Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Thu Oct 25, 2012 11:09 am

To clarify, I'm not trying to bash TNA/Impact there. I'm just saying if we're going to say people aren't watching WWE because RAW had a 2.48 rating and around 3.5 million viewers, it's fair to say hardly anyone's watching TNA with a rating of 0.99 and 1.25 million viewers, a week after a year low of 0.86 and 1.12 million viewers.

Aside from there being just too much WWE programming, along with the criticisms we can make of the product itself, I think the ratings are a sign of the times. TNA's ratings aren't showing any improvement while WWE's ratings are falling to pre-Monday Night Wars era levels, suggesting that on top of everything else it's really only the hardcore-hardcore fans that are tuning in on a regular basis. Wrestling just isn't the hot thing at the moment.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby JaoSming on Thu Oct 25, 2012 12:59 pm

Andrew wrote:suggesting that on top of everything else it's really only the hardcore-hardcore fans that are tuning in on a regular basis. Wrestling just isn't the hot thing at the moment

IMO its more the PG kiddies tuning into RAW, but not watching Impact. You guys are my only reference for "hardcore" viewers, so I guess that is true.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Thu Oct 25, 2012 9:42 pm

That too, I guess. This week's RAW also had the presidential debate to contend with along with Monday Night Football, on top of people tuning out for reasons related to the product itself. Not a good week for RAW, all things considered.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby koberulz on Fri Oct 26, 2012 12:47 pm

JaoSming wrote:
Andrew wrote:suggesting that on top of everything else it's really only the hardcore-hardcore fans that are tuning in on a regular basis. Wrestling just isn't the hot thing at the moment

IMO its more the PG kiddies tuning into RAW, but not watching Impact. You guys are my only reference for "hardcore" viewers, so I guess that is true.

Most of the true hardcore fans - as opposed to the "hardcore" WWE fans, ie kids - are probably watching ROH, or Japanese or Mexican wrestling, or their DVD collections. Impact has probably already blown its last chance with most of them, and WWE right now is absolutely awful when Punk or Bryan aren't onscreen, and even then it's iffy.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby koberulz on Fri Oct 26, 2012 5:35 pm

TNA wants to charge me $38 to ship two DVDs totaling $22. I want them to die in a fire.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Qballer on Sat Oct 27, 2012 3:21 am

Dolph Ziggler & Daniel Bryan are the only reasons i still even watch raw and i was wondering when they are going to put the belt on dolph. do you think they'll save it for wrestlemania or will they scrap the plans early like they did for daniel bryan last year? personally, i'd like to see it earlier because shaemus isn't a very good champion but i think his reign would last longer if he won it at wrestlemania
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby buzzy on Sat Oct 27, 2012 3:42 am

rumors are/were that dolph will win it this year
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Sat Oct 27, 2012 7:55 am

It seems like they're trying to book Ziggler as an afterthought, so that it'll be more of a surprise when he cashes in. However, that doesn't do much to build him as a credible champion.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby deihatein on Sat Oct 27, 2012 12:47 pm

Everyone aside from CM Punk/Cena/Orton/The Rock/Brock Lesnar/Vicke Guerrero is an afterthought.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Sat Oct 27, 2012 5:44 pm

I'd say Daniel Bryan and Kane are getting a fair bit of exposure at the moment. AJ's been right there too, even if things didn't exactly work out in the GM role.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby deihatein on Sun Oct 28, 2012 12:05 am

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shadowgrin wrote:Quick question: who is better in basketball, a black dude or a pinoy dude. If you thought or considered for a moment that it's the black dude then you're also a little bit racist.

End of any racist discussion.


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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Qballer on Sun Oct 28, 2012 4:45 am

Andrew wrote:I'd say Daniel Bryan and Kane are getting a fair bit of exposure at the moment. AJ's been right there too, even if things didn't exactly work out in the GM role.

the Bryan/Kane segmants are gold. they are hilarious

also, with her out of a GM role, I'd love to see AJ make a run for the divas title
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Sun Oct 28, 2012 2:05 pm

Yeah, hopefully AJ doesn't fall by the wayside now that she's out of that role. I'm still cringing at the prospect of them rehashing Vickie in the on-screen authority role for the umpteenth time, though.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby JaoSming on Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:19 am

So AJ is forced to resign because of an alleged affair with a superstar, and is replaced by someone who has actually had affairs with superstars, within the storylines of course. Really? They couldn't have thought of anything better than that?

logical! So if you hate Vickie like I do, at least you can always watch TNA.......as long as you aren't sick of the Aces & Eights....
If plans stay the course, the Aces & Eights storyline in TNA is expected to go for at least another 6 months according to F4Wonline.com




So, what do grown ups watch on TV these days?
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby JaoSming on Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:56 pm

HiaC

Overall impression







. :facepalm: Champions coming out first, missed opportunities, really bad botches, and stupid swerves. I'm not going to feel bad about skipping until SS.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby buzzy on Mon Oct 29, 2012 1:00 pm

i laughed my ass off at that finish
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Mon Oct 29, 2012 7:40 pm

Well, that's one way to avoid putting Ryback over for the belt without killing him off. The heel referee angle has been done before (outside of guest referees, that is; Danny Davis and the Hart Foundation, Earl Hebner's original character to name a couple of examples) but not all that often, so if they run with it they could make it work as another way of keeping Punk's heat going. That doesn't make it a stroke of brilliance though, but I guess it got them out of the corner they'd written themselves into.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby koberulz on Mon Oct 29, 2012 8:01 pm

It was obviously planned before that corner came up; it's the same ref from the 'foot on the rope' incident and he's been in developmental for some time.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby JaoSming on Mon Oct 29, 2012 11:50 pm

Andrew wrote:Well, that's one way to avoid putting Ryback over for the belt without killing him off.

The best solution of keeping the belt on Punk and protecting Ryback was a 60 minute time limit draw. But c'mon, we need to squeeze in a Rey and Cara tag match even though the tag champs already entertained earlier in the show.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Mon Oct 29, 2012 11:56 pm

I don't know if Ryback is ready for that. Probably not the best approach for a HIAC match, either.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby JaoSming on Mon Oct 29, 2012 11:58 pm

If they kept up the pace they were at, I thought it would be good. Keeping it brutal with the weapons and MMA ground n pound would have been easy ways to protect his stamina and lengthen the match.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby koberulz on Tue Oct 30, 2012 1:26 am

There are no time limits in WWE period, much less Hell in a Cell.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Tue Oct 30, 2012 7:51 am

Yeah, they don't do that much anymore. One of those things that they'll use when it works for the storyline and not bother with the rest of the time.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby buzzy on Tue Oct 30, 2012 8:53 am

Could've introduced an Ironman Cell match or something.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby koberulz on Tue Oct 30, 2012 12:24 pm

Andrew wrote:Yeah, they don't do that much anymore. One of those things that they'll use when it works for the storyline and not bother with the rest of the time.

I don't believe they've ever reintroduced it, even for that. Though if they did, it'd be pretty obvious where it was going, like when Hogan went to TNA and brought time limits with him. Matches were 20 minutes, except one ten-minute match that oh-so-surprisingly ended in a time limit draw.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Qballer on Tue Oct 30, 2012 4:23 pm

JaoSming wrote:HiaC

Overall impression







. :facepalm:

no DZ to bring the show up. he needs a new feud and soon
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Wed Oct 31, 2012 9:11 am

koberulz wrote:I don't believe they've ever reintroduced it, even for that. Though if they did, it'd be pretty obvious where it was going, like when Hogan went to TNA and brought time limits with him. Matches were 20 minutes, except one ten-minute match that oh-so-surprisingly ended in a time limit draw.


About the only time they've used it in WWE in the past decade or so would be the Ironman Matches. Those are the only instances I can recall off the top of my head.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Qballer on Wed Nov 07, 2012 6:57 pm

Linda loses in Connecticut. can we end the PG era now? plz? thx.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Wed Nov 07, 2012 7:36 pm

I doubt it'll make a difference. Going PG has allowed them to get lucrative sponsorship deals. Besides, for a time WCW was able to take the lead in the Monday Night Wars despite having PG restrictions. WWE just needs to push the limits of the rating, cater to older fans as well as younger ones and avoid insulting our intelligence as much as possible. If the matches are entertaining and the angles interesting, a PG rating doesn't have to mean a subpar product. Punk's worked shoot angle last year and Taker/HHH this year are proof of that.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby JaoSming on Thu Nov 08, 2012 12:29 am

nvm the G show on Saturday morning
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby deihatein on Thu Nov 08, 2012 3:06 am

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Look at Vince McMahon face at 1:56 to 2:08
shadowgrin wrote:Quick question: who is better in basketball, a black dude or a pinoy dude. If you thought or considered for a moment that it's the black dude then you're also a little bit racist.

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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby JaoSming on Thu Nov 08, 2012 5:29 am

so much money lost for nothing
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Thu Nov 08, 2012 8:38 am

He's not going to be in a good mood today.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby formx on Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:29 am

Andrew wrote:He's not going to be in a good mood today.

He's never in a good mood....... Unless if Cena wins of course

JaoSming wrote:so much money lost for nothing

TNA would find a much worse way to lose that much money. :lol:
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby JaoSming on Fri Nov 09, 2012 11:51 am

According to F4WOnline.com, Brad Maddox is said to be Triple H's latest "project," and while he was not seen as having major potential in WWE developmental, there is a strong chance that he will somehow win his match against Ryback on Raw Monday night and earn his "million dollar contract."

:facepalm2:
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Lean on Fri Nov 09, 2012 1:27 pm

:facepalm:

Really, the storylines after the Punk turn has been lame.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Qballer on Fri Nov 09, 2012 5:06 pm

WWE Main Event has been averaging around 1.46 million viewers and a 0.9 rating since its premiere on Ion, which is better than TNA Impact Wrestling draws on Spike TV

LOL
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby deihatein on Fri Nov 09, 2012 9:09 pm

Has anyone who watched the Hell in a Cell PPV comment on the Sheamus-Big Show match? Maffew(the botchamania guy) liked it and called it great and that was unexpected.

This might be late though.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby JaoSming on Sat Nov 10, 2012 12:17 am

Qballer wrote:
WWE Main Event has been averaging around 1.46 million viewers and a 0.9 rating since its premiere on Ion, which is better than TNA Impact Wrestling draws on Spike TV

LOL

why LOL?

dei. wrote:Has anyone who watched the Hell in a Cell PPV comment on the Sheamus-Big Show match? Maffew(the botchamania guy) liked it and called it great and that was unexpected.

This might be late though.

Definitely wasn't terrible
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Sat Nov 10, 2012 10:09 am

I haven't seen it but I had heard it was about the only match on the card that turned out reasonably well.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby JaoSming on Mon Nov 12, 2012 1:57 pm

Another fantastic TNA PPV, even if the last two matches were kinda meh. D-Von & Angle killed the momentum of the PPV, I don't know if it was storyline or not, but D-Von hobbling around was no good, too slow. Aries & Hardy's Ladder match did its job, but the ladder issues took away from the match even if it made it unique.

I will say this, Chavo is so much better as an actual wrestler than a side show :applaud: some awesome moves from him tonight.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby JaoSming on Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:01 pm

Yep, enjoy your ratings, doesn't mean the quality is there.
http://www.wrestlezone.com/editorials/2 ... -the-shark
I used to think wrestling could never go under.

Now, I’m not so sure.

Monday’s WWE Raw was a PPV “go-home” show, the last before Sunday’s Survivor Series. “Go-home” shows usually have extra juice by way of trying to, you know, SELL THE PRODUCT.

No such luck. Monday’s Raw was PUTRID, shocking in its abject lack of quality and interesting moments. If that’s the best WWE can do with cash on the table, fake wrestling is a lot closer to the end than the beginning. ABSOLUTELY MONOTONOUS DRIVEL.

Fake wrestling websites don’t see it that way, because if you’re under a certain age, all you’ve seen is some variation on absolutely monotonous drivel. Fake wrestling websites also try to stay positive. Without fake wrestling, what’s there to cover? (Hint: REAL FIGHTING. Meltzer figured that out YEARS AGO.)

Anyway, take my word for it: Raw was EXCREMENT. By way of debate, I throw down the gauntlet: What did you like about it? Seriously, what was there to like about that steaming pile of dung?

How about the scandalous tryst between…two single people? Or the heart attack skit…that can’t lead to a match? Perhaps you liked the bare minimum of action. Or the Disco Inferno knockoff. Or the bad comedy. Or Brad Maddox’s abs. Or yet another Punk-Cena match. (At least that was decent, if just one in a series.)

Wrestling 101 is ignored. Logic sacrificed at the altar of…well, nothing that draws money, that’s for sure.

The top heel was taunting and bullying the elderly announcer that just had a heart attack. WHERE’S THE TOP BABYFACE? We know he’s in the building. He has a PPV match against the top heel in six days. Wouldn’t defending Lawler advance that match? OF COURSE IT WOULD. Roddy Piper turned ‘face when Don Muraco bullied Gordon Solie. Worked like a charm.

In any promotion throughout history, the top babyface comes out. Hulk Hogan would have. WHERE WAS CENA?

Cena did come out to defend the honor of his girlfriend who’s not his girlfriend. Cena + A.J. = BAD MOVE. Cena is every female fan’s fantasy boyfriend. Matching him with a super hot chick makes him all the more unattainable. Why is the top ‘face in a romantic storyline, anyway? HE SHOULD BE KICKING ASS.

Raw just has a sense that we’re waiting around for something. And we are. We’re waiting for The Rock, Undertaker, Triple H and Brock Lesnar to return. THE REAL STARS. Every time they come – and go – those left behind are diminished that much more. Some – like Punk and Cena – are bulletproof. Others – like Orton, Miz, Del Rio and Ziggler – are not. They’re fading. They’re just part of the holding pattern. That hasn’t yet happened to Sheamus and Ryback. But it will. Give it time.

Orton was big-time. No more. Could have something to do with mimicking a snake. CREEPY. Miz, Del Rio and Ziggler got pushed to a certain point, were decelerated, and can’t regain lost momentum. Some can spend years in the mid-card, then take the next step up. Most get permanently defined as mid-carders. PAYING YOUR DUES is an outdated concept that does nothing but ruin careers. You’re either a big-timer, or not.

Performers on top want younger performers to pay their dues. That’s how they stay on top. Sabotage disguised as mentoring.

Sooner or later, the REAL STARS won’t ever come back. Time marches on. Cena’s 35. Then what?

Anyway, Raw sucks. Three hours is a problem, but not THE problem. Creative couldn’t put together a good one-hour show. The elimination of Vince McMahon’s iron fist via death or retirement wouldn’t help, because Chyna Jr. would take the reins, and she doesn’t know what she’s doing, either. The only two guys that could successfully retool WWE are the two guys WWE pointedly won’t listen to, namely Jim Ross and Paul Heyman.

I was co-host of Nitro during the show’s worst period. I look back at those Nitros and know they were better than Monday’s Raw. Than most episodes of Raw. Nothing done on Raw truly engages the viewer. It’s all fast-food wrestling. Sadly disposable.

Sometimes I wonder how much longer I want to write about wrestling. I love the business. Its current state is DEPRESSING.

And then, an epiphany: AS LONG AS THEY KEEP PAYING ME.

I’m often asked if I could do better creatively. Of course I could. You could, too. That’s how bad this product is. I could write shows better than Monday’s Raw during my radio show’s commercial breaks. It’s depressing to think AN ENTIRE WRITING STAFF with Raw as its WEEKLY FOCAL POINT can’t do better.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Thu Nov 15, 2012 10:20 pm

Fake wrestling websites also try to stay positive.


By the same token, negativity doesn't automatically make something or someone smarter, or correct. Not that I disagree with the assessment of the WWE product per se, but adopting a staunchly negative view is just as bad as overly forgiving optimism.

Ratings, popularity and revenue certainly don't mean something is necessarily good, but it suggests that it's not going anywhere. That's the big problem for TNA long term; the audience isn't expanding and the company is reportedly bleeding money. Their lawsuit against WWE could well turn out to be their undoing, because WWE has the money to drag it out for years and a really, really good legal team.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby JaoSming on Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:31 pm

but the product is still good, just ask an indie wrestling game developer
How many of our new followers are watching #IMPACTLive right now? Been pretty good of late..

and even though it was a return to a taped episode, I would agree through and through.

why should I care about ratings, lawsuits, or anything else that is outside of my control? if the product disappears it would suck, but WWE only resembles anything I'd watch at PPVs, kinda, where TNA has been consistently good and entertaining for months now. Convincing you guys to watch isn't going to change the ratings, same as our site promoting Live isn't going to change sales unless there was a PC release. I'm just trying to grasp why you guys dislike something I like, when the main reasons I've gotten are the lawsuit, ratings, or the infamous Claire Lynch storyline that WWE is currently copying.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:20 pm

I don't dislike TNA because of the lawsuit. I'm just saying it could prove be a very costly mistake on their part, one that could potentially put an end to the company. That's a shame for a company that does have potential and an enthusiastic fanbase, not to mention an industry that could really benefit from serious competition. I wasn't citing it a reason for not watching, I was just bringing it up as a point of interest about TNA.

To be honest I don't actually dislike TNA, I just can't get into it. I'll admit that I've found it unappealing over the years because it's presented itself as very bush league and in recent years, aped some of the worst aspects of WCW back in the day. I also have trouble supporting anything that Eric Bischoff and Hulk Hogan are involved in, which I realise is unfair to the product as a whole but that's just the way it is. The incident with Sting and Jeff Hardy was also pretty off-putting, that was not one of the company's finer moments. My enthusiasm for pro wrestling is also kind of in a lull in general at the moment; I'm interested enough to maintain some interest in what's going on in the promotion I'm familiar with (WWE), but not interested enough to seek out more wrestling content. That's probably the main factor, really.

As far as ratings are concerned, I agree. I believe in liking what you like whether it's popular or not and enjoying it regardless of what others think or like. But if we're talking about which company is doing better and more likely to be around in a few years time, it's a relevant point. Yes, that stuff is out of our control, but if you're a TNA fan I think you have to be concerned about that to some extent, because if it gets to the point where the Carter family decides "We're not throwing away any more money on this", that's likely the end of the company. That doesn't mean you shouldn't just enjoy what they're doing now, but I think it's fair to say that that's a legitimate concern for TNA, something that would suck for its fans and again, the industry in general.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby koberulz on Sun Nov 18, 2012 9:52 pm

What's all this about a lawsuit?
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby JaoSming on Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:29 am

TNA is suing WWE over them contacting TNA contracted wrasslers about when contracts were up and coming back to WWE after. Something like that. I know the Flair stuff is a part of it, as is Alex Shelly and a couple other TNA names, but its BS.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Mon Nov 19, 2012 8:38 am

A former TNA employee with knowledge of when various wrestlers' contracts were expiring had gone to work for WWE and decided to provide them with that information. WWE subsequently fired him and informed TNA of what happened, presumably as a show of good faith. TNA decided to sue, an ill-advised move considering their financial position compared to WWE's resources and legal team. On one hand you have to admire them for standing up for themselves, but given the circumstances it's probably not the best move.
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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby Andrew on Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:32 am

Nasty.

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Re: Professional Wrestling (WWE, TNA, ROH, etc)

Postby koberulz on Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:11 am

The week after Turning Point, TNA has an X Division title match, #1 contender's rematch which switches the number one contender, and advertises a TV title rematch.

Well that didn't last.
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