2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

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What's gonna happen?

Cavs in 4
3
18%
Cavs in 5
1
6%
Cavs in 6
5
29%
Cavs in 7
1
6%
Pacers in 4
0
No votes
Pacers in 5
1
6%
Pacers in 6
1
6%
Pacers in 7
2
12%
Mike Pence attends game 3, immediately gets up and leaves
1
6%
Kendrick Perkins: "We've got a [expletive] squad now"
2
12%
 
Total votes : 17

Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby cavs4872 on Sun Apr 22, 2018 5:06 am

dwayne2005 wrote:There we go, another playoff loss and another round of blame Isaiah for everything:

"The season was crippled before it began by the forced trade of Kyrie Irving and by the misfit who was acquired for him, Isaiah Thomas."

But I thought the midseason trade was suppose to have rectified everything that was wrong with the team? According to the likes of Charles Barkley, they were now destined to become finals contenders with the fixes they made, not face a possible defeat in the first round?

imo, even the pre-deadline team could've been moderately successful had it not been for Lue's horrendous lineups; Crowder is even less of a PF than Love is a C.

I still believe a lineup of IT-Wade-Bron-Love-TT wouldn't have been bad; whatever you lost with Kyrie you make up for with IT and Wade.

As for the current team, Love on the floor with Hill, JR, Bron and Korver is redundant not only offense (5 perimeter guys), but even worse on defense; the struggle to get a defensive rebound is real.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby NovU on Sun Apr 22, 2018 6:57 am

cavs4872 wrote:I still believe a lineup of IT-Wade-Bron-Love-TT wouldn't have been bad; whatever you lost with Kyrie you make up for with IT and Wade.

I think that would have been just horrible. Post trade Isaiah/Wade have been just as expected, trash. TT is dearly being missed though.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby [Q] on Sun Apr 22, 2018 9:44 am

Well anyone with half a brain can't blame IT as it was Kyrie that forced a trade and the Cavs took what they could get
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby cavs4872 on Sun Apr 22, 2018 11:24 am

[Q] wrote:Well anyone with half a brain can't blame IT as it was Kyrie that forced a trade and the Cavs took what they could get

I believe if they traded the Brooklyn pick for DeAndre it would've been overpaying for essentially a playoff rental, but if they could've gotten a player like that we would all be singing a different tune, so there's that aspect of the trade that has yet to manifest itself.

It's a good debate: DeAndre makes them a legitimate title contender in my book, so is it worth trading a pick who could be a potential bust and is 99.99% not bringing a title to Cleveland unless he's playing alongside LeBron James for a player who gives you an actual shot at a title this season?

I think so; heck, look at Anthony Bennett.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby dwayne2005 on Mon Apr 23, 2018 5:25 am

NovU wrote:
cavs4872 wrote:I still believe a lineup of IT-Wade-Bron-Love-TT wouldn't have been bad; whatever you lost with Kyrie you make up for with IT and Wade.

I think that would have been just horrible. Post trade Isaiah/Wade have been just as expected, trash. TT is dearly being missed though.


At one point Isaiah had risen to a 59% true shooting rating (I believe 42-37-90 shooting percentages), 3% below 2016-17, and just 1% below Julius Randle for the most efficient scoring on the Lakers based on season percentages (during the stretch he played, several players were much better than their season averages). Then Isaiah's game sunk, and he pulled out to get surgery. Possibly the decline marks the point when his hip started playing up again, but for a time he was dramatically better than he was in Cleveland at least in shooting. He was also getting a good number of assists and a fair assist to turnover ratio during that stretch, and his DFG% was low (as it was in Cleveland). After the decline, it became more of a turnover to assist ratio. But he definitely showed signs that he could have been a decent player again.

I thought Dwyane Wade played reasonably well by numbers during the IT stretch. There was a stretch of about 15 games where he posted Cavs version IT like shooting numbers when he was playing alongside Tristan Thompson when IT was not playing. During the IT run, I felt offensively and defensively he should've been in the starting line up (it seems he and Wade developed a friendship in Cleveland so the chemsitry might have worked as well). Since he was traded to the Heat, he had a horrific TS% of 46%. Even in Cleveland, IT's TS% was 2.5% higher at 49%.

During the IT stretch when Cleveland were 7-8, there were 5 other games Isaiah didn't play in. I believe 3 games prior to IT joining the team and 2 additional games when he was not permitted to play back to back games out of concern for his health status. In those 5 games, Cleveland went 0-5! Cleveland were going through a bad patch with or without Isaiah Thomas. Repeatedly, the media in Cleveland cited the full stretch of games as incriminating of Isaiah, including the 0-5 he didn't actually partake in. During the first 5 of those games, I noticed LeBron James also had really bad games by his standard but the media gave him a pass and singled out Isaiah Thomas for the deficits. In the subsequent 10 games, LeBron picked up his game but Thomas didn't.

Actually, pre-trade both Dwyane Wade and Isaiah Thomas were the two lowest players on the Cavs during the 15 game stretch in terms of defensive field goal percentage, despite the media insisting time and again (including that idiot Colin Cowherd, who made up a proven fabricated storyline in a Lakers game against Portland in his indictment of Isaiah) that Thomas' assignment was having their way with him offensively. According to Cowherd, the other teams coach was telling them to just give it off to Isaiah's assignments. Unfortunately, while not true for the season as a whole, it ended on a bad note in that regard by Rajon Rondo; the same twit who repeatedly hit him and elbowed him in the face in an earlier game (that somehow earnt Thomas an ejection) because Paul Pierce felt slighted and insulted over a video tribute planned for Thomas. But on the whole, it wasn't true. If anything was true, then Isaiah was weak in his lateral defense allowing assignments to run around him. For most of the season up until that Rajon Rondo game, his opponents had similar shooting percentage to his (40-41%). They would have been shooting a lower FT% than Isaiah on the average on fewer free throws, so the TS% might have been equal or worse than Thomas'. Thomas was repeatedly blamed for all of their defensive woes when it was more often than not players at other positions who were doing the scoring.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby NovU on Mon Apr 23, 2018 12:56 pm

Current version of Isaiah and Wade are trash no matter how you put it. They might have had bit of value for the Cavs' series against the Pacers as they're shot creators but they just aren't a game changer anymore or at this stage of their career.

Isaiah was fucked by the Celtics and Ainge. This is why Leonard Kawhi and many other players in the league don't give a fuck about what team docs say anymore. Isaiah because of loyalty played through injury when he had to opt for the surgery and rest. Post Isaiah has been trash, glimpse of his former self wasn't gonna save the Cavs, it is a wishful thinking to claim so.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby NovU on Mon Apr 23, 2018 1:08 pm

Sloppy fourth quarter by both teams. Scores are close but I think other series of this round are offering more entertaining basketball tbh.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby shadowgrin on Mon Apr 23, 2018 1:17 pm

tbf to Ainge he did fire all the Celtics trainers and medical staff from last season because of the way IT got fucked up with the misdiagnosis.
On the other hand you could say Ainge was simply trying to absolve himself by firing the staff.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby [Q] on Mon Apr 23, 2018 1:22 pm

Pacers were in it but choked it away with some terrible offensive posessions
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Andrew on Mon Apr 23, 2018 3:16 pm

I'm inclined to agree with Charles Barkley that the Pacers needed to win that one in order to win the series. Not that it isn't still doable, but that was a golden opportunity for them.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby dwayne2005 on Tue Apr 24, 2018 3:08 am

When Love was playing exactly like this during the Isaiah stint (got 10 shots), Isaiah was being blamed for stealing all the shots. Are they blaming others taking away the shots from Love now? Or is this only a thing they do when Isaiah is on the team?

This guy pulls out of games for 'panic attacks' and then when he hides it from his team mates and they start asking questions the blame gets put on ... Isaiah Thomas (despite Dwyane Wade now being credited as the instigator of the locker room turmoil). I get my share of panic attacks, I understand them. I would be a wreck out there on the court. But I'd know more would be (rightfully) expected of me if I was earning over 20 million a year.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby cavs4872 on Tue Apr 24, 2018 8:20 am

phpBB [video]


I can't believe after all these years LeBron is giving Lance the time of day (he's just DeShawn 2.0), but he probably realizes it was meant to be.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Andrew on Tue Apr 24, 2018 11:09 am

Stephenson is an irritant out there, and he's certainly got a history with LeBron.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby shadowgrin on Tue Apr 24, 2018 11:24 am

dwayne2005 wrote:This guy pulls out of games for 'panic attacks' and then when he hides it from his team mates and they start asking questions the blame gets put on ... Isaiah Thomas (despite Dwyane Wade now being credited as the instigator of the locker room turmoil). I get my share of panic attacks, I understand them. I would be a wreck out there on the court. But I'd know more would be (rightfully) expected of me if I was earning over 20 million a year.


Even if you have the same mental condition your experiences and environment are different from Love, just because you understand the feeling of having a panic attack doesn't mean his situation is always the same as yours.
Yours has to be one of the most retarded reasoning I have seen and I have seen plenty. It's mostly made retarded by mentioning the salary like it's relevant.
You think he's gonna be able to think straight and remember about his salary in the middle of his panic attacks and just instantly flip a switch to turn it off so he could perform as expected of his pay grade?
He did and still is getting professional help for his condition after he got his first panic attack in his life and subsequent occurences of it this season, he knows a lot is expected of him as a highly paid pro athlete that's why he got professional help instead of continuing to deny his condition or ignoring it through other means like alcohol and drug use. He hid it at first because of the stigma attached to a mental condition like his and yours.

Targeting Love's mental condition just to criticize the way Thomas was treated in Cleveland is just plain stupid.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby air gordon on Wed Apr 25, 2018 2:07 am

lol well said
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Dee4Three on Wed Apr 25, 2018 2:39 am

shadowgrin wrote:
dwayne2005 wrote:This guy pulls out of games for 'panic attacks' and then when he hides it from his team mates and they start asking questions the blame gets put on ... Isaiah Thomas (despite Dwyane Wade now being credited as the instigator of the locker room turmoil). I get my share of panic attacks, I understand them. I would be a wreck out there on the court. But I'd know more would be (rightfully) expected of me if I was earning over 20 million a year.


Even if you have the same mental condition your experiences and environment are different from Love, just because you understand the feeling of having a panic attack doesn't mean his situation is always the same as yours.
Yours has to be one of the most retarded reasoning I have seen and I have seen plenty. It's mostly made retarded by mentioning the salary like it's relevant.
You think he's gonna be able to think straight and remember about his salary in the middle of his panic attacks and just instantly flip a switch to turn it off so he could perform as expected of his pay grade?
He did and still is getting professional help for his condition after he got his first panic attack in his life and subsequent occurences of it this season, he knows a lot is expected of him as a highly paid pro athlete that's why he got professional help instead of continuing to deny his condition or ignoring it through other means like alcohol and drug use. He hid it at first because of the stigma attached to a mental condition like his and yours.

Targeting Love's mental condition just to criticize the way Thomas was treated in Cleveland is just plain stupid.


He never said that he would be able to get out of a panic attack because of how much he made, he said that he would understand that more would be expected of him if he made 20 million a year. And, his statement is absolutely correct, more would be expected of him if he made $20 million a year. You even say that he knows more is expected of him in the next sentence. The money he makes is relevant due to the fact that he has a stage now to impact more people with his story, it was brave to come out and admit that. Also, it matters in the scope of perception.

Mentioning IT makes some sense, as it was portrayed that he was the one who lashed out at Love after his randomly leaving a game (Due to a panic attack). IT was labeled as the aggressor by the media. It turns out that it was more Wade, but some of the damage had already been done. No, I don't think the Kevin Love situation had anything to do with the short stint for IT in Cleveland, but I do believe the media played a role in making the villain out of IT, and the Love case is another example of that. IT would have had that short stint in CLE anyway, but Dwayne2005 seems to be mostly frustrated with the way IT has been portrayed by the media this season. That is his main concern.

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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby [Q] on Wed Apr 25, 2018 4:32 am

Andrew wrote:I'm inclined to agree with Charles Barkley that the Pacers needed to win that one in order to win the series. Not that it isn't still doable, but that was a golden opportunity for them.

When Cleveland is on, they are ON especially with LeBron leading them. Can't give em any momentum or else they could make a run and beat you in the series. Pacers definitely needed that win to help close em out but now it'll be a dogfight for them to win the series now
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Andrew on Thu Apr 26, 2018 11:49 am

LeBron with a blatant goaltend on the game-saving block. Terrible. I mean, he came up with the big shot after that, and his three would've beaten Oladipo's two, but shame on the referees.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby NovU on Thu Apr 26, 2018 2:19 pm

Lol @ LBJ being ultra hyped up after that game winner. He didnt look that excited when he first won the championship. This is 5th game of 1st round you know.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Andrew on Thu Apr 26, 2018 2:27 pm

Well, according to social media it solidified him as the GOAT, so I guess he had reason to celebrate.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Dee4Three on Thu Apr 26, 2018 2:33 pm

Andrew wrote:Well, according to social media it solidified him as the GOAT, so I guess he had reason to celebrate.


Lol
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby air gordon on Thu Apr 26, 2018 10:21 pm

lebron james. the best most underrated and most scrutinized player ever

an outstanding game by him, even by his standards, and here you guys talk about social media and post game celebrations
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Dee4Three on Thu Apr 26, 2018 10:55 pm

air gordon wrote:lebron james. the best most underrated and most scrutinized player ever

an outstanding game by him, even by his standards, and here you guys talk about social media and post game celebrations


Andrew isn't wrong, about the goaltend or social media.

And, a lot of people also believe he's the most overrated player ever. So that is certainly debatable.

Clutch last second shot by James, the refs botched his goaltend before it, but also botched the out of bounds call on LeBron the play before. With that being said, classic LeBron plowing on that play, to go along with classic LeBron plowing throughout the night, to the tune of 15 MADE free throws in the game.

Indiana was up by 7, and then the free throw clinic started in the 3rd quarter, seemingly every time you looked at the TV CLE was at the line. Suddenly, CLE was up by 10.

I agree with some out there who say that the NBA has the worst refs in sports (NFL can't be that far behind). Between the Bucks vs Celtics series where they admit on social media that calls were missed (game deciders) in the final 5 minute frames, to this series, to the constant travels they allow by Harden and the like who pick up the dribble and jump backwards for shots, it's truly embarrassing how bad the officiating can be. Sometimes you have to wonder the amount of truth to Tim Donaghys words.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby NovU on Thu Apr 26, 2018 11:37 pm

Gordon, there's no denying he is the Michael Jordan of his era.

44-10-8 performance feels totally ordinary and nobody talks about such amazing performance anymore, lol.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Dee4Three on Fri Apr 27, 2018 1:03 am

I do want to point out one thing.

I actually hate the goaltending rule (If the ball hits the glass first, its a goaltend). I think its BS, because who knows if the ball would make it above the cylinder? For example, who knows if that Oladipo layup would have had a chance to go in? Even so, why are defenders getting penalized for blocking these shots?

Never liked the rule. In my opinion, blocking off the glass should absolutely be allowed, even if the ball hit's it first, as long as the ball is not above the cylinder. I think that's what is kind of lost in this whole thing. Yes, under the current rules, LeBron goaltended the shot and it should have been 2 points to IND, but if the rules were the way they should be, that would be a good defensive play.

I think LeBron gets away with murder during games, but I am also a realist. I think the block and the three were good plays, but I think his drive on Thad (and many throughout the game) were offensive fouls, complete trash, as he continues to just use his off arm (extended) to push the defender out of his way while he drives. Andrew isn't wrong about the goaltend, neither is Oladipo, but I wish that rule would change.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby dwayne2005 on Fri Apr 27, 2018 3:37 am

Even if you have the same mental condition your experiences and environment are different from Love, just because you understand the feeling of having a panic attack doesn't mean his situation is always the same as yours.
Yours has to be one of the most retarded reasoning I have seen and I have seen plenty. It's mostly made retarded by mentioning the salary like it's relevant.
You think he's gonna be able to think straight and remember about his salary in the middle of his panic attacks and just instantly flip a switch to turn it off so he could perform as expected of his pay grade?
He did and still is getting professional help for his condition after he got his first panic attack in his life and subsequent occurences of it this season, he knows a lot is expected of him as a highly paid pro athlete that's why he got professional help instead of continuing to deny his condition or ignoring it through other means like alcohol and drug use. He hid it at first because of the stigma attached to a mental condition like his and yours.

Targeting Love's mental condition just to criticize the way Thomas was treated in Cleveland is just plain stupid.


What I was saying was that Thomas was being blamed for Love's play during that stretch, and then he was blamed for the lockeroom turmoil. It wasn't just Dwyane Wade who was the force behind it, but in what I read it seemed to indicate Love had a chance to pacify his team mates and explain why he withdrew from the game but didn't. I imagine a situation where Wade may have called him up and asked where he was, and Love said "none of your business" or something to that effect. For example. And this all fell on Isaiah Thomas. He now has a reputation for being a destructive to locker rooms. Even during his stint in LA, it was a frequent response to topics: don't keep him, he is poison to the lockeroom. Many idiot journalists still cite it: his inability to play alongside others. It is being used as one of the justifications to not renewing his contract, or getting him signed elsewhere.

I wasn't using it to target the way Isaiah was being treated. I was saying this was probably the reason why he was only getting 10 shots in a game back then, not Isaiah stealing his shots for which he was blamed. Love lost his drive when Isaiah surfaced on the team, and it was part of the reason why the team were doing so poorly, but it all once again fell on Isaiah Thomas. 10 shots again in the latest game, it is clear his ailment is an issue. That's why I was bringing it up. It is not Isaiah who was responsible after all.

I ended with a side point that people (rightfully) expect more out of a 20 million dollar athlete. This side point has nothing at all to do with Isaiah Thomas. If he is working through it, it certainly doesn't show. If anything was 'retarded', it is your comprehension of the intent of my post.

Oh, and another thing: takes a special kind of hypocrisy to use a derogatory word of a intellectually handicapped person to criticise someone for their perceived reasoning: using a mental handicap as an excuse for whatever the hell your reasoning was. I'm sure all those intellectually handicapped people who are not earning 20 million a year appreciate you likening them to me!
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby air gordon on Fri Apr 27, 2018 3:39 am

NovU wrote:Gordon, there's no denying he is the Michael Jordan of his era.

44-10-8 performance feels totally ordinary and nobody talks about such amazing performance anymore, lol.

really remarkable. took 2 shots outside the lane i think the whole game, made all his free throws yet some are going to criticize it
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby [Q] on Fri Apr 27, 2018 4:51 am

Indiana could have had this series but they let LeBron and the Cavs have too much momentum. I don't think there's anything they can do to stop them now that they've got a rhythm going
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Andrew on Fri Apr 27, 2018 10:36 am

There's an outside chance of at least forcing a Game 7 since Game 6 is in Indiana, but they've completely lost momentum, so I'm inclined to think they're done. As much as any pivotal Game 5 will be looked upon as the deciding factor, I still think Barkley had it right. They needed to win Game 4 and go up 3-1 to have a realistic chance of winning the series, and they let a golden opportunity slip away there.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Lamrock on Fri Apr 27, 2018 7:18 pm

The Pacers have played consistently well this series. If Oladipo can pull his head out of his ass, they might be able to take game 6. I'd be stunned if LeBron lost a game 7 in the first round, but Indy still has a chance.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Andrew on Sat Apr 28, 2018 12:29 pm

Big win for the Pacers to force Game 7, but a tough, tough task ahead of them.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Lamrock on Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:43 pm

I think LeBron is about to go Game 6 Celtics on them (again?) but Indiana has been the better team through six games. Game seven is going to be epic.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby NovU on Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:19 pm

Well... You are trying to win games heavily relying on shit players like Calderon, JR Smith, Jeff Green, Clarkson, Hood, and aging Korver.

Young LBJ probably could put up a good fight but it seems his legs are gotten old little too soon. Also wtf happened to Kevin Love? He can't even seem to rebound well now which makes his presence obsolete.

I don't know which LBJ will show up in game 7, young or old. But I know for sure I wouldn't be surprised of any result now.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Lamrock on Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:38 pm

Kevin Love has been playing through an injury and took a couple hits to the head. He continues to be inconsistent in the playoffs though, and with him instead of Irving as the second option, it's been dicey.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Andrew on Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:41 pm

Love re-injured his hand, so that might have something to do with it.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby [Q] on Sun Apr 29, 2018 8:25 am

Looked like Love got a concussion from that got to the head
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby SoF'nAwesome on Mon Apr 30, 2018 4:28 am

LeBron James playing that Game 7 basketball. Tristan Thompson the unexpected boost that Cavs desperately needed. These fans were booing him a couple of weeks ago now they are worshiping him :lol:
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby shadowgrin on Mon Apr 30, 2018 5:02 am

Khloe forgave him already, must be that for playing well rn.
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Re: 2018 PLAYOFFS: (4) Cleveland vs. (5) Indiana

Postby Murat on Mon Apr 30, 2018 5:55 am

So Cavs advance to the 2nd round. Tristan Thompson changed the direction of series.
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