg and sf can't get back as fast as the cpu to def after the shot is missed.
The problem could be solved. I tried the roster update from LebornJames and DaRealBlade. They work really well. I play 3 games so far in Season. Nope of the cpu teams score more than 100 point. In fact in the last game I held the Blazer under 45% and only 80points in a 12mins game. I started to really like it now without the crazy FG% and fastbreak.
Also, I have noticed if you set a play and don't rush a shot, you could get a realistic score. I was using the roster from DaRealBalde. there's something you should know about the update, freestyle can no longer be performed by everyguard/forward. In a way the game is slower and you can lose your handle with bad handler. Block, speed and steal are fixed nicely. i average less than 10 stl, 9blk per game, and the speed is now NORMAL. Now you can't dunk at ease. Shaq will only dunk if the path is clear and every guard, forawrd and center now do layups and will miss if the shot is contested.
The problem could be solved. I tried the roster update from LebornJames and DaRealBlade. They work really well. I play 3 games so far in Season. Nope of the cpu teams score more than 100 point. In fact in the last game I held the Blazer under 45% and only 80points in a 12mins game. I started to really like it now without the crazy FG% and fastbreak.
Also, I have noticed if you set a play and don't rush a shot, you could get a realistic score. I was using the roster from DaRealBalde. there's something you should know about the update, freestyle can no longer be performed by everyguard/forward. In a way the game is slower and you can lose your handle with bad handler. Block, speed and steal are fixed nicely. i average less than 10 stl, 9blk per game, and the speed is now NORMAL. Now you can't dunk at ease. Shaq will only dunk if the path is clear and every guard, forawrd and center now do layups and will miss if the shot is contested.
Sun Nov 17, 2002 12:01 pm
hmm... Thanks for replying.
The roster patch sounds like it would fix some of my major problems with the game. The only thing is, I already downloaded it and (I thought) applied it properly, as in I copied the players.something file over its counterpart. Does it not work in franchise mode? I didn;t notice any major difference in the way the computer played... fg% were still hovering at 60-70 in the couple of games I played, and there was no incentive not to drive in and dunk or layup.
is there anything else I have to do?
The roster patch sounds like it would fix some of my major problems with the game. The only thing is, I already downloaded it and (I thought) applied it properly, as in I copied the players.something file over its counterpart. Does it not work in franchise mode? I didn;t notice any major difference in the way the computer played... fg% were still hovering at 60-70 in the couple of games I played, and there was no incentive not to drive in and dunk or layup.
is there anything else I have to do?
Sun Nov 17, 2002 3:46 pm
well if the game is so damn easy cuz of layups and dunks, then START TAKING JUMPSHOTS and RUNNIG PLAYS!
i edited the ratings myself.. i think +10 on OREB, -5 on DREB. and now I get like 10 ORB per game (on 5 min quarterS). scores get into like 50s. that's not very realistic, but i can't sit and play a 12 minute game w/o an ingame save option.
the cpu shot about 55% on me in mny first 13 losses in the franchise. now, my first 2 wins, i held them to 45. simply playing better D.
i edited the ratings myself.. i think +10 on OREB, -5 on DREB. and now I get like 10 ORB per game (on 5 min quarterS). scores get into like 50s. that's not very realistic, but i can't sit and play a 12 minute game w/o an ingame save option.
the cpu shot about 55% on me in mny first 13 losses in the franchise. now, my first 2 wins, i held them to 45. simply playing better D.
Sun Nov 17, 2002 4:24 pm
Friendly game tonite
98-83 LA Celtics
50% 49%
Around 40s reb for each team
20s assist for each team
14-16 TO for each team
Attempt around 90s shot for each team
Don't remember all the others stats but neither team took over 100 shot and there're only a few dunks in the game.
I didn't use the NLCS roster. I am not sure if the roster works on franhanise mode but I don't think it matters.
I start the game out with guards bringing the ball up and set up plays. Very important to set up plays and find a open man if doubled. Use the clock, I move the ball around alot and get open shot mostly. Don't rush the shot like there's 19 sec left on the clock unless you really need it. Bad shot equal fastbreak for computer. If you run and gun, the cpu will do the same and FG%, assist will go crazy. Rebound well and try to play like real
b-ball.
If you get the roster from one of the threads in this forum, freestyle moves are limited to certain players on everyteam, only the best player can perform freestyle move so most of your points are based on plays, open man and jumpers. There's no point of editing the rating if you like scoring 70 point with Shaq and keep driving the basket to dunks and score 60 with Kobe every game.
I will try playing as the Lakers vs the Wizard and post the final game stats after. This is just a computer game and I use the roster from the others and play out the way I intended to. I am sure there are people out there who enjoy high scoring run and gun. If you don't mind posting how you start out a game, I wouldn't mind help you out to get a realistic game play.
Hope it helps for you.
98-83 LA Celtics
50% 49%
Around 40s reb for each team
20s assist for each team
14-16 TO for each team
Attempt around 90s shot for each team
Don't remember all the others stats but neither team took over 100 shot and there're only a few dunks in the game.
I didn't use the NLCS roster. I am not sure if the roster works on franhanise mode but I don't think it matters.
I start the game out with guards bringing the ball up and set up plays. Very important to set up plays and find a open man if doubled. Use the clock, I move the ball around alot and get open shot mostly. Don't rush the shot like there's 19 sec left on the clock unless you really need it. Bad shot equal fastbreak for computer. If you run and gun, the cpu will do the same and FG%, assist will go crazy. Rebound well and try to play like real
b-ball.
If you get the roster from one of the threads in this forum, freestyle moves are limited to certain players on everyteam, only the best player can perform freestyle move so most of your points are based on plays, open man and jumpers. There's no point of editing the rating if you like scoring 70 point with Shaq and keep driving the basket to dunks and score 60 with Kobe every game.
I will try playing as the Lakers vs the Wizard and post the final game stats after. This is just a computer game and I use the roster from the others and play out the way I intended to. I am sure there are people out there who enjoy high scoring run and gun. If you don't mind posting how you start out a game, I wouldn't mind help you out to get a realistic game play.
Hope it helps for you.
Sun Nov 17, 2002 5:10 pm
Again, thx for replying Mana...
and Ilya
So it really looks like method of play dictates the tempo of the game? Interesting. I wonder if this applies to all skill levels... I will try a couple games tonite and see.
My method of playing may seem a little odd... I find I get the most thrill out of developing cpu generated rookies into stars (or not) so my preferred approach to franchise play is to draft as many low salary players as possible in the fantasy draft, then play through the year and trade all players for the ten best obtainable rookies in the second full year.
As for playing the game, in live 2000 most plays revolved around my guards penetrating and then passing out for jump shots or drives... This is mostly based around the fact that if you tried to get into the paint in 2000, you were stopped 8 times out of 10, or at least ended up with a low percentage shot compared to an open jumper... I still generally beat the computer by 10 or 20 pts on superstar, but every once in a while it would steal a game, enought to keep it interesting.
Ilya... How do you edit the ratings you are referring to?
and Ilya, I have no problem with the idea of running plays and playing better D... I have a serious problem with the idea that I have to restrain myself from just waltzing into the paint and dunking in order to get a more realistic feel, just b/c EA couldn;t manage to duplicate the amazing programming feat they must have made in Live 2000 where you actually um... couldn't because you were defended.
and Ilya
So it really looks like method of play dictates the tempo of the game? Interesting. I wonder if this applies to all skill levels... I will try a couple games tonite and see.
My method of playing may seem a little odd... I find I get the most thrill out of developing cpu generated rookies into stars (or not) so my preferred approach to franchise play is to draft as many low salary players as possible in the fantasy draft, then play through the year and trade all players for the ten best obtainable rookies in the second full year.
As for playing the game, in live 2000 most plays revolved around my guards penetrating and then passing out for jump shots or drives... This is mostly based around the fact that if you tried to get into the paint in 2000, you were stopped 8 times out of 10, or at least ended up with a low percentage shot compared to an open jumper... I still generally beat the computer by 10 or 20 pts on superstar, but every once in a while it would steal a game, enought to keep it interesting.
Ilya... How do you edit the ratings you are referring to?
and Ilya, I have no problem with the idea of running plays and playing better D... I have a serious problem with the idea that I have to restrain myself from just waltzing into the paint and dunking in order to get a more realistic feel, just b/c EA couldn;t manage to duplicate the amazing programming feat they must have made in Live 2000 where you actually um... couldn't because you were defended.
Mon Nov 18, 2002 9:17 am
96-83 LA GS
FG 47% 53%
TO 14 23
3P 40% 36%
BLK 7 3
REB 36 46
STL 15 8
not that many freethrow attempt
Low ranking teams like GS turnover the ball alot. after 8 games with the new roster I notice how CPU run. CPU PG, SG, SF will stop if you have at least two men in front of them after miss. After any deep 2/3 pt attempt, have all guards back as fast as possible. Most of the break in the last game are result of my guard missing quick shot and didn't run back on def. Also if you run your PF/C back on def on turbo after any miss, CPU usually stop outside of 3p line. Contest shot equal lower FG, 3P%.
The last game was crappy since they turn the ball over alot in the entire game.
FG 47% 53%
TO 14 23
3P 40% 36%
BLK 7 3
REB 36 46
STL 15 8
not that many freethrow attempt
Low ranking teams like GS turnover the ball alot. after 8 games with the new roster I notice how CPU run. CPU PG, SG, SF will stop if you have at least two men in front of them after miss. After any deep 2/3 pt attempt, have all guards back as fast as possible. Most of the break in the last game are result of my guard missing quick shot and didn't run back on def. Also if you run your PF/C back on def on turbo after any miss, CPU usually stop outside of 3p line. Contest shot equal lower FG, 3P%.
The last game was crappy since they turn the ball over alot in the entire game.
I agree with frustrated_teccy What is the best Roster Patch?
Thu Dec 12, 2002 7:58 am
I agree completely with frustrated_teccy.
Are there any really good roster patches out there that will fix some of these problems. I've tried two and the team standings were totally off.
I read that that Tim now works for EA. I used to use the Tim and Lutz roster patches.
Happy Holidays
M. Calcagno
Are there any really good roster patches out there that will fix some of these problems. I've tried two and the team standings were totally off.
I read that that Tim now works for EA. I used to use the Tim and Lutz roster patches.
Happy Holidays
M. Calcagno