Demo Impressions Thread

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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby mp3 on Sun Aug 13, 2017 11:52 pm

I've had little chance to play the demo so far but I wasn't to happy about being dragged straight into a story driven cutscreens with having to watch SAS for that long then finding out I had to start the start the story based game just so I can play the Cavs/Warriors game..

Quick question tho, how do I get my face from the app into the game? Ive just started playing the game at Rucker so is there an option to add it after that?
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby [Q] on Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:29 am

Yeah in the menu, on the right side you can change your appearance
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Andrew on Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:54 am

You've also got to make sure that your EA Account is linked to your PSN account.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby mp3 on Mon Aug 14, 2017 1:14 am

I saw the option for scanning your face but clicking on it just took me to a screen that said to download the app :-/
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby [Q] on Mon Aug 14, 2017 1:46 am

Yeah so download your app, then on the app sign into your EA account that's linked to your PSN account, then it will show up in game
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Dee4Three on Mon Aug 14, 2017 1:51 am

Last night I played a few more hours of the demo, after I played 2K17 for a couple hours, and even went back and played some 2K14 for X1. I have to tell you, I just can't get over the choppy, robotic animations, or lack of response with the controllers. You guys always ask for more specifics, so here are the issues (I may make a video of this, even though its so obvious). Most of the time, you can't even catch and shoot with a guy immediately, he does a strange/slow/robotic gather animation (that sometimes lasts so long that the defender gets there even after being 5-10 ft away). You cant just move into a spot and shoot on the move (like players do all the time in real life), if it's a sideaway, it looks and feels like something from Live 2001, if you are moving into a spot and try to shoot a straight up jumper, the gather animation is so unnatural that the defender easily gets there (100% of the time), and the shot feels slow and unnatural. Same with catches/making passes... a player will catch a pass, and it will take them so long to get the body adjusted (And to transition to the next robotic shooting animation) that the defender easily gets back. Making passes are completely hit or miss, as in if your player isn't already facing the direction of the intended recipient, he will do this long passing animation (sometimes wind-up?) that ruins the flow of the game.

Small dribbles hurt the flow of explosiveness with the good ball handlers (they are good to have in the game, but the game lacks actual explosive moves like the players have in real life). I want to go wide with a cross over, or create actual space with a step back (and actually shoot a smooth shot off of it). Explosive first steps don't exist either.

The post game has improved, but so many flicks at the hoop (high arcing flicks), look really unnatural. The ball also resembles a beach ball going through the air sometimes, and the rim mechanics are way out of whack. I've shot so many soft shots (where the ball is sailing through the air with no spin) only to clank hard off the rim or take strange, hard unnatural bounces.

2 years working on the game, and it bothers me that these things weren't addressed. I know its a demo, but we are a month from release, I doubt these things will be fixed. As Andrew stated above, even the animation speeds in general seem really out of place sometimes, they don't look natural.

Also, I went back and played Live 16 as well, and the players models have also gotten worse, while at the same time, cyberfaces havnt improved (Kyrie looks horrible).

Just a tad frustrated...
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby ThaLiveKing on Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:49 am

Dee4Three wrote:Last night I played a few more hours of the demo, after I played 2K17 for a couple hours, and even went back and played some 2K14 for X1. I have to tell you, I just can't get over the choppy, robotic animations, or lack of response with the controllers. You guys always ask for more specifics, so here are the issues (I may make a video of this, even though its so obvious). Most of the time, you can't even catch and shoot with a guy immediately, he does a strange/slow/robotic gather animation (that sometimes lasts so long that the defender gets there even after being 5-10 ft away). You cant just move into a spot and shoot on the move (like players do all the time in real life), if it's a sideaway, it looks and feels like something from Live 2001, if you are moving into a spot and try to shoot a straight up jumper, the gather animation is so unnatural that the defender easily gets there (100% of the time), and the shot feels slow and unnatural. Same with catches/making passes... a player will catch a pass, and it will take them so long to get the body adjusted (And to transition to the next robotic shooting animation) that the defender easily gets back. Making passes are completely hit or miss, as in if your player isn't already facing the direction of the intended recipient, he will do this long passing animation (sometimes wind-up?) that ruins the flow of the game.

Small dribbles hurt the flow of explosiveness with the good ball handlers (they are good to have in the game, but the game lacks actual explosive moves like the players have in real life). I want to go wide with a cross over, or create actual space with a step back (and actually shoot a smooth shot off of it). Explosive first steps don't exist either.

The post game has improved, but so many flicks at the hoop (high arcing flicks), look really unnatural. The ball also resembles a beach ball going through the air sometimes, and the rim mechanics are way out of whack. I've shot so many soft shots (where the ball is sailing through the air with no spin) only to clank hard off the rim or take strange, hard unnatural bounces.

2 years working on the game, and it bothers me that these things weren't addressed. I know its a demo, but we are a month from release, I doubt these things will be fixed. As Andrew stated above, even the animation speeds in general seem really out of place sometimes, they don't look natural.

Also, I went back and played Live 16 as well, and the players models have also gotten worse, while at the same time, cyberfaces havnt improved (Kyrie looks horrible).

Just a tad frustrated...


It took me two days to get used to the new dribble system, I haven't got used to the post game yet. You can't go back and forth between games, you have to sit there and play through all your mistakes and you'll figure it out. The game is rhythm based so you have to really pay attention to what each person is doing before you counter, that's how in most cases the game will feel organic. Over time, you will get how the game is supposed to be played. There's some player movement issues that I don't like, I'm going to try to make a video about it soon, but I thought overall the game play was fine. I've been telling people since EA PLAY that it's going to be an adjustment, and seeing a lot of responses, you can see that it is.

About the comment in bold, this is one issue I have with the dribbling, you can't really get space, unless you trigger the animation based on the defensive player's position to gain separation. I hope it's addressed once the game is launched at some point.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Dee4Three on Mon Aug 14, 2017 7:42 am

ThaLiveKing wrote:
Dee4Three wrote:Last night I played a few more hours of the demo, after I played 2K17 for a couple hours, and even went back and played some 2K14 for X1. I have to tell you, I just can't get over the choppy, robotic animations, or lack of response with the controllers. You guys always ask for more specifics, so here are the issues (I may make a video of this, even though its so obvious). Most of the time, you can't even catch and shoot with a guy immediately, he does a strange/slow/robotic gather animation (that sometimes lasts so long that the defender gets there even after being 5-10 ft away). You cant just move into a spot and shoot on the move (like players do all the time in real life), if it's a sideaway, it looks and feels like something from Live 2001, if you are moving into a spot and try to shoot a straight up jumper, the gather animation is so unnatural that the defender easily gets there (100% of the time), and the shot feels slow and unnatural. Same with catches/making passes... a player will catch a pass, and it will take them so long to get the body adjusted (And to transition to the next robotic shooting animation) that the defender easily gets back. Making passes are completely hit or miss, as in if your player isn't already facing the direction of the intended recipient, he will do this long passing animation (sometimes wind-up?) that ruins the flow of the game.

Small dribbles hurt the flow of explosiveness with the good ball handlers (they are good to have in the game, but the game lacks actual explosive moves like the players have in real life). I want to go wide with a cross over, or create actual space with a step back (and actually shoot a smooth shot off of it). Explosive first steps don't exist either.

The post game has improved, but so many flicks at the hoop (high arcing flicks), look really unnatural. The ball also resembles a beach ball going through the air sometimes, and the rim mechanics are way out of whack. I've shot so many soft shots (where the ball is sailing through the air with no spin) only to clank hard off the rim or take strange, hard unnatural bounces.

2 years working on the game, and it bothers me that these things weren't addressed. I know its a demo, but we are a month from release, I doubt these things will be fixed. As Andrew stated above, even the animation speeds in general seem really out of place sometimes, they don't look natural.

Also, I went back and played Live 16 as well, and the players models have also gotten worse, while at the same time, cyberfaces havnt improved (Kyrie looks horrible).

Just a tad frustrated...


It took me two days to get used to the new dribble system, I haven't got used to the post game yet. You can't go back and forth between games, you have to sit there and play through all your mistakes and you'll figure it out. The game is rhythm based so you have to really pay attention to what each person is doing before you counter, that's how in most cases the game will feel organic. Over time, you will get how the game is supposed to be played. There's some player movement issues that I don't like, I'm going to try to make a video about it soon, but I thought overall the game play was fine. I've been telling people since EA PLAY that it's going to be an adjustment, and seeing a lot of responses, you can see that it is.

About the comment in bold, this is one issue I have with the dribbling, you can't really get space, unless you trigger the animation based on the defensive player's position to gain separation. I hope it's addressed once the game is launched at some point.


This is going to be said with all due respect, because I do respect you and like the way you carry yourself.

This has nothing to do with me not being used to the game, I also played it for another 4 hours today. I have a great grasp on the dribbling (which you can see even in my video), I have a great feel for shot releases (timing, etc), I have a feel for the game. Everything you said has nothing to do with the not being able to come to a sudden stop and shoot a smooth jumper, or robotic sideaways or the passing system. No matter how good someone has a feel for the game, it does nothing to combat those glaring game issues. I can know how to get by someone, or do a step back, but when you can't stop on a dime to pull up because the animation transitions are so broken, it means nothing. The glaring animation problems with the game still persist. No matter how used to the game you are, it changes nothing about the beach ball physics, the ball floating softly through the air but clanking off the rim hard like it was a TMAC line drive.

It changes none of that. Again, it's with all due respect that I disagree with you. I respect your work and opinions.

Jumping back and forth between games absolutely is relevant, becuase it's all about feel. It's the same sport, we absolutely compare everything in life. The physics of the game (animation transitions, etc) are very similar to that of 2K9 (which I still own). But they even fall short in feel to that game in many ways.

I'm hoping they can fix some of these things before release, I'll probably be buying the game anyway for Ultimate Team. 2 years working on the game, and I can't even step in and take a smooth jumper? I'm not impressed.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby [Q] on Mon Aug 14, 2017 11:27 am

So I picked it up again after not playing it yesterday and there was a lot less lag today, probably because there's a hell of a lot less players on today.

It was a lot more playable, as I nailed a couple 3s that I wouldn't have hit on Friday and managed to get a block. Staying in front of guys is still tough but was easier today.also, playing with pdub on Friday he had mentioned the game "was playing for him" which I didn't understand. There was a bit of lag so I couldn't tell but today I noticed it quite a bit. Your guy would go up for a rebound with no input, stop at the 3 point line when going up the court, and would generally redirect your guy when moving in the frontcourt. Honestly I got a rebound like that so didn't mind it that one time but it's annoying that you're not in full control like they try to advertise. One place it actually does help is in the corner it helps keep you inbounds

All in all, I think I enjoy the street part of the game enough to pre-order for the discount. It's pretty much the same as live 16's online game but with a few added bells and whistles so I'll bite on it.

Plus, I figure they'll take feedback and improve the game throughout the year.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby kingpnp on Tue Aug 15, 2017 1:25 am

Dee4Three wrote:
ThaLiveKing wrote:
Dee4Three wrote:Last night I played a few more hours of the demo, after I played 2K17 for a couple hours, and even went back and played some 2K14 for X1. I have to tell you, I just can't get over the choppy, robotic animations, or lack of response with the controllers. You guys always ask for more specifics, so here are the issues (I may make a video of this, even though its so obvious). Most of the time, you can't even catch and shoot with a guy immediately, he does a strange/slow/robotic gather animation (that sometimes lasts so long that the defender gets there even after being 5-10 ft away). You cant just move into a spot and shoot on the move (like players do all the time in real life), if it's a sideaway, it looks and feels like something from Live 2001, if you are moving into a spot and try to shoot a straight up jumper, the gather animation is so unnatural that the defender easily gets there (100% of the time), and the shot feels slow and unnatural. Same with catches/making passes... a player will catch a pass, and it will take them so long to get the body adjusted (And to transition to the next robotic shooting animation) that the defender easily gets back. Making passes are completely hit or miss, as in if your player isn't already facing the direction of the intended recipient, he will do this long passing animation (sometimes wind-up?) that ruins the flow of the game.

Small dribbles hurt the flow of explosiveness with the good ball handlers (they are good to have in the game, but the game lacks actual explosive moves like the players have in real life). I want to go wide with a cross over, or create actual space with a step back (and actually shoot a smooth shot off of it). Explosive first steps don't exist either.

The post game has improved, but so many flicks at the hoop (high arcing flicks), look really unnatural. The ball also resembles a beach ball going through the air sometimes, and the rim mechanics are way out of whack. I've shot so many soft shots (where the ball is sailing through the air with no spin) only to clank hard off the rim or take strange, hard unnatural bounces.

2 years working on the game, and it bothers me that these things weren't addressed. I know its a demo, but we are a month from release, I doubt these things will be fixed. As Andrew stated above, even the animation speeds in general seem really out of place sometimes, they don't look natural.

Also, I went back and played Live 16 as well, and the players models have also gotten worse, while at the same time, cyberfaces havnt improved (Kyrie looks horrible).

Just a tad frustrated...


It took me two days to get used to the new dribble system, I haven't got used to the post game yet. You can't go back and forth between games, you have to sit there and play through all your mistakes and you'll figure it out. The game is rhythm based so you have to really pay attention to what each person is doing before you counter, that's how in most cases the game will feel organic. Over time, you will get how the game is supposed to be played. There's some player movement issues that I don't like, I'm going to try to make a video about it soon, but I thought overall the game play was fine. I've been telling people since EA PLAY that it's going to be an adjustment, and seeing a lot of responses, you can see that it is.

About the comment in bold, this is one issue I have with the dribbling, you can't really get space, unless you trigger the animation based on the defensive player's position to gain separation. I hope it's addressed once the game is launched at some point.


This is going to be said with all due respect, because I do respect you and like the way you carry yourself.

This has nothing to do with me not being used to the game, I also played it for another 4 hours today. I have a great grasp on the dribbling (which you can see even in my video), I have a great feel for shot releases (timing, etc), I have a feel for the game. Everything you said has nothing to do with the not being able to come to a sudden stop and shoot a smooth jumper, or robotic sideaways or the passing system. No matter how good someone has a feel for the game, it does nothing to combat those glaring game issues. I can know how to get by someone, or do a step back, but when you can't stop on a dime to pull up because the animation transitions are so broken, it means nothing. The glaring animation problems with the game still persist. No matter how used to the game you are, it changes nothing about the beach ball physics, the ball floating softly through the air but clanking off the rim hard like it was a TMAC line drive.

It changes none of that. Again, it's with all due respect that I disagree with you. I respect your work and opinions.

Jumping back and forth between games absolutely is relevant, becuase it's all about feel. It's the same sport, we absolutely compare everything in life. The physics of the game (animation transitions, etc) are very similar to that of 2K9 (which I still own). But they even fall short in feel to that game in many ways.

I'm hoping they can fix some of these things before release, I'll probably be buying the game anyway for Ultimate Team. 2 years working on the game, and I can't even step in and take a smooth jumper? I'm not impressed.


when you talk about beach ball physics. I hear you but i may need to see some footage of what you're talking about. Especially if you're going back to 2k and then back to live. I know for a fact you can't be too upset about basketball physics when we all know 2k doesnt really have any actual basketball physics. How many of those camel hump shots have we've seen? You know the ones, where you shoot, the ball then starts to come off its arc, then goes back up again mid air. then goes in. or the times when you shoot the ball from the side and you're 8 feet away from the basket. yet the basketball hits the rim bounces super high then goes backwards over the backboard out of bounds. or the layups when the ball is completely inside the rim going down then it miraculously comes out of the rim to fall off for the blown layup. Now just because 2k's basketball physics sucks. doesnt mean live's doesnt suck too. I get that. I just need to see what you're talking about in video form.

On to you switching back and forth to soon. The other poster you responded was actually correct. The problem you're going to have with switching like that is that you will not get use to the controls, and the rhythm of the nba live(new) game. you just wont. because you have years and years and years of 2k under your belt. Whether you love it, like it a little, or hate 2k. if you're like the rest of us you have had no real legit other choice for a long time. so you get use to how it plays, even use to the things you didnt like. Like...the dribbling. Not sure If I've mentioned this on this forum before. But it took me a while to finally realize the difference in dribbling from a nba live game and a 2k game. I couldnt figure out what to call the difference. nba 2k's dribbling is for viewing purposes more so for actually breaking a persons ankles and getting space to score. The badges are their to break ankles and to create space. Those are the things that make sure those animations kick in, even when they shouldnt.

nba 2k's dribbling = Mortal Kombat fighting game combo moves. down, back + X = sub zeros ice hammer. the same type of thing with 2k's dribbling. you plug in the buttons FIRST> then you see the chained moves 2nd. and yes its noticeable thats its not 1 to 1 or even close to one to 1. meaning when you press the buttons you are not doing the moves yet. you are starting the first move and the rest plays out later after the other button pushes have ended then the rest of the sequence kicks in.

Nba live dribbling = close to 1 to 1. two hit someone with a spin move one way then a spin the other. I swing the stick one way, and swing it back the moment i see my foot planting after the first spin. I dont do it before it happens in hopes the animation sequence will kick in like a combo move. This means I can be more exact with my move and based it on instinct once I know how to pull off the dribble moves.

in 2k. i have to think ahead and already have a mix of combo moves I want to do before the defender even plays defense on me. you can do that in real life. but the problem with not playing on instinct and taking what the defense gives you. means if the defender doesnt fall for that original combo. you are toast and you have no way to counter since you have to wait til the sequence is over before you can make the next move.

In your video. I saw you make 2 baseline spin moves that were appropriate. but that was also a one move control. Where you didnt have to chain anything together to get by your opponent. you didnt need to set him up one way to go the other or fake him,etc. you had 2 other nice dribble moves, the shamgod, and one other which was less of a dribble move and more of a layup animation with the euro step.

The other moves you use to get by your opponent were not the best moves in real life to get open to score. you actually ran into traffic on a few of those moves. some you should've spun off the guy the other way. others you should've shook right and gone left. but instead you choose to keep going the way you were going and because Kyrie is quicker than his man defending him. he could get his shoulder slightly passed them anyway.

^^That is a product of you not totally know how to use the dribbling and/or you not knowing how to use the dribbling based on instinct. something 2k can't really do YET.(we dont know about 18). This is why you need to stay playing that live demo then come back with another review. not after a few days. but give it a week. and dont play 2k either. The same way you had to tunnel thru all the 2k crap you dont like just like the rest of us and figure it out to start liking the game even thru its warts. is the exact same thing you have to with this game. if you do that, and you STILL aint feeling it. then so be it.

If you keep going back to 2k, you will keep telling yourself "this aint realistic. I dont like the feel to this live game." when in reality you truly are saying this doesnt feel like the only basketball game i've played for years in 2k so it must not be right. I can't make those exact same moves in live that i can make in 2k. The reason I'm making this suggestion is because you're not the only person I've heard say these things. I have friends who play 2k and played the live demo with the same quick complaints. When in reality you can tell a lot of their issues have more to do with it not playing just like 2k.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Dee4Three on Tue Aug 15, 2017 1:41 am

kingpnp wrote:
Dee4Three wrote:
ThaLiveKing wrote:
Dee4Three wrote:Last night I played a few more hours of the demo, after I played 2K17 for a couple hours, and even went back and played some 2K14 for X1. I have to tell you, I just can't get over the choppy, robotic animations, or lack of response with the controllers. You guys always ask for more specifics, so here are the issues (I may make a video of this, even though its so obvious). Most of the time, you can't even catch and shoot with a guy immediately, he does a strange/slow/robotic gather animation (that sometimes lasts so long that the defender gets there even after being 5-10 ft away). You cant just move into a spot and shoot on the move (like players do all the time in real life), if it's a sideaway, it looks and feels like something from Live 2001, if you are moving into a spot and try to shoot a straight up jumper, the gather animation is so unnatural that the defender easily gets there (100% of the time), and the shot feels slow and unnatural. Same with catches/making passes... a player will catch a pass, and it will take them so long to get the body adjusted (And to transition to the next robotic shooting animation) that the defender easily gets back. Making passes are completely hit or miss, as in if your player isn't already facing the direction of the intended recipient, he will do this long passing animation (sometimes wind-up?) that ruins the flow of the game.

Small dribbles hurt the flow of explosiveness with the good ball handlers (they are good to have in the game, but the game lacks actual explosive moves like the players have in real life). I want to go wide with a cross over, or create actual space with a step back (and actually shoot a smooth shot off of it). Explosive first steps don't exist either.

The post game has improved, but so many flicks at the hoop (high arcing flicks), look really unnatural. The ball also resembles a beach ball going through the air sometimes, and the rim mechanics are way out of whack. I've shot so many soft shots (where the ball is sailing through the air with no spin) only to clank hard off the rim or take strange, hard unnatural bounces.

2 years working on the game, and it bothers me that these things weren't addressed. I know its a demo, but we are a month from release, I doubt these things will be fixed. As Andrew stated above, even the animation speeds in general seem really out of place sometimes, they don't look natural.

Also, I went back and played Live 16 as well, and the players models have also gotten worse, while at the same time, cyberfaces havnt improved (Kyrie looks horrible).

Just a tad frustrated...


It took me two days to get used to the new dribble system, I haven't got used to the post game yet. You can't go back and forth between games, you have to sit there and play through all your mistakes and you'll figure it out. The game is rhythm based so you have to really pay attention to what each person is doing before you counter, that's how in most cases the game will feel organic. Over time, you will get how the game is supposed to be played. There's some player movement issues that I don't like, I'm going to try to make a video about it soon, but I thought overall the game play was fine. I've been telling people since EA PLAY that it's going to be an adjustment, and seeing a lot of responses, you can see that it is.

About the comment in bold, this is one issue I have with the dribbling, you can't really get space, unless you trigger the animation based on the defensive player's position to gain separation. I hope it's addressed once the game is launched at some point.


This is going to be said with all due respect, because I do respect you and like the way you carry yourself.

This has nothing to do with me not being used to the game, I also played it for another 4 hours today. I have a great grasp on the dribbling (which you can see even in my video), I have a great feel for shot releases (timing, etc), I have a feel for the game. Everything you said has nothing to do with the not being able to come to a sudden stop and shoot a smooth jumper, or robotic sideaways or the passing system. No matter how good someone has a feel for the game, it does nothing to combat those glaring game issues. I can know how to get by someone, or do a step back, but when you can't stop on a dime to pull up because the animation transitions are so broken, it means nothing. The glaring animation problems with the game still persist. No matter how used to the game you are, it changes nothing about the beach ball physics, the ball floating softly through the air but clanking off the rim hard like it was a TMAC line drive.

It changes none of that. Again, it's with all due respect that I disagree with you. I respect your work and opinions.

Jumping back and forth between games absolutely is relevant, becuase it's all about feel. It's the same sport, we absolutely compare everything in life. The physics of the game (animation transitions, etc) are very similar to that of 2K9 (which I still own). But they even fall short in feel to that game in many ways.

I'm hoping they can fix some of these things before release, I'll probably be buying the game anyway for Ultimate Team. 2 years working on the game, and I can't even step in and take a smooth jumper? I'm not impressed.


when you talk about beach ball physics. I hear you but i may need to see some footage of what you're talking about. Especially if you're going back to 2k and then back to live. I know for a fact you can't be too upset about basketball physics when we all know 2k doesnt really have any actual basketball physics. How many of those camel hump shots have we've seen? You know the ones, where you shoot, the ball then starts to come off its arc, then goes back up again mid air. then goes in. or the times when you shoot the ball from the side and you're 8 feet away from the basket. yet the basketball hits the rim bounces super high then goes backwards over the backboard out of bounds. or the layups when the ball is completely inside the rim going down then it miraculously comes out of the rim to fall off for the blown layup. Now just because 2k's basketball physics sucks. doesnt mean live's doesnt suck too. I get that. I just need to see what you're talking about in video form.

On to you switching back and forth to soon. The other poster you responded was actually correct. The problem you're going to have with switching like that is that you will not get use to the controls, and the rhythm of the nba live(new) game. you just wont. because you have years and years and years of 2k under your belt. Whether you love it, like it a little, or hate 2k. if you're like the rest of us you have had no real legit other choice for a long time. so you get use to how it plays, even use to the things you didnt like. Like...the dribbling. Not sure If I've mentioned this on this forum before. But it took me a while to finally realize the difference in dribbling from a nba live game and a 2k game. I couldnt figure out what to call the difference. nba 2k's dribbling is for viewing purposes more so for actually breaking a persons ankles and getting space to score. The badges are their to break ankles and to create space. Those are the things that make sure those animations kick in, even when they shouldnt.

nba 2k's dribbling = Mortal Kombat fighting game combo moves. down, back + X = sub zeros ice hammer. the same type of thing with 2k's dribbling. you plug in the buttons FIRST> then you see the chained moves 2nd. and yes its noticeable thats its not 1 to 1 or even close to one to 1. meaning when you press the buttons you are not doing the moves yet. you are starting the first move and the rest plays out later after the other button pushes have ended then the rest of the sequence kicks in.

Nba live dribbling = close to 1 to 1. two hit someone with a spin move one way then a spin the other. I swing the stick one way, and swing it back the moment i see my foot planting after the first spin. I dont do it before it happens in hopes the animation sequence will kick in like a combo move. This means I can be more exact with my move and based it on instinct once I know how to pull off the dribble moves.

in 2k. i have to think ahead and already have a mix of combo moves I want to do before the defender even plays defense on me. you can do that in real life. but the problem with not playing on instinct and taking what the defense gives you. means if the defender doesnt fall for that original combo. you are toast and you have no way to counter since you have to wait til the sequence is over before you can make the next move.

In your video. I saw you make 2 baseline spin moves that were appropriate. but that was also a one move control. Where you didnt have to chain anything together to get by your opponent. you didnt need to set him up one way to go the other or fake him,etc. you had 2 other nice dribble moves, the shamgod, and one other which was less of a dribble move and more of a layup animation with the euro step.

The other moves you use to get by your opponent were not the best moves in real life to get open to score. you actually ran into traffic on a few of those moves. some you should've spun off the guy the other way. others you should've shook right and gone left. but instead you choose to keep going the way you were going and because Kyrie is quicker than his man defending him. he could get his shoulder slightly passed them anyway.

^^That is a product of you not totally know how to use the dribbling and/or you not knowing how to use the dribbling based on instinct. something 2k can't really do YET.(we dont know about 18). This is why you need to stay playing that live demo then come back with another review. not after a few days. but give it a week. and dont play 2k either. The same way you had to tunnel thru all the 2k crap you dont like just like the rest of us and figure it out to start liking the game even thru its warts. is the exact same thing you have to with this game. if you do that, and you STILL aint feeling it. then so be it.

If you keep going back to 2k, you will keep telling yourself "this aint realistic. I dont like the feel to this live game." when in reality you truly are saying this doesnt feel like the only basketball game i've played for years in 2k so it must not be right. I can't make those exact same moves in live that i can make in 2k. The reason I'm making this suggestion is because you're not the only person I've heard say these things. I have friends who play 2k and played the live demo with the same quick complaints. When in reality you can tell a lot of their issues have more to do with it not playing just like 2k.


With all due respect, I disagree with this as well, and you didn't address my biggest complaints of choppy, robotic animation transitions that destroy the flow and feel of the game. That is apparent even when playing your first minute.

Second, the dribbling video had crossover into spin, into joystick to the baseline for a reverse layup, it had a euro step, it had the spin baseline, it had the in and out. I have done more than that over the last few days, I know how to string combos, there are a lot of dribble moves that can be done, that was just an example. You telling me that I can't tell by a few days, but saying you can, is kind of an an insult to me stating I can't pick it up as fast. Which is completely false, that video was posted after playing it on night one, I have played the demo for well over 10 hours now. I understand the dribbling controls 100%, and I have the same complaints about small dribbles and explosiveness (Which ThaLiveKing agreed on). I owned Live 14, 15 and 16. Just because I don't play it as much, doesn't mean I havn't been following along and playing each game in the series, I have given it plenty of time. I will also be buying Live 18, and will be jumping into Ultimate Team. I'm not sure if you have checked out my 2K videos, but I have a good grasp on the sticks in general, and I have a good feel for basketball and how it should be played.

If you can't see the beach ball physics, the unrealistic clanks off the rim all the time, how the ball doesn't react how it should, I seriously question how much you have played the game. It's really obvious. My two brothers were playing with me yesterday (we were switching off), and they brought it up without me saying anything, and it was brought up right away in the first quarter. 2K has it's issues, TRUST ME, I had a thread that had over 150 comments on it related to all the issues I had with 2K. This isn't being a 2k fanboy, it's being realistic about each games individual issues, and the feel of each game. I absolutely have the ability to go from game to game, in fact, I can go from 2k to Live and be fine dribbling in both. Not everybody has the same skill level with these games, not everybody has to ONLY play one game, or focus on just one game, to get used to it. You are lumping everybody in together with that statement, that's false. 2K had major issues (especially after the patches) with players feeling like they were stuck in mud, slow passes, slow lateral movement, body steals/body blocks, forced animations, charging fouls, tendencies and ratings issues, etc. 2K was far from perfect, but it still flowed better.

Again, I will be buying Live 18, just like the past Lives. But you guys are crazy if you ignore those animation issues, they are glaring and very obvious. EA and Live need that feedback, we should be shouting that from the rooftops (like I did with 2K issues) in order to try and get them addressed. I stand by everything I stated above. To imply that "I will keep telling myself" something, means that I can't distinguish the two games, that I am not mentally capable of separating the two games because I have a biased to 2K, or that I am more used to it so that's the right way. That's not only an insult, that's completely wrong. I could not even touch 2K, and still have the same gripes about Live, the stuff I am mentioning is so obvious even on the first playthrough.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby kingpnp on Tue Aug 15, 2017 3:33 am

Dee4Three wrote:
kingpnp wrote:
Dee4Three wrote:
ThaLiveKing wrote:
Dee4Three wrote:Last night I played a few more hours of the demo, after I played 2K17 for a couple hours, and even went back and played some 2K14 for X1. I have to tell you, I just can't get over the choppy, robotic animations, or lack of response with the controllers. You guys always ask for more specifics, so here are the issues (I may make a video of this, even though its so obvious). Most of the time, you can't even catch and shoot with a guy immediately, he does a strange/slow/robotic gather animation (that sometimes lasts so long that the defender gets there even after being 5-10 ft away). You cant just move into a spot and shoot on the move (like players do all the time in real life), if it's a sideaway, it looks and feels like something from Live 2001, if you are moving into a spot and try to shoot a straight up jumper, the gather animation is so unnatural that the defender easily gets there (100% of the time), and the shot feels slow and unnatural. Same with catches/making passes... a player will catch a pass, and it will take them so long to get the body adjusted (And to transition to the next robotic shooting animation) that the defender easily gets back. Making passes are completely hit or miss, as in if your player isn't already facing the direction of the intended recipient, he will do this long passing animation (sometimes wind-up?) that ruins the flow of the game.

Small dribbles hurt the flow of explosiveness with the good ball handlers (they are good to have in the game, but the game lacks actual explosive moves like the players have in real life). I want to go wide with a cross over, or create actual space with a step back (and actually shoot a smooth shot off of it). Explosive first steps don't exist either.

The post game has improved, but so many flicks at the hoop (high arcing flicks), look really unnatural. The ball also resembles a beach ball going through the air sometimes, and the rim mechanics are way out of whack. I've shot so many soft shots (where the ball is sailing through the air with no spin) only to clank hard off the rim or take strange, hard unnatural bounces.

2 years working on the game, and it bothers me that these things weren't addressed. I know its a demo, but we are a month from release, I doubt these things will be fixed. As Andrew stated above, even the animation speeds in general seem really out of place sometimes, they don't look natural.

Also, I went back and played Live 16 as well, and the players models have also gotten worse, while at the same time, cyberfaces havnt improved (Kyrie looks horrible).

Just a tad frustrated...


It took me two days to get used to the new dribble system, I haven't got used to the post game yet. You can't go back and forth between games, you have to sit there and play through all your mistakes and you'll figure it out. The game is rhythm based so you have to really pay attention to what each person is doing before you counter, that's how in most cases the game will feel organic. Over time, you will get how the game is supposed to be played. There's some player movement issues that I don't like, I'm going to try to make a video about it soon, but I thought overall the game play was fine. I've been telling people since EA PLAY that it's going to be an adjustment, and seeing a lot of responses, you can see that it is.

About the comment in bold, this is one issue I have with the dribbling, you can't really get space, unless you trigger the animation based on the defensive player's position to gain separation. I hope it's addressed once the game is launched at some point.


This is going to be said with all due respect, because I do respect you and like the way you carry yourself.

This has nothing to do with me not being used to the game, I also played it for another 4 hours today. I have a great grasp on the dribbling (which you can see even in my video), I have a great feel for shot releases (timing, etc), I have a feel for the game. Everything you said has nothing to do with the not being able to come to a sudden stop and shoot a smooth jumper, or robotic sideaways or the passing system. No matter how good someone has a feel for the game, it does nothing to combat those glaring game issues. I can know how to get by someone, or do a step back, but when you can't stop on a dime to pull up because the animation transitions are so broken, it means nothing. The glaring animation problems with the game still persist. No matter how used to the game you are, it changes nothing about the beach ball physics, the ball floating softly through the air but clanking off the rim hard like it was a TMAC line drive.

It changes none of that. Again, it's with all due respect that I disagree with you. I respect your work and opinions.

Jumping back and forth between games absolutely is relevant, becuase it's all about feel. It's the same sport, we absolutely compare everything in life. The physics of the game (animation transitions, etc) are very similar to that of 2K9 (which I still own). But they even fall short in feel to that game in many ways.

I'm hoping they can fix some of these things before release, I'll probably be buying the game anyway for Ultimate Team. 2 years working on the game, and I can't even step in and take a smooth jumper? I'm not impressed.


when you talk about beach ball physics. I hear you but i may need to see some footage of what you're talking about. Especially if you're going back to 2k and then back to live. I know for a fact you can't be too upset about basketball physics when we all know 2k doesnt really have any actual basketball physics. How many of those camel hump shots have we've seen? You know the ones, where you shoot, the ball then starts to come off its arc, then goes back up again mid air. then goes in. or the times when you shoot the ball from the side and you're 8 feet away from the basket. yet the basketball hits the rim bounces super high then goes backwards over the backboard out of bounds. or the layups when the ball is completely inside the rim going down then it miraculously comes out of the rim to fall off for the blown layup. Now just because 2k's basketball physics sucks. doesnt mean live's doesnt suck too. I get that. I just need to see what you're talking about in video form.

On to you switching back and forth to soon. The other poster you responded was actually correct. The problem you're going to have with switching like that is that you will not get use to the controls, and the rhythm of the nba live(new) game. you just wont. because you have years and years and years of 2k under your belt. Whether you love it, like it a little, or hate 2k. if you're like the rest of us you have had no real legit other choice for a long time. so you get use to how it plays, even use to the things you didnt like. Like...the dribbling. Not sure If I've mentioned this on this forum before. But it took me a while to finally realize the difference in dribbling from a nba live game and a 2k game. I couldnt figure out what to call the difference. nba 2k's dribbling is for viewing purposes more so for actually breaking a persons ankles and getting space to score. The badges are their to break ankles and to create space. Those are the things that make sure those animations kick in, even when they shouldnt.

nba 2k's dribbling = Mortal Kombat fighting game combo moves. down, back + X = sub zeros ice hammer. the same type of thing with 2k's dribbling. you plug in the buttons FIRST> then you see the chained moves 2nd. and yes its noticeable thats its not 1 to 1 or even close to one to 1. meaning when you press the buttons you are not doing the moves yet. you are starting the first move and the rest plays out later after the other button pushes have ended then the rest of the sequence kicks in.

Nba live dribbling = close to 1 to 1. two hit someone with a spin move one way then a spin the other. I swing the stick one way, and swing it back the moment i see my foot planting after the first spin. I dont do it before it happens in hopes the animation sequence will kick in like a combo move. This means I can be more exact with my move and based it on instinct once I know how to pull off the dribble moves.

in 2k. i have to think ahead and already have a mix of combo moves I want to do before the defender even plays defense on me. you can do that in real life. but the problem with not playing on instinct and taking what the defense gives you. means if the defender doesnt fall for that original combo. you are toast and you have no way to counter since you have to wait til the sequence is over before you can make the next move.

In your video. I saw you make 2 baseline spin moves that were appropriate. but that was also a one move control. Where you didnt have to chain anything together to get by your opponent. you didnt need to set him up one way to go the other or fake him,etc. you had 2 other nice dribble moves, the shamgod, and one other which was less of a dribble move and more of a layup animation with the euro step.

The other moves you use to get by your opponent were not the best moves in real life to get open to score. you actually ran into traffic on a few of those moves. some you should've spun off the guy the other way. others you should've shook right and gone left. but instead you choose to keep going the way you were going and because Kyrie is quicker than his man defending him. he could get his shoulder slightly passed them anyway.

^^That is a product of you not totally know how to use the dribbling and/or you not knowing how to use the dribbling based on instinct. something 2k can't really do YET.(we dont know about 18). This is why you need to stay playing that live demo then come back with another review. not after a few days. but give it a week. and dont play 2k either. The same way you had to tunnel thru all the 2k crap you dont like just like the rest of us and figure it out to start liking the game even thru its warts. is the exact same thing you have to with this game. if you do that, and you STILL aint feeling it. then so be it.

If you keep going back to 2k, you will keep telling yourself "this aint realistic. I dont like the feel to this live game." when in reality you truly are saying this doesnt feel like the only basketball game i've played for years in 2k so it must not be right. I can't make those exact same moves in live that i can make in 2k. The reason I'm making this suggestion is because you're not the only person I've heard say these things. I have friends who play 2k and played the live demo with the same quick complaints. When in reality you can tell a lot of their issues have more to do with it not playing just like 2k.


With all due respect, I disagree with this as well, and you didn't address my biggest complaints of choppy, robotic animation transitions that destroy the flow and feel of the game. That is apparent even when playing your first minute.

Second, the dribbling video had crossover into spin, into joystick to the baseline for a reverse layup, it had a euro step, it had the spin baseline, it had the in and out. I have done more than that over the last few days, I know how to string combos, there are a lot of dribble moves that can be done, that was just an example. You telling me that I can't tell by a few days, but saying you can, is kind of an an insult to me stating I can't pick it up as fast. Which is completely false, that video was posted after playing it on night one, I have played the demo for well over 10 hours now. I understand the dribbling controls 100%, and I have the same complaints about small dribbles and explosiveness (Which ThaLiveKing agreed on). I owned Live 14, 15 and 16. Just because I don't play it as much, doesn't mean I havn't been following along and playing each game in the series, I have given it plenty of time. I will also be buying Live 18, and will be jumping into Ultimate Team. I'm not sure if you have checked out my 2K videos, but I have a good grasp on the sticks in general, and I have a good feel for basketball and how it should be played.

If you can't see the beach ball physics, the unrealistic clanks off the rim all the time, how the ball doesn't react how it should, I seriously question how much you have played the game. It's really obvious. My two brothers were playing with me yesterday (we were switching off), and they brought it up without me saying anything, and it was brought up right away in the first quarter. 2K has it's issues, TRUST ME, I had a thread that had over 150 comments on it related to all the issues I had with 2K. This isn't being a 2k fanboy, it's being realistic about each games individual issues, and the feel of each game. I absolutely have the ability to go from game to game, in fact, I can go from 2k to Live and be fine dribbling in both. Not everybody has the same skill level with these games, not everybody has to ONLY play one game, or focus on just one game, to get used to it. You are lumping everybody in together with that statement, that's false. 2K had major issues (especially after the patches) with players feeling like they were stuck in mud, slow passes, slow lateral movement, body steals/body blocks, forced animations, charging fouls, tendencies and ratings issues, etc. 2K was far from perfect, but it still flowed better.

Again, I will be buying Live 18, just like the past Lives. But you guys are crazy if you ignore those animation issues, they are glaring and very obvious. EA and Live need that feedback, we should be shouting that from the rooftops (like I did with 2K issues) in order to try and get them addressed. I stand by everything I stated above. To imply that "I will keep telling myself" something, means that I can't distinguish the two games, that I am not mentally capable of separating the two games because I have a biased to 2K, or that I am more used to it so that's the right way. That's not only an insult, that's completely wrong. I could not even touch 2K, and still have the same gripes about Live, the stuff I am mentioning is so obvious even on the first playthrough.


ok lets address it.
phpBB [video]



and this
phpBB [video]



Do you have a problem with what you see above? and if so what do you have a problem with? be specific to these two vids please.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Dee4Three on Tue Aug 15, 2017 3:44 am

Absolutely.

First off, you are choosing one step back animation. Second off, you are chopping it up yourself (slow and fast, etc). Show me a video of a smooth step in for a jump shot, or a fastbreak stop on a dime shot, or a running sideways into a pullup. Stepping in for a smooth J is a basic basketball move, super basic. Going on the fastbreak instead and pulling up 10-15 ft before the hoop instead of taking it into the hoop is an essential, basic part of basketball. Have you gone up the court to pull up for a 3 on the break with Curry or Irving? Lets grab that animation, that will show the movements I am talking about.

Why don't you show a free throw, where the ball is shot softly through the air, but hits the rim like a line drive. Or lets show that on many different shots.

You are literally showing me a close up of a step back with slow/fast speed transitions.

You can't say "well this stepback looks good", without commenting on pure basketball basics that look and feel horrible.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby kingpnp on Tue Aug 15, 2017 3:44 am

Now THIS video shows that NBA has work to do. They need to fix this A S A P or else it will turn into a bunch of kids playing with 7 footers doing the double cross. we already have seen these exploit abuses in 2k in years past.

[youtube] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THf2hOaSDiQ [youtube/]
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby kingpnp on Tue Aug 15, 2017 3:52 am

Dee4Three wrote:Absolutely.

First off, you are choosing one step back animation. Second off, you are chopping it up yourself (slow and fast, etc). Show me a video of a smooth step in for a jump shot, or a fastbreak stop on a dime shot, or a running sideways into a pullup. Stepping in for a smooth J is a basic basketball move, super basic. Going on the fastbreak instead and pulling up 10-15 ft before the hoop instead of taking it into the hoop is an essential, basic part of basketball. Have you gone up the court to pull up for a 3 on the break with Curry or Irving? Lets grab that animation, that will show the movements I am talking about.

Why don't you show a free throw, where the ball is shot softly through the air, but hits the rim like a line drive. Or lets show that on many different shots.

You are literally showing me a close up of a step back with slow/fast speed transitions.

You can't say "well this stepback looks good", without commenting on pure basketball basics that look and feel horrible.

That wasnt my video. The youtuber made those two videos himself. and both are not stepbacks. he's showing it in slow motion to show you the detail that a lot of 2kers are saying live lacks when its actually the opposite.

Try this one and tell me specifically what you dont like about the game

phpBB [video]
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Dee4Three on Tue Aug 15, 2017 4:49 am

Ill use this video (great video btw, ThaLiveKing).

Kevin Love animation when he catches the ball (Play starts a 1:55). He goes from a stand still to momentum into a reverse layup (It looks really, really unnatural). Also note, these issues happen in 2K sometimes as well.

Kyrie Irving does a euro and finishes an impossible shot looking away from the hoop at 5:15. These, and the 360 layups with contact, and reverse/swinging layups happen whether we like it or not going to the hoop, they are once or twice in a season plays, and you see these multiple times a game in Live.

Klay Thompson (This isn't even moving into the hoop) at 7:07 with the robotic pullup from his side (showing the animations I have an issue with, that are completely unnatural)

Steph Curry at 7:30 with the ridiculous travel, and awkward/robotic transition into a mid range jumper (This is one of the only mid range jumpers on the move on this whole video, everything is basically a stand still 3, stand still mid range, or drive).

Kevin Love to Kyrie Irving at 8:10. Watch the players feet and the animations, they look (and feel, because Ive played it) horrible and unnatural.

Steph Curry at 9:25, when he pump fakes before shooting. If that first shot had gone up (Which players take all the time), it would have been a horrible animation. it had to be stopped in order to not completely butcher that transition.

Steph Curry 3 at 9:44. Look at his feet when hes transitioning in the next animation. Looks and feels unnatural. That's with him barely moving at all to his left.

Steph Curry at 10:40 with the super basic pullup, look at the transition in animations. It's slow, sloppy, unnatural. It looks silly. He looks like he goes through another transition mid pullup and his backkind of twitches, this is how it looks in Live when you are taking shots while trying to move into them. The straight up shots don't even look natural.

Kevin Love three at 12:25. Watch the bounce off the rim, shot goes up soft, and watch the ball when it goes to Nick Young. It's a rocket.

Kevin Love to Kyrie at 12:35. Watch how many animation transitions (bad ones, robotic ones) Kevin Love has to go through to make this pass to Kyrie.

Steph Curry 3 at 13:35. Watch how bad the step back looks, look at how unnatural that looks. It feels just as bad. His body doesn't look in any way realistic, it goes through like 3 animations before release.

Steph Curry free throw animation at 15:42. He has to go through multiple transitions to release the shot, it looks like NBA in the Zone 2. It feels that way as well.


phpBB [video]



ThaLiveKing put out a great video, and he highlighted some good aspects to the game as well, so I want to thank him for that. But to ignore or not acknowledge glaring issues with the animations is not helpful at all. I already stated the things I DO like about this game, and what I believe has been improved on. But, the skating, animation transitions, robotic feel keep it from being taken truly seriously. Theres a reason why a ton of people are screaming at EA in the comment sections after the release of Live. Like...

"I was optimistic for this year but god this looks awful. They should just give it up& make another fight night& skate 4"

"God this looks like a PS2 game, borderline PS3 to me."

"EA should drop the live franchise for good and revive MVP Baseball"

"Everything else about this game is amazing but those damn those animations are god awful, and the players still look like stick figures."

"Damn cant wait to turn on my ps1 and play this game :O #preorderingnow"

"Honestly I'm a 2k fanboy, the graphics here are amazing but god those animations are horrible the commentary is just flat"

"Seems like everything about this game is respectable BUT the gameplay ITSELF"

"nba live and 2K should work together..i like the atmosphere of live but bad animations.. 2K looks good but wack gameplay .. can't play real defense and they cater to dunk animations too much"

"Good presentation, trash gameplay."

Etc.

2K has its fair share of issues. I am talking about the gameplay in Live as a whole, it doesn't feel right. It feels choppy, and unfinished. The animations are stiff, like the shoulders/head are stiff compared to the rest of the bodies. I expected more after 2 years. I honestly want Live to be a great product, I was playing back when we had a ton of choices (I used to own the Lives, NBA in the Zones, NBA Shootouts, NBA Inside Drives, NBA 2K's, etc). I just want the feel of the game to be right, and fun. I want it to compete.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby kingpnp on Tue Aug 15, 2017 6:01 am

Hey Livers,,, Did you guys get that Nba Live 18 Demo UPDATE Today 08/14/2017???

Does anyone know what's in the update?
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby kingpnp on Tue Aug 15, 2017 7:21 am

Dee4Three wrote:Ill use this video (great video btw, ThaLiveKing).

Kevin Love animation when he catches the ball (Play starts a 1:55). He goes from a stand still to momentum into a reverse layup (It looks really, really unnatural). Also note, these issues happen in 2K sometimes as well.

Kyrie Irving does a euro and finishes an impossible shot looking away from the hoop at 5:15. These, and the 360 layups with contact, and reverse/swinging layups happen whether we like it or not going to the hoop, they are once or twice in a season plays, and you see these multiple times a game in Live.

Klay Thompson (This isn't even moving into the hoop) at 7:07 with the robotic pullup from his side (showing the animations I have an issue with, that are completely unnatural)

Steph Curry at 7:30 with the ridiculous travel, and awkward/robotic transition into a mid range jumper (This is one of the only mid range jumpers on the move on this whole video, everything is basically a stand still 3, stand still mid range, or drive).

Kevin Love to Kyrie Irving at 8:10. Watch the players feet and the animations, they look (and feel, because Ive played it) horrible and unnatural.

Steph Curry at 9:25, when he pump fakes before shooting. If that first shot had gone up (Which players take all the time), it would have been a horrible animation. it had to be stopped in order to not completely butcher that transition.

Steph Curry 3 at 9:44. Look at his feet when hes transitioning in the next animation. Looks and feels unnatural. That's with him barely moving at all to his left.

Steph Curry at 10:40 with the super basic pullup, look at the transition in animations. It's slow, sloppy, unnatural. It looks silly. He looks like he goes through another transition mid pullup and his backkind of twitches, this is how it looks in Live when you are taking shots while trying to move into them. The straight up shots don't even look natural.

Kevin Love three at 12:25. Watch the bounce off the rim, shot goes up soft, and watch the ball when it goes to Nick Young. It's a rocket.

Kevin Love to Kyrie at 12:35. Watch how many animation transitions (bad ones, robotic ones) Kevin Love has to go through to make this pass to Kyrie.

Steph Curry 3 at 13:35. Watch how bad the step back looks, look at how unnatural that looks. It feels just as bad. His body doesn't look in any way realistic, it goes through like 3 animations before release.

Steph Curry free throw animation at 15:42. He has to go through multiple transitions to release the shot, it looks like NBA in the Zone 2. It feels that way as well.


phpBB [video]



ThaLiveKing put out a great video, and he highlighted some good aspects to the game as well, so I want to thank him for that. But to ignore or not acknowledge glaring issues with the animations is not helpful at all. I already stated the things I DO like about this game, and what I believe has been improved on. But, the skating, animation transitions, robotic feel keep it from being taken truly seriously. Theres a reason why a ton of people are screaming at EA in the comment sections after the release of Live. Like...

"I was optimistic for this year but god this looks awful. They should just give it up& make another fight night& skate 4"

"God this looks like a PS2 game, borderline PS3 to me."

"EA should drop the live franchise for good and revive MVP Baseball"

"Everything else about this game is amazing but those damn those animations are god awful, and the players still look like stick figures."

"Damn cant wait to turn on my ps1 and play this game :O #preorderingnow"

"Honestly I'm a 2k fanboy, the graphics here are amazing but god those animations are horrible the commentary is just flat"

"Seems like everything about this game is respectable BUT the gameplay ITSELF"

"nba live and 2K should work together..i like the atmosphere of live but bad animations.. 2K looks good but wack gameplay .. can't play real defense and they cater to dunk animations too much"

"Good presentation, trash gameplay."

Etc.

2K has its fair share of issues. I am talking about the gameplay in Live as a whole, it doesn't feel right. It feels choppy, and unfinished. The animations are stiff, like the shoulders/head are stiff compared to the rest of the bodies. I expected more after 2 years. I honestly want Live to be a great product, I was playing back when we had a ton of choices (I used to own the Lives, NBA in the Zones, NBA Shootouts, NBA Inside Drives, NBA 2K's, etc). I just want the feel of the game to be right, and fun. I want it to compete.


K-love at 1:55 - lets address what you said. 2k has that issue where you could be at a standstill with no momentum going in a particular direction then your man after hitting the shoot button or analog for a shot. your guy will go into a predetermined animation to drive to the basket. Happened to me the other day while playing 2k. So here you’re saying its happening in this game. let’s take a look.

Kevin love caught the ball passed to him over the top. in the catching motion he actually shifts his feet.. then takes a step or could be two choppy steps. so in this situation he wasn’t standing as still as even I first thought on first glance. I’m too lazy to pull out the video editing tools. watch It in slo mo if you must. watch his feet shuffle. then he goes with the reverse. nba guys do this. I call it travelling at times, the nba calls it a good move. Remember he only made the extra reverse due to a help defender coming over at the last moment for a swat. very realistic.

Kyrie euro reverse back turned layup…5:15. I agree with you on this one…if it was someone not named kyrie..mr I make crazy layups all night every night. do you think kyrie could make that same shot in a nba game in real life? I do. so is it that unrealistic if you’ve seen it on live?

and just in case you don’t recall how crazy kyrie’s layups are..lets take a look
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ohc0OPWSI5Q

you can also let it role into the the 2nd compilation of more kyrie crazy ridiculous layups. The guy is probably the best layup maker in the nba right now. I’m not the only one who believes this. two commentators say the same during the first video. another one brings up the fact that he’s #2 only to john wall when inside the paint as far as making layups. and we know Jwall gets a lot of his from blowing by people on a break. kyrie is doing this magical stuff in traffic. so this nba live layup is more realistic than one might think coming from that man.


Klay Thompson 7:07…that’s not unrealistic movement. Klay was bumped while shooting(should’ve been a foul). But lets remember klay has somewhat a robotic style of movement in real life. we’re not talking about curry. klay has less of that movement.


Steph Curry at 7:30 Hop but not putting the ball down is an official glitch. it happens in 2k as well. some people know how to make it do it over and over. but as far as him shooting a bad looking mid range jumper. is that the computer or the user? if it’s the user, that’s the fault of the user. if it’s the cpu they need to do some tuning. But most of us are no longer playing just vs cpu players. So that will most likely be a real person when the game drops. if the real person does that bad move and runs into traffic even if he couldn’t do that illegal hop move. The shot was a bad shot and the move was a bad move to make when you look at where the defense was already setup.


Kevin Love to Kyrie Irving at 8:10. Watch the players feet and the animations, they look (and feel, because Ive played it) horrible and unnatural.

Kevin love moves kind of stiff like that in real life lets be honest. Kyrie’s issue on this is that he’s slides back before going up into a jumper animation. that’s an issue. You would like for him to rise straight up since no defender is around. But while he’s in the catching motion he is initially fading backward some. Now we know 2k pulls out the animation where it could make the cpu player do a full on step back for no good reason at all(no one is on him) for a three point shot.



Steph Curry at 9:25, again that’s just bad basketball. that’s not bad animations. he never should’ve done that move since he never created enough spacing between him and the defender to properly take that shot. but he pump faked it then went up. that had nothing to do with trying to stop from butchering an animation. he stopped and faked because that’s either what the user or cpu decided to do.

Steph Curry 3 at 9:44. you don’t like the gather animation. which I agree with.

Steph Curry at 10:40, yes I agree the floating of the player not smooth floating due to serious momentum. yes that needs to be corrected. but again because the player is taking horrible shots it looks even worse since he’s being bumped.

Kevin Love three at 12:25. I agree with this. starts off slow then ricochets off the rim with crazy speed. this tells me they need to speed up the ball after a player has released it on a jumper. so It can match that ricochet. or obviously slow the ricochet down a little bit. again I still take this animation over 2ks over exaggerated ball bouncing and go clear over the backboard when you’ve shot a jumper where the missed shots angle would never bounce that high up and backwards. So both games are flawed in this category.

Kevin Love to Kyrie at 12:35, this is actually again the catch gather animation. looks better than above cause at least he was moving before the catch to give him more momentum


Steph Curry free throw animation at 15:42. I agree old live legacy issue with the animations not being smooth because they skip a step when going thru the knees bent portion til the shot is being released. is as if there are 30 frames to shoot a free throw and live only has 22 of them. the first frame, the last frame and a lot of frames in between. but since they are missing some of all the animations it looks choppy. 2k does a great job at the ft line with their animations.


Now i have a question for you or anyone else who feels those issues with animations in the nba live 2018 demo are so bad you wont pay for it?
if you say yes they are. Then I have another question.

If i told you right now you have two choices.
1. have a basketball game with a lot of nice animations but still a lot of weird unnatural stuff happening because the action is being preordained/or not controlled by the user. its controlled by 2 player canned animations or scenes that have to play out a certain way.

or
2. you have a basketball game with some nice animations and a lot of unnatural animations that make it seem like the animation guys didnt finish the job. but you have total control over your player on offense or defense. you are never STUCK in a 2 player canned animation.

you can only choose 1. which would you choose?

And it took me years to realize why it is this way. NBA 2k is over produced. It's an over produced reality show. But its the only reality show out since live was so behind they couldnt even get on TV.

NOw that it looks like live can get on the big screen. They are a nice netflix series but you can tell the camera work was a bit low budget or done by kids fresh out of film school.

from first glance the 1st option looks better on video most times. the first option looks great when you're watching someone else play. The 2nd option feels better when you're actually playing it. but can your eyes bare the lack of camera work(animations)? we shall see
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Dee4Three on Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:25 am

kingpnp wrote:
Dee4Three wrote:Ill use this video (great video btw, ThaLiveKing).

Kevin Love animation when he catches the ball (Play starts a 1:55). He goes from a stand still to momentum into a reverse layup (It looks really, really unnatural). Also note, these issues happen in 2K sometimes as well.

Kyrie Irving does a euro and finishes an impossible shot looking away from the hoop at 5:15. These, and the 360 layups with contact, and reverse/swinging layups happen whether we like it or not going to the hoop, they are once or twice in a season plays, and you see these multiple times a game in Live.

Klay Thompson (This isn't even moving into the hoop) at 7:07 with the robotic pullup from his side (showing the animations I have an issue with, that are completely unnatural)

Steph Curry at 7:30 with the ridiculous travel, and awkward/robotic transition into a mid range jumper (This is one of the only mid range jumpers on the move on this whole video, everything is basically a stand still 3, stand still mid range, or drive).

Kevin Love to Kyrie Irving at 8:10. Watch the players feet and the animations, they look (and feel, because Ive played it) horrible and unnatural.

Steph Curry at 9:25, when he pump fakes before shooting. If that first shot had gone up (Which players take all the time), it would have been a horrible animation. it had to be stopped in order to not completely butcher that transition.

Steph Curry 3 at 9:44. Look at his feet when hes transitioning in the next animation. Looks and feels unnatural. That's with him barely moving at all to his left.

Steph Curry at 10:40 with the super basic pullup, look at the transition in animations. It's slow, sloppy, unnatural. It looks silly. He looks like he goes through another transition mid pullup and his backkind of twitches, this is how it looks in Live when you are taking shots while trying to move into them. The straight up shots don't even look natural.

Kevin Love three at 12:25. Watch the bounce off the rim, shot goes up soft, and watch the ball when it goes to Nick Young. It's a rocket.

Kevin Love to Kyrie at 12:35. Watch how many animation transitions (bad ones, robotic ones) Kevin Love has to go through to make this pass to Kyrie.

Steph Curry 3 at 13:35. Watch how bad the step back looks, look at how unnatural that looks. It feels just as bad. His body doesn't look in any way realistic, it goes through like 3 animations before release.

Steph Curry free throw animation at 15:42. He has to go through multiple transitions to release the shot, it looks like NBA in the Zone 2. It feels that way as well.


phpBB [video]



ThaLiveKing put out a great video, and he highlighted some good aspects to the game as well, so I want to thank him for that. But to ignore or not acknowledge glaring issues with the animations is not helpful at all. I already stated the things I DO like about this game, and what I believe has been improved on. But, the skating, animation transitions, robotic feel keep it from being taken truly seriously. Theres a reason why a ton of people are screaming at EA in the comment sections after the release of Live. Like...

"I was optimistic for this year but god this looks awful. They should just give it up& make another fight night& skate 4"

"God this looks like a PS2 game, borderline PS3 to me."

"EA should drop the live franchise for good and revive MVP Baseball"

"Everything else about this game is amazing but those damn those animations are god awful, and the players still look like stick figures."

"Damn cant wait to turn on my ps1 and play this game :O #preorderingnow"

"Honestly I'm a 2k fanboy, the graphics here are amazing but god those animations are horrible the commentary is just flat"

"Seems like everything about this game is respectable BUT the gameplay ITSELF"

"nba live and 2K should work together..i like the atmosphere of live but bad animations.. 2K looks good but wack gameplay .. can't play real defense and they cater to dunk animations too much"

"Good presentation, trash gameplay."

Etc.

2K has its fair share of issues. I am talking about the gameplay in Live as a whole, it doesn't feel right. It feels choppy, and unfinished. The animations are stiff, like the shoulders/head are stiff compared to the rest of the bodies. I expected more after 2 years. I honestly want Live to be a great product, I was playing back when we had a ton of choices (I used to own the Lives, NBA in the Zones, NBA Shootouts, NBA Inside Drives, NBA 2K's, etc). I just want the feel of the game to be right, and fun. I want it to compete.


K-love at 1:55 - lets address what you said. 2k has that issue where you could be at a standstill with no momentum going in a particular direction then your man after hitting the shoot button or analog for a shot. your guy will go into a predetermined animation to drive to the basket. Happened to me the other day while playing 2k. So here you’re saying its happening in this game. let’s take a look.

Kevin love caught the ball passed to him over the top. in the catching motion he actually shifts his feet.. then takes a step or could be two choppy steps. so in this situation he wasn’t standing as still as even I first thought on first glance. I’m too lazy to pull out the video editing tools. watch It in slo mo if you must. watch his feet shuffle. then he goes with the reverse. nba guys do this. I call it travelling at times, the nba calls it a good move. Remember he only made the extra reverse due to a help defender coming over at the last moment for a swat. very realistic.

Kyrie euro reverse back turned layup…5:15. I agree with you on this one…if it was someone not named kyrie..mr I make crazy layups all night every night. do you think kyrie could make that same shot in a nba game in real life? I do. so is it that unrealistic if you’ve seen it on live?

and just in case you don’t recall how crazy kyrie’s layups are..lets take a look
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ohc0OPWSI5Q

you can also let it role into the the 2nd compilation of more kyrie crazy ridiculous layups. The guy is probably the best layup maker in the nba right now. I’m not the only one who believes this. two commentators say the same during the first video. another one brings up the fact that he’s #2 only to john wall when inside the paint as far as making layups. and we know Jwall gets a lot of his from blowing by people on a break. kyrie is doing this magical stuff in traffic. so this nba live layup is more realistic than one might think coming from that man.


Klay Thompson 7:07…that’s not unrealistic movement. Klay was bumped while shooting(should’ve been a foul). But lets remember klay has somewhat a robotic style of movement in real life. we’re not talking about curry. klay has less of that movement.


Steph Curry at 7:30 Hop but not putting the ball down is an official glitch. it happens in 2k as well. some people know how to make it do it over and over. but as far as him shooting a bad looking mid range jumper. is that the computer or the user? if it’s the user, that’s the fault of the user. if it’s the cpu they need to do some tuning. But most of us are no longer playing just vs cpu players. So that will most likely be a real person when the game drops. if the real person does that bad move and runs into traffic even if he couldn’t do that illegal hop move. The shot was a bad shot and the move was a bad move to make when you look at where the defense was already setup.


Kevin Love to Kyrie Irving at 8:10. Watch the players feet and the animations, they look (and feel, because Ive played it) horrible and unnatural.

Kevin love moves kind of stiff like that in real life lets be honest. Kyrie’s issue on this is that he’s slides back before going up into a jumper animation. that’s an issue. You would like for him to rise straight up since no defender is around. But while he’s in the catching motion he is initially fading backward some. Now we know 2k pulls out the animation where it could make the cpu player do a full on step back for no good reason at all(no one is on him) for a three point shot.



Steph Curry at 9:25, again that’s just bad basketball. that’s not bad animations. he never should’ve done that move since he never created enough spacing between him and the defender to properly take that shot. but he pump faked it then went up. that had nothing to do with trying to stop from butchering an animation. he stopped and faked because that’s either what the user or cpu decided to do.

Steph Curry 3 at 9:44. you don’t like the gather animation. which I agree with.

Steph Curry at 10:40, yes I agree the floating of the player not smooth floating due to serious momentum. yes that needs to be corrected. but again because the player is taking horrible shots it looks even worse since he’s being bumped.

Kevin Love three at 12:25. I agree with this. starts off slow then ricochets off the rim with crazy speed. this tells me they need to speed up the ball after a player has released it on a jumper. so It can match that ricochet. or obviously slow the ricochet down a little bit. again I still take this animation over 2ks over exaggerated ball bouncing and go clear over the backboard when you’ve shot a jumper where the missed shots angle would never bounce that high up and backwards. So both games are flawed in this category.

Kevin Love to Kyrie at 12:35, this is actually again the catch gather animation. looks better than above cause at least he was moving before the catch to give him more momentum


Steph Curry free throw animation at 15:42. I agree old live legacy issue with the animations not being smooth because they skip a step when going thru the knees bent portion til the shot is being released. is as if there are 30 frames to shoot a free throw and live only has 22 of them. the first frame, the last frame and a lot of frames in between. but since they are missing some of all the animations it looks choppy. 2k does a great job at the ft line with their animations.


Now i have a question for you or anyone else who feels those issues with animations in the nba live 2018 demo are so bad you wont pay for it?
if you say yes they are. Then I have another question.

If i told you right now you have two choices.
1. have a basketball game with a lot of nice animations but still a lot of weird unnatural stuff happening because the action is being preordained/or not controlled by the user. its controlled by 2 player canned animations or scenes that have to play out a certain way.

or
2. you have a basketball game with some nice animations and a lot of unnatural animations that make it seem like the animation guys didnt finish the job. but you have total control over your player on offense or defense. you are never STUCK in a 2 player canned animation.

you can only choose 1. which would you choose?

And it took me years to realize why it is this way. NBA 2k is over produced. It's an over produced reality show. But its the only reality show out since live was so behind they couldnt even get on TV.

NOw that it looks like live can get on the big screen. They are a nice netflix series but you can tell the camera work was a bit low budget or done by kids fresh out of film school.

from first glance the 1st option looks better on video most times. the first option looks great when you're watching someone else play. The 2nd option feels better when you're actually playing it. but can your eyes bare the lack of camera work(animations)? we shall see


I appreciate the long reply and the thought that went into it. This is the type of feedback the video game companies need, detailed like this.

So in the end, you agree with the animation issues in the game (most of them, we disagree on a couple things). Like the quoted items up top, there are thousands upon thousands of consumers who have the same gripes about the animations, about how they feel and look, about how they impact the game. This is a huge problem with Live, and it's what prevents me from even putting it in the same realm as 2K.

With the choices you give, they are not accurate. Live has plenty of forced animations, both games do. You think those drives to the hoop where your offensive player does some crazy types of finishes are not forced animations? They absolutely are. I feel like I have less control in Live than I do in 2k. But here is how I will answer that question.

I am buying the game anyway, I've stated that multiple times. In fact, I'm preordering Live and 2k right now. However, Live doesn't have what I look for normally in a basketball game (sports game in general). I play multiple user franchises, Live hasn't had that in years (and I havn't heard if it will be in 18, guessing not). This is a very basic feature that a sports game should have, and it hasnt existed in years. I also like to edit rosters (current or classic), that ability was also removed in Live, which should be a feature in any sports game. I like retro to be able to use in exhibition or franchise, Live doesnt have that and hasnt for a very long time. It doesn't have the gameplay I seek for the reasons I stated above.

I'm buying it because I am a die hard basketball fan and basketball video gamer, and I will play the Ultimate Team mode.

Live can't make excuses anymore about sales, or go "why me" when they keep coming out with games that don't have those super basic modes/features above, to go along with animations that are out of whack. You want to get more people to buy the game? You allow them to edit rosters, make rosters, distribute rosters on share, you give them multiple mode options, even the most basic ones. That's how you help up the sales and gain interest. You acknowledge the animation issues, you fix them. New engine? We are on the 4th/5th year, and it's still choppy/unfinished?

Those are my issues with Live. They are making a sale off of me, because even though I don't particularly like the gameplay, I buy every year anyway. That can't be said for the majority of the population who plays these games.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Andrew on Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:48 am

kingpnp wrote:Hey Livers,,, Did you guys get that Nba Live 18 Demo UPDATE Today 08/14/2017???

Does anyone know what's in the update?


No patch notes as yet. Checked the update history on PS4, and it was just the generic "minor bug fixes" note.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby matmat66 on Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:48 am

Agree with you on this one Dee. You echoed my sentiments on Live 18 based on the demo. As of now, 2k is more fluid for me. And like you, I will also buy the NBA Live even if it lacks the essential basic features of being able to edit teams and players, use classic teams/players, assign them to current teams, etc., just to have an alternative basketball game that I can play when I get 2k fatigue. I really wish we can have 2 great basketball games and hoping for improvement in the Live series.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Dez on Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:56 pm

I basically pre-ordered because it wasn't the usual full price for new games on the Australian PSN, wouldn't have done so if it was full price.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby [Q] on Wed Aug 16, 2017 1:22 am

matmat66 wrote:Agree with you on this one Dee. You echoed my sentiments on Live 18 based on the demo. As of now, 2k is more fluid for me.

You guys are acting as if Live has had this long history of long, smooth animations... smoother than 2k
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Dee4Three on Wed Aug 16, 2017 1:29 am

[Q] wrote:
matmat66 wrote:Agree with you on this one Dee. You echoed my sentiments on Live 18 based on the demo. As of now, 2k is more fluid for me.

You guys are acting as if Live has had this long history of long, smooth animations... smoother than 2k


That has nothing to do with it. It's stating that it's one of the biggest (if not the biggest) reason people won't switch over. Just because it's a known issue, doesn't make it any less of an issue. If you are competing in the same market, the same genre, and calling yourself a simulation, you will and deserve to be critiqued on the gameplay issues/mode issues (or lack of modes).

Even with the modes they have and as they are, far more people would make the switch or at least buy both games if the gameplay was smooth and the animations weren't broken. For example, it's 2017 and we can't up fake and step in for a smooth jump shot without it looking and feeling completely wrong?.

If it's not working, fix it. I don't want to hear that in 2017 they can't get smooth transitions, especially with technology the way it is now.

Nobody is acting like it's a new thing, we are merely contesting the issues that we have had for YEARS with Live. Issues that stop the game from being good or elite. It's what stops it from making sales or competing.

For example, if someone is an asshole in 2012, and they are still an asshole in 2017, you won't want anything to do with that asshole in 2017. You will avoid that asshole, because that asshole is still well... that asshole. So you can say "you act like he hasn't always been an asshole" all you want. But you still won't associate with him or hangout with him. This is why we can't use that as an excuse. You can say "if he would just change, people would like him more", and you can try to talk to him and give him constructive critiscm, you can be patient with him, even sympathise with him. But if he doesn't adapt or change, and hes still an asshole... well... not many people will support him.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby kingpnp on Wed Aug 16, 2017 3:25 am

Dee4Three wrote:
[Q] wrote:
matmat66 wrote:Agree with you on this one Dee. You echoed my sentiments on Live 18 based on the demo. As of now, 2k is more fluid for me.

You guys are acting as if Live has had this long history of long, smooth animations... smoother than 2k


That has nothing to do with it. It's stating that it's one of the biggest (if not the biggest) reason people won't switch over. Just because it's a known issue, doesn't make it any less of an issue. If you are competing in the same market, the same genre, and calling yourself a simulation, you will and deserve to be critiqued on the gameplay issues/mode issues (or lack of modes).

Even with the modes they have and as they are, far more people would make the switch or at least buy both games if the gameplay was smooth and the animations weren't broken. For example, it's 2017 and we can't up fake and step in for a smooth jump shot without it looking and feeling completely wrong?.

If it's not working, fix it. I don't want to hear that in 2017 they can't get smooth transitions, especially with technology the way it is now.

Nobody is acting like it's a new thing, we are merely contesting the issues that we have had for YEARS with Live. Issues that stop the game from being good or elite. It's what stops it from making sales or competing.

For example, if someone is an asshole in 2012, and they are still an asshole in 2017, you won't want anything to do with that asshole in 2017. You will avoid that asshole, because that asshole is still well... that asshole. So you can say "you act like he hasn't always been an asshole" all you want. But you still won't associate with him or hangout with him. This is why we can't use that as an excuse. You can say "if he would just change, people would like him more", and you can try to talk to him and give him constructive critiscm, you can be patient with him, even sympathise with him. But if he doesn't adapt or change, and hes still an asshole... well... not many people will support him.


all true and well said. funny thing is, 2k is also an A-hole. Same ole server issues like 8 or 9 years in a row. there's zero excuse. you are no longer a small team/small company just trying to squeeze into the genre. and since you've been thee #1 and only game people purchase for the most part... we know how many copies you sell. we know how much money you make. You have no excuse for the bad servers in 2017. NON. You also have no excuse to keep pulling me into animation after animation while telling me every year "there are no 2 player canned animations... you can break out of these animations THIS YEAR." stop it. you're lying. Just admit you like to over produce your games outcomes in order to make it LOOK visually more appealing. This keeps sells up and keeps you ahead of the competition.

This is why I'm always looking for some other team to come along and make that basketball game I've been waiting for because 2k aint it, and as of today neither is live to be honest. both games have made progress. and both games have their moments when you think "wait this my be the one." Nope. she aint the one, you were excited because she looked cute in a dark club on a dark night when you were liquored up. Turn the lights on when you're sober and lets see what she looks like. lets see if you're still willing to take the leap with her.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Dee4Three on Wed Aug 16, 2017 4:16 am

kingpnp wrote:
Dee4Three wrote:
[Q] wrote:
matmat66 wrote:Agree with you on this one Dee. You echoed my sentiments on Live 18 based on the demo. As of now, 2k is more fluid for me.

You guys are acting as if Live has had this long history of long, smooth animations... smoother than 2k


That has nothing to do with it. It's stating that it's one of the biggest (if not the biggest) reason people won't switch over. Just because it's a known issue, doesn't make it any less of an issue. If you are competing in the same market, the same genre, and calling yourself a simulation, you will and deserve to be critiqued on the gameplay issues/mode issues (or lack of modes).

Even with the modes they have and as they are, far more people would make the switch or at least buy both games if the gameplay was smooth and the animations weren't broken. For example, it's 2017 and we can't up fake and step in for a smooth jump shot without it looking and feeling completely wrong?.

If it's not working, fix it. I don't want to hear that in 2017 they can't get smooth transitions, especially with technology the way it is now.

Nobody is acting like it's a new thing, we are merely contesting the issues that we have had for YEARS with Live. Issues that stop the game from being good or elite. It's what stops it from making sales or competing.

For example, if someone is an asshole in 2012, and they are still an asshole in 2017, you won't want anything to do with that asshole in 2017. You will avoid that asshole, because that asshole is still well... that asshole. So you can say "you act like he hasn't always been an asshole" all you want. But you still won't associate with him or hangout with him. This is why we can't use that as an excuse. You can say "if he would just change, people would like him more", and you can try to talk to him and give him constructive critiscm, you can be patient with him, even sympathise with him. But if he doesn't adapt or change, and hes still an asshole... well... not many people will support him.


all true and well said. funny thing is, 2k is also an A-hole. Same ole server issues like 8 or 9 years in a row. there's zero excuse. you are no longer a small team/small company just trying to squeeze into the genre. and since you've been thee #1 and only game people purchase for the most part... we know how many copies you sell. we know how much money you make. You have no excuse for the bad servers in 2017. NON. You also have no excuse to keep pulling me into animation after animation while telling me every year "there are no 2 player canned animations... you can break out of these animations THIS YEAR." stop it. you're lying. Just admit you like to over produce your games outcomes in order to make it LOOK visually more appealing. This keeps sells up and keeps you ahead of the competition.

This is why I'm always looking for some other team to come along and make that basketball game I've been waiting for because 2k aint it, and as of today neither is live to be honest. both games have made progress. and both games have their moments when you think "wait this my be the one." Nope. she aint the one, you were excited because she looked cute in a dark club on a dark night when you were liquored up. Turn the lights on when you're sober and lets see what she looks like. lets see if you're still willing to take the leap with her.



I agree completely that 2k has its issues, which I stated above (And numerous times). Servers, forced animations, body steals/body blocks, pace issues, charging issues, etc. I don't sugarcoat anything, or form opinions based on bias. However, 2K has a better feel, it has for a very long time. And while they have issues, they introduce new teams/modes/features all the time. We have the ability to mod because they release a PC version, but even for consoles they have the ability to create courts/jerseys/insert files for myleague, they have the ability to edit/distribute/share rosters, they have the ability to use classic teams, etc. As I stated above, if Live had even basic roster editing/sharing, they would have quite a few more sales, if they had a multi-user dynasty experience, or even a legends pool or decade teams, basic things they used to have but took out, they would have more sales. If they can work on accurate/smooth celebrations (They happen WAY to often in the demo, I've seen Durants shoulder thing and Klay Thompsons celebration like 4 or 5 times in one 5 minute quarter), why cant we take a smooth shot? How can they get the dribbling sequence looking solid (Crossover/spin into a reverse layup), but not get a free throw animation look anything less than cringeworthy? The focus isn't completely on the right things, it hurts my brain that a developer/developers implemented that many celebrations, and thought it would be cool? The developers looked at the on the move (setting feet) shooting animations, and free throw animations, and were like "This is good" or "This is passable"? It looks like its unfinished, but the game is set to release in a month or so. For people on the outside looking in, people who feel how unnatural everything is (Look at how people are reacting to the demo overall, we can feel it as soon as we pick it up) it is mind boggling. Because it's so obvious to us.

Now, we are not programmers, I never said it was easy to fix these things, or program a game. I'm sure the work they put in (time as well) is insane. But it takes a basic feel and understanding of basketball to be able to tell if it will be a flop, or that you won't get people hyped or interested upon first touch. I appreciate that they release info early, that they release a demo (2K does not do that, bothers me sometimes), but if they continue to release an unfinished product, or a product that offers no reason to switch (or for many, to purchase at all) it doesn't matter how good that service aspect is. If I was working for EA Sports, and they said "Hey, try this game and let me know how it feels", I would have said it's not ready, it doesn't feel right. I'd also question why they are not listening to fans about basic features/modes that should be in the game. So you give us WNBA, but no roster editing? WNBA was a great idea, but we have been asking for roster editing for YEARS. There are a slew of reasons why Live continues to not make much progress (Or any progress at all) with the fan base.

It's not "You guys are just used to 2k", it's "2K gives us a much better/more complete overall experience". 2K has to address gameplay issues, FACT. But even this year they didn't stay stagnant, they are introducing 16 new classic teams, and 30 all time teams, as well as other new features. These were features requested by the consumers, and they listened. That's how you keep the sales up every year, not just being the only one, but being the only one to continue to add new content, to allow the public to make/edit/share rosters (It's 2017 and social media is at it's highest peak, and people can't even share rosters on Live?).

I will be critiquing 2K's gameplay the same way when NBA 2K18 is released, trust me. And, I will be taking a strong look at Live again when it's released. I played it for another 2 or 3 hours last night, as I continue to look at things that I think are good or need work. I hope EA is looking at these forums, because the conversation we are having is very helpful.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Andrew on Wed Aug 16, 2017 9:58 am

[Q] wrote:
matmat66 wrote:Agree with you on this one Dee. You echoed my sentiments on Live 18 based on the demo. As of now, 2k is more fluid for me.

You guys are acting as if Live has had this long history of long, smooth animations... smoother than 2k


The funny thing is, back in the PS2 era, I'd say that Live definitely had the better animations. The leap to 360/PS3 was definitely a turning point for the NBA Live series, and not in the direction we wanted it to go.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby StyxTx on Wed Aug 16, 2017 11:34 am

kingpnp wrote:
all true and well said. funny thing is, 2k is also an A-hole. Same ole server issues like 8 or 9 years in a row. there's zero excuse. you are no longer a small team/small company just trying to squeeze into the genre. and since you've been thee #1 and only game people purchase for the most part... we know how many copies you sell. we know how much money you make. You have no excuse for the bad servers in 2017. NON. You also have no excuse to keep pulling me into animation after animation while telling me every year "there are no 2 player canned animations... you can break out of these animations THIS YEAR." stop it. you're lying. Just admit you like to over produce your games outcomes in order to make it LOOK visually more appealing. This keeps sells up and keeps you ahead of the competition.

This is why I'm always looking for some other team to come along and make that basketball game I've been waiting for because 2k aint it, and as of today neither is live to be honest. both games have made progress. and both games have their moments when you think "wait this my be the one." Nope. she aint the one, you were excited because she looked cute in a dark club on a dark night when you were liquored up. Turn the lights on when you're sober and lets see what she looks like. lets see if you're still willing to take the leap with her.


I agree with you. As it looks right now, I won't be buying either game.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby kingpnp on Wed Aug 16, 2017 2:31 pm

Andrew wrote:
kingpnp wrote:Hey Livers,,, Did you guys get that Nba Live 18 Demo UPDATE Today 08/14/2017???

Does anyone know what's in the update?


No patch notes as yet. Checked the update history on PS4, and it was just the generic "minor bug fixes" note.

people were on another site and i think we at least figured out two possible fixes the update had. one was the face scan, which i have yet to do. I already knew it wasnt going to work out the box. never does.

and another was the speed of the game. i think it started off at 50. It now should say 70 as the default speed. a lot of people were complaining about the speed of the game being a bit slow and how it played much better at a faster speed. so they tweaked it.

I spoke with a dev on another site, well we were all just talking about the brick wall issue. and he agreed since he said they are playing a lot of games to catch stuff right now and they wanted to tune the brick wall screens as well. so that will be something that will be tweaked at some point among other things.

I gave him a suggestion to not only make it so that certain people do brick walls but make it so that certain teams do it more often than others(any team coached by Thibs does this. He had KG, Perkins killing people on those illegal screen when he was an Asst coach with boston.) This alone would make a player going up against a team like that on one game then playing a more finesse team the next would have a completely different realistic feel to it.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Andrew on Wed Aug 16, 2017 4:21 pm

Good to hear. The advantage of having an early demo, feedback for a Day 1 patch. Hopefully they can tune some animation speeds and make the passes crisper as well. It'll help the feel, and the aesthetics to some extent.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby matmat66 on Wed Aug 16, 2017 5:46 pm

[Q] wrote:
matmat66 wrote:Agree with you on this one Dee. You echoed my sentiments on Live 18 based on the demo. As of now, 2k is more fluid for me.

You guys are acting as if Live has had this long history of long, smooth animations... smoother than 2k


I have been playing EA basketball games since the Lakers vs. Celtics iteration in the Sega Genesis System. I bought every single basketball game that becomes available in the market from the versus series to NBA Showdown and then NBA Live. So from Sega Genesis to PS1, PS2, PS3 and PS4, I bought and played EA basketball games. I only started to buy the 2K series in the short lived Sega Dreamcast which I also enjoyed. I also bought other basketball games including NBA shootout, Tecmo NBA, NBA Inside Drive, to address "game fatigue". I just miss the days when you can play a newly released basketball game, including Live, and feel the "fluidity" for a lack of a better term. I know that there are issues with the new 2k games and that is why until now, I still go back to playing NBA 2k13 and NBA 2k14 especially with the UBR and URB mods. I really want EA and 2k to develop 2 great games since we will all be winners here. I am just a casual gamer now, a product of growing old I guess, and I mostly play just exhibition matches and just memorizing a few moves that will allow me to get by defenders. I hope that EA can give us a solid product and I hope Live returns to PC so that this community can do something to improve it.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Izzy Snow on Thu Aug 17, 2017 12:06 am

I'm having a lot of fun with the game even with the issues that I have with it which are mostly technical issues that may or may not be fixed...ever. Either way, I recorded the issues which were a passing glitch where the ball literally did a "Trinity from Matrix" and sat in the air for a couple seconds and a couple of vids where clipping is IMO bad enough to affect gameplay. Sorry I forgot how to properly post vids/links on here but here they are.

phpBB [video]


phpBB [video]


phpBB [video]
Last edited by Izzy Snow on Thu Aug 17, 2017 12:34 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Andrew on Thu Aug 17, 2017 12:17 am

Thanks for sharing. (Y)

Videos can be embedded using the VIDEO BBCode tag as follows:

Code: Select all
[video]https://youtu.be/TWrZHMea78o[/video]


When you click the reply button for the full posting options, there's a button for the code there as well. It doesn't show up on the quick reply form, though.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Izzy Snow on Thu Aug 17, 2017 12:36 am

Andrew wrote:Thanks for sharing. (Y)

Videos can be embedded using the VIDEO BBCode tag as follows:

Code: Select all
[video]https://youtu.be/TWrZHMea78o[/video]


When you click the reply button for the full posting options, there's a button for the code there as well. It doesn't show up on the quick reply form, though.


Thx Andrew. I'm such a noob. Anyway, as I mentioned in my comments in one of the vids, I still already preordered the game and I can get by and ignore the clipping issues. But that pass glitch though, that has to be fixed.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby kingpnp on Thu Aug 17, 2017 3:43 am

Andrew wrote:
[Q] wrote:
matmat66 wrote:Agree with you on this one Dee. You echoed my sentiments on Live 18 based on the demo. As of now, 2k is more fluid for me.

You guys are acting as if Live has had this long history of long, smooth animations... smoother than 2k


The funny thing is, back in the PS2 era, I'd say that Live definitely had the better animations. The leap to 360/PS3 was definitely a turning point for the NBA Live series, and not in the direction we wanted it to go.

this...^^^ live hasnt been right since the leap to 360 and ps3. I think they lost some of their team at that point. usually it takes a franchise 2 installments to get it right when the new console shows up. the first game is usually terrible. then the 2nd one shows off the new systems capabilities and graphics. the 3rd installment is where its usually very good. not so with life at that point. it just got worse and worse. sure they tried to implement some other things I did agree with. but the animations just got worse and worse. i could not understand how do you get worse at animations? I also had a theory that their mo-cap was a big lackluster as well. which would attribute to bad animations. either that or they were trying to conserve ram by eliminating some of the frames for each animations.

ex. Lets say it takes 10 frames to have a guy do a 2 hand power dunk off vert(straight up with no step).

It seemed as if live would only use 6 frames. you would see the guys knees bend, then he would rocket up up. that rocket portion had at least a good 3 or so missing frames of animation. then he would dunk the ball.

The dunks looked worse than they did on older consoles. how is that even possible?

Now this year its gotten a ton better.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby [Q] on Thu Aug 17, 2017 5:27 am

Loose ball animations need work. Seems like there's only one for catching the ball at waist level. They need one for picking the ball up off the ground or low catches and also high ones about head level.

Tipping point for me was when on a defensive rebound the other team ran away and we were about to get the rebound when it bounced off the ground as my teammate ran to it. He wasn't close enough to get it at waist level so it kept going, bounced off his head and out of bounds
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Dee4Three on Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:20 am

Someone said that they had talked to someone at EA who was working on a few things, did any of that have to do with animation complaints? The feel is the problem, it's a turn off from the get go for the majority of the video game playing population. It's a pick it up "This is trash", and put it down thing. If people try the game and instantly are turned off, it just won't be talked about well (Or bought).

I feel like if they can get smooth animations for dribble sequences, they should be able to do it for shooting, or moving into a shot.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby TBM on Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:34 am

I just jumped into this thread, but why does it always feel like some people feel the need to defend Live like it's their child? Competition is great, of course. I hope Live sticks around, but there seems to be a defend-at-all-cost mentality with a few people that I don't see with 2K17.

Anyway, I played the demo at a friends house (I don't have a console), and I really am not a fan of the overall feel of the gameplay. Graphically, the closeups look nice, aside from the sub-par faces. My only critique with the lighting is that the white jerseys and accessories are a bit too grey.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby kingpnp on Fri Aug 18, 2017 4:01 am

Dee4Three wrote:Someone said that they had talked to someone at EA who was working on a few things, did any of that have to do with animation complaints? The feel is the problem, it's a turn off from the get go for the majority of the video game playing population. It's a pick it up "This is trash", and put it down thing. If people try the game and instantly are turned off, it just won't be talked about well (Or bought).

I feel like if they can get smooth animations for dribble sequences, they should be able to do it for shooting, or moving into a shot.

people were talking about the brick wall situations that occur. the dev hopped in the thread and addressed it and said he and other devs are playing a lot of games around this time. and they already agreed on the brick wall issues that currently exist. so they will be working on tuning it . i told him about these clipping issues above and some others that you guys posted. Hopefully. They will clean those up pre release or at least a few weeks in. I specifically told them about that catch and shoot animation Dee4Three. I provided video evidence as well as examples of how real players shoot off the catch. and how there is some feet movement or a foot moving. but never or rarely this shuffle step thing they have everyone doing before they go up which creates a delay and funny looking animation hitch.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Dee4Three on Fri Aug 18, 2017 4:19 am

kingpnp wrote:
Dee4Three wrote:Someone said that they had talked to someone at EA who was working on a few things, did any of that have to do with animation complaints? The feel is the problem, it's a turn off from the get go for the majority of the video game playing population. It's a pick it up "This is trash", and put it down thing. If people try the game and instantly are turned off, it just won't be talked about well (Or bought).

I feel like if they can get smooth animations for dribble sequences, they should be able to do it for shooting, or moving into a shot.

people were talking about the brick wall situations that occur. the dev hopped in the thread and addressed it and said he and other devs are playing a lot of games around this time. and they already agreed on the brick wall issues that currently exist. so they will be working on tuning it . i told him about these clipping issues above and some others that you guys posted. Hopefully. They will clean those up pre release or at least a few weeks in. I specifically told them about that catch and shoot animation Dee4Three. I provided video evidence as well as examples of how real players shoot off the catch. and how there is some feet movement or a foot moving. but never or rarely this shuffle step thing they have everyone doing before they go up which creates a delay and funny looking animation hitch.


Awesome! Thanks for passing that info along.

I made a quick video last night with me speaking, just showing examples of the animation issues. It shows some good regular motion/slow motion replays of it. Maybe they can address it.

phpBB [video]


The takeaway here is: Its the first impression, and it can be felt instantly when you start playing. It's an instant turn-off. If they could smooth it out, it would catch on more. I really want Live to succeed, but these things should have been ironed out after 2 years (and 4th appearance with this system). We shouldn't have to tell developers that it doesn't feel right, that the feel hurts the game, they should know.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby bigh0rt on Fri Aug 18, 2017 4:36 am

tl;dr, but it looks like there's a lot of productive, respectful back and forth going on here, which is cool.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Izzy Snow on Fri Aug 18, 2017 6:10 am

kingpnp wrote:
Dee4Three wrote:Someone said that they had talked to someone at EA who was working on a few things, did any of that have to do with animation complaints? The feel is the problem, it's a turn off from the get go for the majority of the video game playing population. It's a pick it up "This is trash", and put it down thing. If people try the game and instantly are turned off, it just won't be talked about well (Or bought).

I feel like if they can get smooth animations for dribble sequences, they should be able to do it for shooting, or moving into a shot.

people were talking about the brick wall situations that occur. the dev hopped in the thread and addressed it and said he and other devs are playing a lot of games around this time. and they already agreed on the brick wall issues that currently exist. so they will be working on tuning it . i told him about these clipping issues above and some others that you guys posted. Hopefully. They will clean those up pre release or at least a few weeks in. I specifically told them about that catch and shoot animation Dee4Three. I provided video evidence as well as examples of how real players shoot off the catch. and how there is some feet movement or a foot moving. but never or rarely this shuffle step thing they have everyone doing before they go up which creates a delay and funny looking animation hitch.


Thx for passing the info along. I also tweeted it to Projectleet and EADougie hopefully they took the time to look at the 3 vids I posted.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby kingpnp on Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:10 am

Izzy Snow wrote:
kingpnp wrote:
Dee4Three wrote:Someone said that they had talked to someone at EA who was working on a few things, did any of that have to do with animation complaints? The feel is the problem, it's a turn off from the get go for the majority of the video game playing population. It's a pick it up "This is trash", and put it down thing. If people try the game and instantly are turned off, it just won't be talked about well (Or bought).

I feel like if they can get smooth animations for dribble sequences, they should be able to do it for shooting, or moving into a shot.

people were talking about the brick wall situations that occur. the dev hopped in the thread and addressed it and said he and other devs are playing a lot of games around this time. and they already agreed on the brick wall issues that currently exist. so they will be working on tuning it . i told him about these clipping issues above and some others that you guys posted. Hopefully. They will clean those up pre release or at least a few weeks in. I specifically told them about that catch and shoot animation Dee4Three. I provided video evidence as well as examples of how real players shoot off the catch. and how there is some feet movement or a foot moving. but never or rarely this shuffle step thing they have everyone doing before they go up which creates a delay and funny looking animation hitch.


Thx for passing the info along. I also tweeted it to Projectleet and EADougie hopefully they took the time to look at the 3 vids I posted.
some of the videos were the ones you posted. i put your user name from here out there as well to give due credit.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby kingpnp on Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:32 am

Dee4Three wrote:
kingpnp wrote:
Dee4Three wrote:Someone said that they had talked to someone at EA who was working on a few things, did any of that have to do with animation complaints? The feel is the problem, it's a turn off from the get go for the majority of the video game playing population. It's a pick it up "This is trash", and put it down thing. If people try the game and instantly are turned off, it just won't be talked about well (Or bought).

I feel like if they can get smooth animations for dribble sequences, they should be able to do it for shooting, or moving into a shot.

people were talking about the brick wall situations that occur. the dev hopped in the thread and addressed it and said he and other devs are playing a lot of games around this time. and they already agreed on the brick wall issues that currently exist. so they will be working on tuning it . i told him about these clipping issues above and some others that you guys posted. Hopefully. They will clean those up pre release or at least a few weeks in. I specifically told them about that catch and shoot animation Dee4Three. I provided video evidence as well as examples of how real players shoot off the catch. and how there is some feet movement or a foot moving. but never or rarely this shuffle step thing they have everyone doing before they go up which creates a delay and funny looking animation hitch.


Awesome! Thanks for passing that info along.

I made a quick video last night with me speaking, just showing examples of the animation issues. It shows some good regular motion/slow motion replays of it. Maybe they can address it.

phpBB [video]


The takeaway here is: Its the first impression, and it can be felt instantly when you start playing. It's an instant turn-off. If they could smooth it out, it would catch on more. I really want Live to succeed, but these things should have been ironed out after 2 years (and 4th appearance with this system). We shouldn't have to tell developers that it doesn't feel right, that the feel hurts the game, they should know.


the first time i watched your video i just watched everything and took it all in. and saw the issues or not. this time i listened to the audio(you talking.) which i agree with for the most part until that last portion when you start talking about nba 2k adding new features. no they are not. at least not that i have seen.

Giving people classic teams isnt work or effort. We do that on our own with roster editing. quiet as kept the peoples roster editing for the classic players are always better than what 2k produces. So truth is, thats not a feature. its just an added created player. nothing more, nothing less. sure i like to see them in the game. but that took little effort to put that forward. its a created player with an old jersey, some old shoes, and an old hairstyle.

What 2k use to do is add a ton of features because they had to in order to catchup and surpass live. Now they for the most part dont do that. what they are known for is taking current features away today. then adding them back in slowly 2 years later.

as much as we like my career. the only time they added real features to it was when they added the real storyline. most 2k fans dont even remember playing with your created player guy in the street ball tournament. thats what my career is about. what they did with that idea was allow you to see how you rank your guy up by allowing things to pop up at different moments. but its the same mode. most dont even know this. when they started putting a full on story to it. its when it became a brand new element. once they added in sponsors. that was a new element.

let me give you an example of taking things away then giving them back again.

They took away the prelude. then brought it back.

they took away Crew mode.for a few installments and then brought it back as PRO AM Ranked.

They even lied about having the ability to customize your court like it was new. Uhhh we were doing that with crew mode way back when.

There are other things I can't think of off the top at the moment. that they took away then put it back in later.

with that said. we know live basically stripped the game so they could or supposedly could focus on gameplay.

I think because they are not getting the sells that a AAA game with this name recognition should be getting. Live doesnt get the full roster of devs that other games probably get.

I would bet the madden teams, fifa teams are much larger than live teams. Yes i've heard they brought some guys in from the fifa team. thats great. and i can see some of that in the game. But for live to produce a high quality game without these obvious issues they are going to need either more years than normal to pull it off. or more people to help them pull it off. If they choose the less people but more years route. they will never catch 2k. because they will always be working with one arm tied behind their backs.

on the business side. we're lucky live is still being made or cared about from EA. thats just the honest truth. they are most likely losing money from the company or breaking even.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Dee4Three on Fri Aug 18, 2017 10:44 am

I understand your stance. But please understand mine. 16 new classic teams IS new content, people are already saying "oh mannn, I didn't pick up 17, but Ill have to pick up 18 so I can cop that Kings team". 16 new classic teams is no joke, and for 2K16 they added 8 new ones. 30 all time teams is no joke either, that's a lot of content for people to sink their teeth into, and they will. People were complaining about classic teams missing, or lack of classic teams, so 2K listened. Back in 2015, People complained about not being able to customize the MyLeague experience, so 2K added features where people can create a court, create jerseys, rebrand, move cities, etc. Those were new features.

By the way, adding new teams/courts etc, is a TON of work. It took me hundreds of hours to do those rosters, and I didn't even have to do the technical programming. Adding 46 teams is actually a lot....

I stand by what I said in the video, people buy 2K not only for the feel, but also for the features. Look, in 2K I can: Make/Edit/Share Rosters, I can play multi-user myleague locally, I can play multi-user myleague online, I can customize my myleague experience and even share that experience with others (Created courts, jerseys, etc). All of that can be done on PC OR on consoles. And while the gameplay had it's issues (which I've mentioned), it still had the smooth feel, to go along with all of those features. People asked 2K for more retro content, and they got it. People asked Live for roster editing, and they didn't get it.

That's my point. Listen, I cant defend Live anymore about certain things. 4 years and I can't shoot a smooth J, 4 years. Most people pick up the controller, and try it, and put it right back down, and call it trash. I didn't do that, I have been playing it and talking about some of the positives. But all the reasons I stated about why it's failing are true. It's not babysteps anymore after this long, they are literally on the 4th game for this gen, and have been out of the picture competitively for almost 8 years.

Madden 17 has roster editing, you can share rosters on Madden 17. No, it's not the best, but it exists. Madden 17 has multi-use dynasty, fantasy draft, etc. Guess what I own and play sometimes with my brothers? Madden 17 for X1. No roster editing in a sports game in 2017? That feel and those animations in a sports game in 2017? The game does not feel or play right.

What I do appreciate is that you are in communication with them, that you are watching all the feedback and passing it along. I love that people are making videos with demonstrations of the issues, and that you are also passing those along. Its really appreciated, we all want them to get better, we all want a good product. However, I still can't get my mind around the fact that the developers programmed those animations (which are an instant turn-off), felt good about them (Good enough to release a demo, and a game) and kept them. I would have rejected them immediately.
Last edited by Dee4Three on Fri Aug 18, 2017 11:11 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Andrew on Fri Aug 18, 2017 10:52 am

TBM wrote:I just jumped into this thread, but why does it always feel like some people feel the need to defend Live like it's their child? Competition is great, of course. I hope Live sticks around, but there seems to be a defend-at-all-cost mentality with a few people that I don't see with 2K17.


I'd say part of it is in response to the bash-at-all-cost mentality that some people have, which is often peppered with the same tired rhetoric and unproductive buzzwords, rather than detailed, nuanced, and intelligent critique. However, the discussion here has been pretty fair and measured so far, so that's a puzzling accusation to make in this topic.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby The X on Fri Aug 18, 2017 10:55 pm

I don't care for The One, more concerned with normal games.

Anybody got some preliminary slider sets to improve how game plays? I'm going to tinker to drop contested shot success.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby ThaLiveKing on Fri Aug 18, 2017 10:58 pm

While I understand there is robotic animations, I feel if they gave us more sliders, we would be able to clean them up. Here's some examples of animations after I tweaked the sliders.

Steph Curry pull back three
Image

Steph cross over, gets bumped
Image

Another pull back jumper
Image

Curry to Durant - Alley Oop
Image

My video from yesterday, with updated sliders

Steph on the move pull up
Image

FULL VIDEO
phpBB [video]
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Dee4Three on Fri Aug 18, 2017 11:50 pm

ThaLiveKing wrote:While I understand there is robotic animations, I feel if they gave us more sliders, we would be able to clean them up. Here's some examples of animations after I tweaked the sliders.

Steph Curry pull back three
[ Image ]

Steph cross over, gets bumped
[ Image ]

Another pull back jumper
[ Image ]

Curry to Durant - Alley Oop
[ Image ]

My video from yesterday, with updated sliders

Steph on the move pull up
[ Image ]

FULL VIDEO
phpBB [video]


A couple things:

The two step backs look exactly the same, and I can tell they feel exactly the same. Look how choppy it is, that's the turn off. I messed with the game speed and difficulty levels, nothing can change those animations. However, lets say you are right and something in the sliders could change the animation issues (If they added more sliders)

99% of the players who play the demo won't even touch the sliders (The average player), they will feel the game the way it is out of the box, and MAYBE only change game speed, but the average player won't even do that. They will pick it up, call it trash, and move on (And not buy).

99% of the people who try this game at a store (Best Buy, Gamestop, Wal-Mart, etc), will not touch the sliders, and maybe a few will touch the game speed. They will call it trash, set it down, and not buy.

Those are facts, and everybody here knows it. It's the feel I am talking about. Those Steph Curry step backs look like something out of PS2, they literally have no flow or feel to them. He looks like his back is cracking a couple times as he tries to get through his animations. This is NOT me being negative, this is me being honest and wanting the game to get better. It's not just that 2K is "So big now", or people "Only know one thing". People are picking up the demo, they are watching on youtube, they will play in stores, they may even buy pre-owned. But the bottom line is, that first impression, that feel, to go along with skimpy modes/lack of basic modes and features, is what holds Live back from making any ground.
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Re: Demo Impressions Thread

Postby Izzy Snow on Sat Aug 19, 2017 12:08 am

ThaLiveKing wrote:While I understand there is robotic animations, I feel if they gave us more sliders, we would be able to clean them up. Here's some examples of animations after I tweaked the sliders.

Steph Curry pull back three
[ Image ]

Steph cross over, gets bumped
[ Image ]

Another pull back jumper
[ Image ]

Curry to Durant - Alley Oop
[ Image ]

My video from yesterday, with updated sliders

Steph on the move pull up
[ Image ]

FULL VIDEO
phpBB [video]


That Curry to Durant oop was clean yo!
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