nets in nba live 2004

Discussion about NBA Live 2004.

nets in nba live 2004

Postby showstopper496 on Thu Sep 04, 2003 8:43 am

the nets in live 2004 look weird cause they have many animations of the ball going in, nba live 2001 had perfect net cause the ball always swished :shock:
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Re: nets in nba live 2004

Postby Will on Thu Sep 04, 2003 8:45 am

showstopper496 wrote:the nets in live 2004 look weird cause they have many animations of the ball going in, nba live 2001 had perfect net cause the ball always swished :shock:


in real life, do you always get a swish no, so that is good....
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Postby ReyJ on Thu Sep 04, 2003 10:23 am

Making the net animations is probably a lot harder than what we may think.

Besides, I like the fact that the ball doesn't always swish all the time. It ain't realistic if it does.

It would be great if they added the shooters roll and shooters bounce. One that would bounce or roll around the rim and another animation where the ball would bounce on the rim, off the backboard and in it goes.

Just when you think the ball is going out, it goes back in. You get this "whoa" feeling when that happens in real-life and I'm sure it'll be the same when you're playing the game. :P
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Postby Tracy_McGrady on Thu Sep 04, 2003 11:23 am

I would have to agree with Showstopper. Dont get me wrong, the ball shouldnt always swish, but since 2002, the swish animation has been HORRIBLE! Live 2001 was the last version to have a decent swish. And Im sure it cant be that hard to make a decent net animation. Think of all the stuff that they've achieved and a net would seem minor. Lately the nets have been a little too stiff (if you know what I mean). But aside from that Im sure the game will be a step up from last years version.
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Postby chipper on Thu Sep 04, 2003 1:10 pm

Oh, so it's not about New Jersey Nets...

I want to see more shooters use the backboard.
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Postby cocobee on Thu Sep 04, 2003 1:14 pm

I want to see more shooters use the backboard


man, in 2003 they over used the backboard.I hated the 3 pt bank shot.
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Postby Andrew on Thu Sep 04, 2003 1:17 pm

I felt too many free throws bounced around before dropping in NBA Live 2003, and too many shots went in off a friendly bounce. Like other aspects of Live 2003, it just needs to be toned down a little and it will be fine.
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Postby ReyJ on Thu Sep 04, 2003 2:17 pm

Andrew Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2003 1:17 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I felt too many free throws bounced around before dropping in NBA Live 2003, and too many shots went in off a friendly bounce. Like other aspects of Live 2003, it just needs to be toned down a little and it will be fine.


True, the FT's were kinda annoying. Even if you hit the balls right in the middle of the FT cursor, it would still bounce around. And when you're target, you think its gonna bounce around, but it goes swish instead.

As for jumpshots, i think the friendly roll and shooters bounce would be a nice addition, just not all the time.
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Postby Andrew on Thu Sep 04, 2003 2:22 pm

As for jumpshots, i think the friendly roll and shooters bounce would be a nice addition, just not all the time.


Agreed. The friendly roll/bounce was a little too common in NBA Live 2003, another factor in the high field goal percentages.
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Postby Metsis on Thu Sep 04, 2003 3:11 pm

They should do net mocapping and then implement it to the game. Just put some sensors on the net and have some guy do a shootaround.

Free throws were probably the most disastrous area in Live 2003. Live 2003 made the easiest shot in bball the hardest. Which is never good...

The back board needs to be used more and the ball needs to bounce more. I'd like to see someone killing a three point attempt on the hoop, so that it would roll off the rim... That would be a thing to see. It will either go in or bounce off the rim big time. I've never ever been able to kill a three point shot on the rim and trust me... I've shot alot of them.
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Postby diafenes on Thu Sep 04, 2003 3:39 pm

Metsis wrote:Free throws were probably the most disastrous area in Live 2003. Live 2003 made the easiest shot in bball the hardest. Which is never good...


exactly. I don't think I averaged over 40% in freethrows in 2003. :roll: I don't know what was wrong with the system they had prior to 2003. If it aint broke don't try to fix it I definitety hope that they revert back to the old freethrow system they had in 2000 It might have been easy to master but it worked! + it also reflected the players freethrow rating, in 2003 I don't know what it reflects, certainly not the players rating :?
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Postby Andrew on Thu Sep 04, 2003 3:52 pm

NBA Live 2003 didn't allow as much latitude when showing free throws. You couldn't afford to be slightly off-centre, especially on the harder difficulty levels. Previous Lives were a little more generous when it came to the T-Meter. As Metsis said, it's the easiest shot in basketball (though some players struggle), so it shouldn't be too difficult to shoot high percentages with good free throw shooters.
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Postby Bredrin on Thu Sep 04, 2003 4:07 pm

i defineatly agree....it seems as if in 2003 the nets hardly moved and the sound of the ball clanking the rim didnt seem authentic to me. i would love to se the nets actually pop as the real ones do when the ball swishes through (where the base of the net pops up through the hoop itself) that happend too much in 2001 and never in 2003. That net pop is a sweet animation thats a great part of the satisfaction in hitting a shot. Also the shooters roll around on layups would be great....it just looks nice sometimes to see variety around the rim.
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Postby Metsis on Thu Sep 04, 2003 5:21 pm

Andrew wrote:NBA Live 2003 didn't allow as much latitude when showing free throws. You couldn't afford to be slightly off-centre, especially on the harder difficulty levels. Previous Lives were a little more generous when it came to the T-Meter. As Metsis said, it's the easiest shot in basketball (though some players struggle), so it shouldn't be too difficult to shoot high percentages with good free throw shooters.


The problem was that the difficulty level changed the free throws for all the players... It should be extremely easy with players of 85 and above and it should never be easy with guys rated under 65.

It is just irritating... It seems that the AI knows that the free throws are hard to make and he just keeps on fouling you. That is just irritating, but it happens from time to time.

The t-meter should go pretty slowly for the good and fast for the poor shooters. I don't see why difficulty levels should effect free throw shooting at all... It shouldn't in my mind...
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Postby Andrew on Thu Sep 04, 2003 6:23 pm

I guess it's just part of the increased challenge - everything gets harder. The easiest setting should make everything easy, the hardest setting should provide the toughest challenge. But you're right, Superstar mode shouldn't mean that free throws are exceptionally difficult.

On the harder settings, the difficulty of free throw shooting should be normal while on easier settings free throw shooting should be made noticeably easier, if you follow me. :wink:
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Postby Metsis on Thu Sep 04, 2003 7:00 pm

Exactly my point... The free throws should never get harder then what they are in reality. A little easier with easier settings. Usually the ft shooting has been relatively easy, but it should rather be easy then hard.
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Postby ReyJ on Thu Sep 04, 2003 10:17 pm

Live 2000 was probably the easiest game to shoot FT's. Maybe a lil too easy though.

Live 2001 was ok.

Live 2003, well, that's another story. I thought there was something wrong with me when I avg'd between 30-60% in FT shooting. But I've come to realise that everyone had the same problem.
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Postby Will on Thu Sep 04, 2003 11:51 pm

maybe there add a slider for the amount of swishs or something like that in the game?
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Postby havasufalls on Fri Sep 05, 2003 4:28 am

I truthfully thought that i would like a harder FT shot. Every year i wanted live to make the FT shot harder so it would be more of a challenge but besides playing online the FT's this year were as easy as every year IMO. I play on the PS2 version on superstar level i record every game i play on my profile and before i started playin online my average was 91.8% FT shooting. There were times that i hit 100 straight in franchise mode(yea i keep track of stuff like that). I did notice a higer diffculty wen i switched my game to a different Televison set that was exceptionally bigger. My little brother's FT avg. is around 85% so we both mainly hit all our FT's but wen we played on our big screen TV for the first time we both missed around 20 FT's. It took a few games but u get the hang of it and wen we switched bac to a smaller TV we had to adjust again u got the hang of both TV's. I know im rambling but thats the only way i would c someone having diffculty shooting FT's in live 2003. Now i have a friend that shoots about 68% but he gets better all the time and some games he shoots 95% and others he shoots 45%. I like the FT shooting system and think it is to easy but wen u go online and play and miss 70, 80, or even 90% of your FT's it is frustrating. If they choose to make it harder i will like it for my franchise so i don't dominate the league every year in the FT area. If its easier i will love to go online and play the people that foul all game and hit the FT's rite in their face.

As for the net features i like the fact that every shot doesn't go in all net but if the make more go in all net then it will be cool i dont care either way as long as all the shots aren't going in nothing but net.
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Postby Andrew on Fri Sep 05, 2003 1:11 pm

I guess the difference could also be the platform. The PC version is subject to slower PCs and lower performance/frame rates. I still feel that the FT shooting was slightly different to previous Lives though.
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Postby DaManFromGapo on Fri Sep 05, 2003 1:22 pm

could be....i usually would have to sacrifice graphic quality so that the T-meter would run smoothly and i would be able to shoot the free throws.

Free throw shooting ain't that bad. I enjoy missing a few shots now and then. I remember when a lot of people would complain that free throw shooting was very easy. Now some people complain that free throw shooting is very difficult. I guess EA thought that the best way to make players miss FT was to increase the speed of the T-meter.

It takes a lot of work though to at least get a 90% accuracy rate in the superstar level. I guess that we all wish we could practice our free throw shooting in practice. Maybe next year's edition would have such a feature.

cheers! :D
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Postby Andrew on Fri Sep 05, 2003 1:31 pm

Oh, I don't mind missing free throws. It wouldn't be realistic if I could shoot 90+% with any player. But the speed of the T-Meter and difficulty of free throw shooting should be determined by the player's ability. For good free throw shooters, it should be the easiest shot in the game.

It's irritating when you see the CPU shoot 8/10 from the foul line with Shaq, while you encounter difficulties with Allan Houston or Troy Hudson.
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Postby gut on Fri Sep 05, 2003 1:34 pm

:o :o

regarding the FT, I've played a match last night.
I was shocked that T-mac got 90.9% (10 of 11) FT%
that i'd never did.

usaully he got 40 ~ 50% .. :cry:

by the way, i also averaging 40 ~ 50% FT percentage for all other players...

i think it's a miracle last night :wink:
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Postby Andrew on Fri Sep 05, 2003 1:36 pm

I think my best effort in Live 2003 was 17/18 free throws with KG. I haven't come close to that number (in makes and attempts) with a single player since. :wink:
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Postby gut on Fri Sep 05, 2003 1:42 pm

Andrew wrote:I think my best effort in Live 2003 was 17/18 free throws with KG. I haven't come close to that number (in makes and attempts) with a single player since. :wink:


cool :P :P :D
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Postby Metsis on Fri Sep 05, 2003 2:58 pm

Andrew again said it best... You should have great trouble scoring from the line with Shaq and Big Ben, but when you go to line with someone like Kerr or Reggie, well those just should be automatic. There needs to be a bigger difference in the t-meter speed.

I usually shoot .750, .550, .450 and guess which is the free throw shooting percentage??? It should be the first shouldn't it, but no it's the last. The free throws (I'll say it again: The EASIEST shot in the game) are from hell in Live 2003. Atleast with PC players. It just is no good...

The better shooters need to shoot it well and the bad shooters need to shoot it awful... I just don't care about free throws in 2003 anymore. I find that it's more easier to grab the offensive board and put the points up that way.
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Postby EGarrett on Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:15 pm

The solution is pretty simple. Just handle free throws the same way they do every other shot...you time and release and the player's rating determines whether it goes in or not. With Shaq...even with a perfect release...you should have a 52% chance of the shot going in. Likewise, with Steve Nash you can have a 90% chance.
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Postby Colin on Thu Sep 11, 2003 2:11 pm

EGarrett wrote:The solution is pretty simple. Just handle free throws the same way they do every other shot...you time and release and the player's rating determines whether it goes in or not. With Shaq...even with a perfect release...you should have a 52% chance of the shot going in. Likewise, with Steve Nash you can have a 90% chance.
Well then if you missed it would be easy to get angry and think why did I miss that shot. With the T-meter at least you know why you missed it.
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Postby Metsis on Thu Sep 11, 2003 3:21 pm

The t-meter serves it's purpose... It is good to know that you missed cause you failed to drop that shot. It has always been in the game and it should be there in the future too.

One thing that they could do is that if they keep the t-meter as it is. Too frikkin fast, but the area of mistake should be much larger for better shooters. So the balls should have to stop quite near the middle for Shaq and Ben, but with Kerr you'd have more of a freedom in the shot. So it would fall even if it would miss with a bad shooter.

I believe that this kind of a calculation method could work quite well.

1. See how far the balls are from the center.

2. See if either of the balls are too far away (either the shot going too wide or too short or long) and remember to calculate the backboard into the mix.

3. Compare balls distance from center to the players free throw rating.

And if the distance is less then a relative number given from the free throw rating, well the shot should fall, and if not well you'd get a miss.

In this system the t-meter would be more forgiving for the better shooters. The ball should have three different speeds.

Faster speed for players with rating below 65

Normal speed for players with free throw rating ranging from 65-85

Slower speed for players with ratings above 85

So when you have two players within the normal speed limits say a guy with 70 and another with 80. The ball would go equally fast for each of these players, but still it would be easier to hit with the 80 rated guy.

About speed ratios: The largest area for success should always be at the highest level of a speed class. So a player with free throws 85 would have the largest area in the normal class and a guy with 86 would have the smallest area in the slow class. The area for failure should be smaller with the 86 guy then the 85 guy, but with the ball speed being lower he should still hit about the same as the 85 guy.

Here's something to wrap your minds around today guys... I hope this makes some sense.
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Postby Andreas Dahl on Thu Sep 11, 2003 4:42 pm

if feel you there Metsis, i agree with all of it
exept the section at the end... you lost me there :? (im tired...)
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Postby gut on Thu Sep 11, 2003 4:47 pm

regarding the FT in the game~
did anyone notice that the T-meter was changed a little bit ?(according to the 17 mins video)

it is on the backboard :D
cool.
to me it's quite a fresh idea ~ quite funny i think~

besides, how about thinking of another FT system?
let's say, the FT rating of a player will not vary the speed in the T-meter (or just a little bit different), but vary the aiming area.
Therefore, the higher the FT rating, the larger the aiming.

just like some other sports game~

it makes not much different of the existing system..
however, i think this is more suitable for a rookie of nba live

but anyway, it's only my imagination. :lol:
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Postby Andrew on Thu Sep 11, 2003 5:09 pm

I like the idea of having a larger margin of error for better free throw shooters. I think it would capture the idea of players being automatic from the line - they don't have to take the time to settle themselves and line everything up for a good attempt, they can just step up and make the free throw.
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Postby Metsis on Thu Sep 11, 2003 5:35 pm

The problem with all the free throws being at the same speed is the fact that you can get used to the speed, and thus you can sink a free throw with pretty much anyone after that. Three different levels of speed and different sized hit-zones would keep the player guessing at least a little. And it would be pretty much automatic with the people with ratings of 95, cause the speed would be the slowest and the zone would be pretty big too.

With this system the speed of the t-meter would have to be pretty high, so that it wouldn't be that easy to hit the dead center of the t-meter. But it would implement the fact that there are players that just take you to the butchers shop if you put them on the line.

Free Throw is the easiest shot in the game for most...
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Postby Andrew on Thu Sep 11, 2003 6:32 pm

The same should go for the CPU. Lousy free throw shooters should not consistently have career best performances from the line every time you play them. Guys who shoot around 80% should have off-nights from time to time.

Basically, if I'm playing the Lakers and I decide to employ the Hack-a-Shaq method, he should not shoot 20/20 from the charity stripe. Granted, Shaq does have good free throw shooting games, but not frequently. His career high of 19 free throws made in a game still came off a career high 31 attempts.
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Postby Bredrin on Fri Sep 12, 2003 5:46 am

wow u guys really went of topic in this one :?
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Postby Andrew on Fri Sep 12, 2003 11:54 am

True, but it was not intentionally thrown off discussion, rather the conversation progressed from net animations to free throw shooting.
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Postby Metsis on Fri Sep 12, 2003 3:08 pm

I'll take atleast some of the blame for this... Free throws were just something that really needed some attention.

And isn't it with free throws when you really have the time to look at the net mechanics???
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Postby Andrew on Fri Sep 12, 2003 4:00 pm

And isn't it with free throws when you really have the time to look at the net mechanics???


Indeed, it's the best view we have of the rim and net physics.
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Postby - Ace - on Fri Sep 12, 2003 7:18 pm

They should randomize free throw shooting by basing it on a weighted-average of free throw percentage, luck, and home court/away, clutch and crowd. Throw away the T-meter and let the computer decide if it goes in based on the above variables. Or base it on the above variables and the T-meter, such that even if the user gets a perfect T-meter the player might miss the free throw due to the other variables.

Or vary the T-meter(speed, or size, or accuracy) depending on the game situation. for example, end of the game scored tied or team down by one.
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Postby Andrew on Fri Sep 12, 2003 7:23 pm

I don't think they should get rid of the T-Meter. As stated many times before, free throws are the easiest shot in basketball, so you should have a chance to shoot a high percentage from the foul line in NBA Live. It's the one shot in basketball where you always have a chance to ready yourself, square yourself to the basket, and attempt a good shot.

The T-Meter best represents this idea, as well as the way that you can miss free throws - you could be on target, but you might shoot the ball too short or too long.
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Postby - Ace - on Fri Sep 12, 2003 7:26 pm

True. But if a user can have shaq shoot 20/20 in superstar mode--that isn't respresentative of what can happen in real life.
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Postby Andrew on Fri Sep 12, 2003 7:37 pm

Of course not. But more often than not it's the CPU that shoots high percentages with lousy free throw shooters. Their simulated performance may be accurate, but they shouldn't have a career game from the line every time they face a human opponent.
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Postby - Ace - on Fri Sep 12, 2003 7:41 pm

Computer opponents usually have realistic free throw stats against me. ie baron davis clanks a ton. Usually, its the unrealistic field goal shooting of computer opponents which makes me mad.
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Postby Andrew on Fri Sep 12, 2003 7:48 pm

Field goal percentage (and fourth quarter three point percentage) is a larger concern. Still, it's not uncommon in my experience for the CPU to shoot well with poor free throw shooters.
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Postby Metsis on Fri Sep 12, 2003 7:48 pm

Play any other version of NBA Live then 2003 and you will see that this is only a problem in 2003. Most parts of the game well the fts have been too easy to drop, so you end up shooting over 90% of them. But when you half that percentage in a single update, well that's just asking for problems.

Teams should shoot about 75-80% of their free throws. Depending on who ends up on the line and how much. But a 75% average is probably quite right.

The t-meter just needs a bigger difference in speeds, so it's easy with a good shooter and very difficult with a bad shooter.
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Postby EGarrett on Sat Sep 13, 2003 6:47 am

colin826 wrote:Well then if you missed it would be easy to get angry and think why did I miss that shot. With the T-meter at least you know why you missed it.


If you can deal with it in every other shot you take in the game...you can deal with it at the free throw line.

When you give players complete control over whether a shot goes in then you will get unrealistic percentages...sooner or later people will make a high percentage no matter who they're shooting with. Then...the computer has to do the same to provide a challenge and you spiral out of control.

Just challenge players to release the shot at the right time...and if your shooter sucks...just like shooting a three pointer with Shaq...don't count on it going in.
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Postby sirg on Sun Sep 14, 2003 11:11 am

Actually, I like the Tmeter system in live2003. It enables Shaq to average 93% in FT efficency lol. I think I played a previous version of live (or sega I don't remember) years ago on psx and the FT's were nearly impossible to make. You had to line up the arrows with the top buttons. I always dreaded coming to the FT line. Anyone remember that?
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Re: nets in nba live 2004

Postby T-MAC-power on Sat Apr 16, 2016 10:37 pm

I think Nba Live 2003 is too far realistic in context of rim-ball-net bounce/and net animations. 2004 is horrible. It was great. Simply.
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Re: nets in nba live 2004

Postby Andrew on Sat Apr 16, 2016 10:49 pm

Another pointless bump of an old thread here. Stop doing this.
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