Fallout 76

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Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Thu May 31, 2018 12:29 am

It's a thing.

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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Lean on Thu May 31, 2018 12:49 am

Hoping it's not an online game, not a battle royale game, not a settlement-building game, and not a microtransaction-ridden game.

Reading some insightful comments on Fallout's Facebook page, some say that Vault 76 was mentioned in Fallout 3 as a control vault that's designed to open 20 years after the end of the nuclear war.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Thu May 31, 2018 1:05 am

I too hope that it's a spin-off game along the lines of New Vegas, rather than any of the approaches you mentioned. If it is a regular game, a la New Vegas, I think that'd be interesting; going back in the timeline, since most of the canonical games have kept moving things forward.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby sticky-fingers on Thu May 31, 2018 3:21 am

New Vegas is an Obsidian game.
Fallout 3 and 4 are Bethesda.
This one is also a Bethesda game so :roll:
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby bowdown on Thu May 31, 2018 4:48 am

I like that song a lot.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Lean on Thu May 31, 2018 5:36 am

Eh, it's reportedly an online game. I still hope it's not.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Kenny on Thu May 31, 2018 9:37 am

I've always liked the idea of Fallout being co-op, but not MMO. MMO would create an overpopulated wasteland, which would take away from the overall feel of the game, whereas a co-op would make it feel like you and your friend/s against the world (similar to Dark Souls).
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby jenz on Thu May 31, 2018 9:51 am

How would an online survival game (never played one) differ from the normal campaign of the previous Fallout games?
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Kenny on Thu May 31, 2018 9:57 am

Changes the entire dynamic of the game. In New Vegas, you made decisions about who ran the Strip and Hoover Dam. When you have an MMO world, it has to account for every decision because people will make different decisions. So the world itself can't really be shaped by your actions and has to be everything to everyone.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Kevin on Thu May 31, 2018 10:43 am

I'm sorry if this is off-topic but which Fallout game would you recommend to someone who really isn't a fan of the franchise just yet?
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Thu May 31, 2018 11:11 am

Reports of the genre shift are dampening my enthusiasm, I must admit.

Kevin wrote:I'm sorry if this is off-topic but which Fallout game would you recommend to someone who really isn't a fan of the franchise just yet?


I'd say either 3 or New Vegas.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby jenz on Thu May 31, 2018 2:24 pm

Kenny wrote:Changes the entire dynamic of the game. In New Vegas, you made decisions about who ran the Strip and Hoover Dam. When you have an MMO world, it has to account for every decision because people will make different decisions. So the world itself can't really be shaped by your actions and has to be everything to everyone.


Huh, that's quite disappointing if they do go that direction. He're hoping for classic single player campaign.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby [Q] on Thu May 31, 2018 2:56 pm

Kevin wrote:I'm sorry if this is off-topic but which Fallout game would you recommend to someone who really isn't a fan of the franchise just yet?

I played New Vegas and I thought it was a really fun and interesting concept, especially since I've been to Real Vegas tons of times in my life.

Not sure how an "online" version would work. Would it be like an MMORPG?
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Thu May 31, 2018 4:27 pm

I imagine they'd have to eliminate, or heavily modify, the VATS system. That's not going to be remotely fair or feasible online.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby sticky-fingers on Thu May 31, 2018 8:41 pm

Kevin wrote:I'm sorry if this is off-topic but which Fallout game would you recommend to someone who really isn't a fan of the franchise just yet?


Fallout, Fallout 2 and New Vegas.
The other games are Bethesda : Fallout"s universe without Fallout's soul.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby bowdown on Thu May 31, 2018 10:25 pm

Kevin wrote:I'm sorry if this is off-topic but which Fallout game would you recommend to someone who really isn't a fan of the franchise just yet?

New Vegas for in depth story, characters and quests. Fallout 4 for gunplay/combat and a nicer wasteland to explore.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Thu May 31, 2018 10:43 pm

Fallout 3 gets a bad rap. Too much Bethesda hate.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby sticky-fingers on Fri Jun 01, 2018 2:37 am

Fallout 3 was a solid game, but not a real Fallout, too sweetened.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Fri Jun 01, 2018 5:15 am

Agree to disagree there.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Dee4Three on Fri Jun 01, 2018 5:23 am

Andrew wrote:Fallout 3 gets a bad rap. Too much Bethesda hate.


Can someone explain the Bethesda hate?

I've enjoyed Skyrim, and ESO, as well as Fallout 4. ESO is actually underrated in my opinion, the amount of content is insane. Not only that, the entire game can be played with a friend (All content outside of the main mission). It also is harder than most new MMORPG's, Blade & Soul, Black Desert Online, etc are a cakewalk.

Just not sure where all the hate comes from.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Lamrock on Fri Jun 01, 2018 6:29 am

I enjoyed Fallout 3, and to a lesser extent Fallout 4 and Skyrim, but I see where the Bethesda hate comes from. While Fallout 3 somewhat captures the aesthetic and takes place in the same narrative universe as previous Fallout titles, it retains almost none of the gameplay mechanics. The first two Fallout games were cult classics so most people don't care but OG fans dislike Bethesda's direction because instead of making a deep RPG loaded with player choice and reasons to replay the game, they made a Fallout-themed Oblivion.

Bethesda games tend to be chock full of content and appealing to the masses, but are generally riddled with bugs, have shallow gameplay and tell nonsensical stories. While they do what they do well, their direction towards always appealing to the lowest common denominator have led to games that I've found easy to like but hard to love..

New Vegas is my personal favorite because it captures the best of both worlds, offering both the open-world perspective and accessible gameplay of Fallout 3, while bringing back many of the RPG elements present in the first two games. It's not as focused as Fallout 3 or as deep as the first two games, but I would love to see Obsidian get another shot to make a Fallout spin-off.

I would honestly recommend Fallout 4 as a starting point. Though it's not my favorite Fallout game, it's the newest, has the best combat, and isn't nearly as dated. If you all in love with the concept, like I did with Fallout 3, then I'd recommend playing 3 and New Vegas. Fallout 1 and 2 are also wonderful games, but they are completely different, and you probably won't like them unless you have the patience for a 90's isometric turn-based RPG.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Fri Jun 01, 2018 6:35 am

It comes down to the fact that Bethesda aren't the originators of the franchise. That means the changes they've made are seen as an affront to the original games, or at the very least, not a true continuation of the lore. The change in genre from a more traditional RPG with turn-based combat to an action RPG with shooter elements ("Elder Scrolls with guns" is a common criticism, though people have also used the phrase more positively) was a big deal, certainly at first. A few changes to the lore, and moving the setting of the series to the East coast, also rubbed people the wrong way.

Conversely, some of the key people at Obsidian who worked on New Vegas used to work at Black Isle and have a history with the series. As such, even though FNV basically played the same as FO3 in large part (albeit with a few new mechanics), it was better received because it was a more familiar setting, and made by the "right people".

Bethesda has made some choices that are questionable, or at least not going to be popular with everyone, but it fits within the established lore and canon better than is often suggested. I think some of the changes were necessary in order to avoid being repetitive, and the move to the East coast also helps to avoid a few contradictions and flat out retcons. That's not to say there aren't some issues with plot holes and certain premises, but as I said, I think they get a bad rap. It's inevitable when you have a passionate fanbase with specific ideas about how the games, stories, and lore should be, not to mention a lot of nostalgia for the original classics.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby [Q] on Fri Jun 01, 2018 6:36 am

Hmm I might give fallout 1 or 2 a look because I like 90s isometric turn based RPG games. There's one called Jagged Alliance that is still one of my favorite games
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Dee4Three on Fri Jun 01, 2018 7:04 am

Lamrock wrote:Bethesda games tend to be chock full of content and appealing to the masses, but are generally riddled with bugs, have shallow gameplay and tell nonsensical stories. While they do what they do well, their direction towards always appealing to the lowest common denominator have led to games that I've found easy to like but hard to love..


I think If I could change one thing in ESO, it would be the battle mechanics. While the world/enemies are more than acceptable graphically for an MMO, I think that the combat could have been a bit more involved. That's not to say that battles don't take strategy, as many take quite a bit of strategy, and when playing with a friend your typical tanking/kiting techniques are absolutely necessary. The level of detail in the worlds are pretty awesome at times. The typical mundane, blah missions (outside of the main missions) exist, which is kind of the norm now.

So if the hate is derived from almost a "sell-out" POV, like just trying to appeal to the masses in turn making the game kind of lack of originality, I guess I could see that.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Fri Jun 01, 2018 12:18 pm

There are definitely legitimate criticisms, but there's a lot of dislike and putting Bethesda's games down on principle, too. This post from the Fallout Reddit sums up the issues with the "not real Fallout games" stance quite well, in my opinion:

FFF12321 wrote:Games and franchises should be free to change. Is FF7 less of a Final Fantasy game because it didn't have a job system and had ATB instead of turnbased combat like the first few games? Or because it was a mix of sci go and fantasy that wasn't present in the earlier games?

Fallout is no different. FO3 and onwards were FPS instead of isometric turn based games. FONV basically scrapped karma in favor of faction reputation. FO4 added base building and dropped skills but way vamped the perk system and tried some different things with how it handled dialog. You may not like the changes, and that's fair, but FO4 is still a Fallout game. If you want to go play in older systems, then go for it. The rest of us that still enjoy the franchise will continue to play the new games and take them for what they are instead of expecting the same game with a new skin on it.


Reflecting upon it, I believe that was one of my main problems with Fallout 4. It made some changes from 3 and NV, some good, some bad, but the point is that there were changes, which didn't gel with what I was hoping for if I'm to be completely honest: basically those games again, only with better graphics and a new story. Again, that doesn't mean all the changes were necessarily good, and as that post says, there's nothing wrong with preferring things about older games. We can definitely relate to that here in the basketball gaming community. At the same time, it's easy to be stubborn about the way things should be, which is ironic since when developers do basically give us the same thing with a new skin, we complain about laziness and a lack of innovation.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Lean on Fri Jun 01, 2018 4:24 pm

Fallout 1 and 2 are games that were very good during their time. I've played Fallout 2 (wasn't able to finish it and was stuck in front of Vault City) and while it does fall upon the "boring" category nowadays because of the slow-paced turn-based combat, I still loved the story and the lore around it. I feel like Bethesda is trying their best to capture the feel of the older games, but resented to their usual first-person RPG style of play because well that's what they have. And I believe that if they resort back to the isometric turn-based combat, casual gamers might turn it down. Fallout Tactics, however, gives you the option to switch off the turn-based combat.

I like Fallout 3 and 4. I haven't got the chance to play New Vegas but I did purchase it on Steam last month. What I like about 3 is how desolate everything was, but I didn't like how you can only end up with the Brotherhood of Steel. I also like Fallout 4 (mostly the side quests and the Far Harbor DLC), but I hate how most of the DLC's focused more on settlement and contraptions rather than new story-based content.

To each their own, I suppose. But if you ask me if I could go back and play Fallout 1 and 2, I might give them a pass.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby shadowgrin on Fri Jun 01, 2018 7:21 pm

[Q] wrote:Jagged Alliance that is still one of my favorite games

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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Sat Jun 02, 2018 1:03 am

Lean wrote:Fallout 1 and 2 are games that are very good during their time. I've played Fallout 2 (wasn't able to finish it and was stuck in front of Vault City) and while it does fall upon the "boring" category nowadays because of the slow-paced turn-based combat, I still loved the story and the lore around it. I feel like Bethesda is trying their best to capture the feel of the older games, but resented to their usual first-person RPG style of play because well that's what they have. And I believe that if they resort back to the isometric turn-based combat, casual gamers might turn it down. Fallout Tactics, however, gives you the option to switch off the turn-based combat.

I like Fallout 3 and 4. I haven't got the chance to play New Vegas but I did purchase it on Steam last month. What I like about 3 is how desolate everything was, but I didn't like how you can only end up with the Brotherhood of Steel. I also like Fallout 4 (mostly the side quests and the Far Harbor DLC), but I hate how most of the DLC's focused more on settlement and contraptions rather than new story-based content.

To each their own, I suppose. But if you ask me if I could go back and play Fallout 1 and 2, I might give them a pass.


Agreed, well put.

Fallout 3's story, at least as a premise and in terms of most of the beats, was fine. One of the main problems, as you noted, is that there's no real way to turn heel and side with the Enclave, despite there being some logical points in the story where it would definitely be feasible. You can infect Project Purity, and you can destroy the Citadel at the end of Broken Steel, but you can never truly ally with the Enclave. I guess you either become the hero of the Brotherhood of Steel, or you screw everyone over by the end. So yeah, there is an evil path - sort of - but it's basically the same as the good path, rather than its own branching arc.

Then of course there are the plot holes, many of which were resolved by Broken Steel (notably the ability to send rad resistant companions into the chamber instead, though you still get branded a coward instead of a pragmatist). I'm not saying the story is perfectly written, but I thought it played out pretty well in broad strokes. You can give the Capital Wasteland hope for the future, but you still lose your father, and some of the side quests don't have totally happy endings either. Tenpenny Tower is one such example, as is the entire Pitt DLC. There are issues, but it's still great overall in my book.

Fallout 4 leaned a little too heavily on the settlement building for my liking, especially since they made it part of a few quests. I've enjoyed it to some extent, especially now that I've finished the main quest, but I'm always leery of those mechanics. GTA: San Andreas and GTA: Vice City Stories with their turf wars and empire building respectively are other examples. They should be completely optional, but they get woven in to the story and are therefore unavoidable. Apart from that though, I thought the story was OK. Some interesting twists with Father and the decision of who to side with was an improvement over 3, though perhaps not as good as New Vegas. It is better than New Vegas in that there's post-ending gameplay, though.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby [Q] on Sat Jun 02, 2018 1:31 am

shadowgrin wrote:
[Q] wrote:Jagged Alliance that is still one of my favorite games

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No clue how many times I've played Jagged Alliance 2, but I wouldn't be surprised if it were around 1000 lol
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Dee4Three on Sat Jun 02, 2018 2:31 am

FFF12321 wrote:
Games and franchises should be free to change. Is FF7 less of a Final Fantasy game because it didn't have a job system and had ATB instead of turnbased combat like the first few games? Or because it was a mix of sci go and fantasy that wasn't present in the earlier games?

Fallout is no different. FO3 and onwards were FPS instead of isometric turn based games. FONV basically scrapped karma in favor of faction reputation. FO4 added base building and dropped skills but way vamped the perk system and tried some different things with how it handled dialog. You may not like the changes, and that's fair, but FO4 is still a Fallout game. If you want to go play in older systems, then go for it. The rest of us that still enjoy the franchise will continue to play the new games and take them for what they are instead of expecting the same game with a new skin on it.


FF7 and FF8 are the two best games in the series, in my opinion. Final Fantasy 15 is dull and boring, and the cheesiest game in the series. Going the route of real-time battling as opposed to turn based or ATB sounded intriguing, but it wasn't well executed at all. The story is dead, the atmosphere is dead, the characters are forgettable, they went away from everything that made the series great. Final Fantasy 14 online is a cakewalk, it's a really easy game. Long gone are the difficulties of games like FF11 online, which was very challenging. I feel like a lot of these companies are dumbing down games, making them easier, which is why we have so many easy RPG's out there.

I've played New Vegas and Fallout 4, and yes... Fallout 4 does feel a bit more commercial. A bit more... "pretty" as opposed to "Immersive". That's how I feel about the Final Fantasy franchise as well, overall. I feel like they have gone the route of good looks, and lost the immersion along the way. It's also how I feel about 2K18 and the route 2K is going in general. It used to be about gameplay, authenticity on the floor, it used to be about basketball. Now it's about VC, the attempt to look great, while disregarding what made the franchise great to begin with... the gameplay.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby el badman on Sat Jun 02, 2018 6:55 am

I never played the original Fallout games, but I spent countless hours on 3, NV and 4, as well as Bethesda's TES games, so I would consider myself a big fan of their work in general, in spite of the obvious and major flaws that each of those games came with. Nothing is quite as addictive as their solo campaigns, that's why I'm very disappointed if it does turn out that this is in fact an online survival game. I don't play any MMO or any other type of online game, and I really wish they hadn't followed the trend on this (if it turns out to be true of course), although I suppose it was a just a matter of time before they give in to that.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Sat Jun 02, 2018 12:17 pm

el badman wrote:I never played the original Fallout games, but I spent countless hours on 3, NV and 4, as well as Bethesda's TES games, so I would consider myself a big fan of their work in general, in spite of the obvious and major flaws that each of those games came with. Nothing is quite as addictive as their solo campaigns, that's why I'm very disappointed if it does turn out that this is in fact an online survival game. I don't play any MMO or any other type of online game, and I really wish they hadn't followed the trend on this (if it turns out to be true of course), although I suppose it was a just a matter of time before they give in to that.


Definitely. As long as they don't abandon the main series, then I guess it's fair enough that they explore other ideas for games set within the Fallout universe. However, it's safe to say a majority of us wanted another solo campaign. I have friends who'd be up for playing it with me online if that's what it turns out to be, so I might still give it a try. It's definitely not what I was hoping for though, if that's what it is.

I guess it's still subject to confirmation at this point as I've read the alleged leaks and rebuttals to the alleged leaks, so we'll see at E3.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Mon Jun 11, 2018 12:36 pm

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Fallout 76 is the first multiplayer game set in the Fallout universe

Bethesda Softworks’ Fallout 76 is the first multiplayer game to be set in the Fallout Universe. Bethesda’s Todd Howard confirmed during Bethesda’s BE3 event that “Fallout 76 is entirely online.”

Fallout 76 is set in West Virginia, and includes locations pulled from actual sites throughout the state. Bethesda says that the playable area is four times larger than Fallout 4. The game serves as a prequel to every game in the series, taking place 20 years after the devastating nuclear engagement that turned the United States into an irradiated wasteland.


Apparently it will be possible to play it solo, but...I don't know. I'll need to wait for more details, but that's not the game I wanted.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby JaoSming on Mon Jun 11, 2018 1:44 pm

Definitely watch the conference in regards to F76, I feel like they got everything needed out there to get an idea of the game.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Lean on Mon Jun 11, 2018 1:47 pm

Yeah, I'm not sold after watching the presentation. There's an option to play solo, but who's to say that a random asshole gets to troll you by nuking whatever it is that you built while you're offline, right?

I hope that when you do play it solo, you play it like any normal Bethesda RPG.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Mon Jun 11, 2018 1:57 pm

That's what I'm hearing. Solo play is possible, but it's still all online. It's a cool concept in theory, but online gaming can be pretty toxic, and it's not the Fallout experience.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Lean on Mon Jun 11, 2018 2:09 pm

I'm probably won't get it, or wait if any of you guys do and give it a thumbs up. But admittedly, the announcement of Fallout 76 makes me want to replay Fallout 4 or give New Vegas a shot.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Mon Jun 11, 2018 2:16 pm

I've been playing Fallout 4 lately and enjoying it. It has its problems, but I've warmed up to it after giving it a few chances. I can always go back to Fallout 3 and Fallout: New Vegas, though.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Kenny on Mon Jun 11, 2018 3:49 pm

It would be pretty cool if you could have your own private map to explore and invite your friends to (like Minecraft, minus the procedurally-generated aspect). That would be the Fallout 76 I'd be hoping for. I could deal with waiting longer for Fallout 5 if it were like that.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby bowdown on Mon Jun 11, 2018 5:33 pm

They should do people a favor and tag the game appropriately as they plan to sell it like RPG, MMORPG, etc. We can get a better understanding for what to expect that way instead of wasting time speculating but I am sure they want people to talk about the game.

Edit: Around the 3:15 mark it looks like some gameplay footage of Fallout 76.

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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:20 pm

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I'm leaning towards skipping it, but it is worth noting that this is a spin-off game and experimental concept. It's not the overall direction for every Fallout game from here on out.

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All the same, as someone who would've loved to have this generation's New Vegas, and normally has a keen interest in any Fallout game that's coming out, it's a disappointment. I won't rule out trying it, but it may just not be for me.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Lean on Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:28 pm

Oh, this is an automatic pass. Although I've always wanted to just be a merchant in RPG games. Or a farmer. Or a scavenger. Just someone who doesn't want to be part of the grander scheme of things. :lol:

Looks like I'll just re-install Fallout 4, or continue my re-play of Witcher 1.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:31 pm

I definitely hear you on that. I am leaning in that direction, and it's only the mere fact that it's Fallout and a few of my friends might be interested in playing with me that's keeping me interested enough to at least find out a bit more about it. No Day 1 pre-orders as with Fallout 4, though.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby el badman on Thu Jun 14, 2018 8:18 am

Likewise, I'm sure plenty of folks will be happy about this new direction (the younger generations?), but it looks like there's a large chunk of the Fallout fanbase who feels let down and concerned about what's next, just like I do. It was certainly expected that it would come to that some point, so it's no shocker by any means, but I for one enjoy my lone wanderer experience when it comes to Fallout games, and I see absolutely no point in playing with others, even if the majority will most likely not be the kind of trolls who will undoubtedly ruin it for everyone by being trigger-happy with their nukes...
Luckily the other Bethesda E3 announcements were much more positive as far as I'm concerned.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby bowdown on Thu Jun 14, 2018 8:36 am

Its something unique. I think its good we get a different way of playing in the Fallout world. The game may end up being good or bad but atleast they are making things interesting and I like it. Im sure Fallout 5 will be released too in the future. It hasn't even been 3 years since F4.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Thu Jun 14, 2018 12:19 pm

Todd Howard has stressed that they're being mindful of griefing and are trying to work out how the risk/reward factor of an optional PvP system will work. Apparently gamers won't easily lose everything, either. All the same, it's not what a lot of long-time fans of the series wanted, though it's worth noting that Interplay were looking to make an online Fallout way back in the day as well. I don't think we've seen the end of the single player Fallout, we're just going to have to wait a little longer for the next sequel or New Vegas-esque canonical side game. It's just a disappointment because I'd say most of us wanted Fallout 76 to be just that.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Lean on Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:12 pm

They could've called it "Fallout Online" and I'm fine with not giving a crap about it from the get-go. With the backlash it's receiving, they could at least give Fallout 76 a real single-player mode.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Thu Jun 14, 2018 11:24 pm

That's perhaps the worst part. If it was teased as Fallout Online from the beginning, people could've seen it, been disappointed, and moved on (to some extent). The ambiguity of the title left hope for a more familiar experience.

It is what it is, though I wonder if the backlash might lead to any changes.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Lean on Fri Jun 15, 2018 3:17 am

Andrew wrote:The ambiguity of the title left hope for a more familiar experience.


Indeed it did. Calling it straight-out as "Fallout Online" would cause backlash early way before it's announced on E3.
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Re: Fallout 76

Postby Andrew on Fri Jun 15, 2018 11:14 am

In that respect it was smart on Bethesda's part, though it only delayed the inevitable.
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