Chicago Bulls Thread

[Andrew]

In theory they could, if they were willing to take on Hedo Turkoglu's contract as well it would work under the salary cap. Whether the Magic would be interested in that deal is another matter entirely though and I'd suggest that it's highly unlikely they would be. There's also the issue of Howard's impending free agency; he's indicated that he's not that interested in playing for the Bulls so I'd be leery of making any deal that doesn't include Howard agreeing to an extension.

So in short, a deal would be possible but given the circumstances I'd say it's not at all likely.

[benji]

Yeah, that's a real great plan, trade one of your most important players (along with picks probably) for a guy who doesn't want to play for your team while you go a season without your star.

Amnestying Boozer this offseason doesn't make any sense. What do you gain from doing it? It doesn't put the Bulls under the cap. And unless they intend on tanking next year they need his usage.

If Gibson's better then just bring Boozer off the bench as a scoring punch.

The Bulls don't have team options on those players, instead if Watson and Brewer aren't waived before free agency starts then their contracts become guaranteed. Korver's contract simply isn't guaranteed.

Dumping two of those guys and Boozer, along with no Rose means the team would be without half of the rotation of the best team in the league this year and a two-time 60 win team next season. You're basically rebooting the team back to 2010 and starting over. With only the MLE to use to add players, which you would have without dumping those players. (Bonus points if they use the MLE on Hinrich.)

[NovU]

Buyers' remorse from 2010 free agency market winners. The talk of a Boozer amnesty and the talk of Amare amnesty in New York. And Joe Johnson isn't an exception either. All teams got the same result this season too, first round exit. And the things are looking even worse going forward.

As for Howard, why wouldn't he want to play for the Bulls. Well established team that lacks another superstar. When Rose comes back healthy, they will form a formidable duo. Everything indicates that the Bulls are a great fit for Howard. If I was Howard, I'd at least give it a thought rather than only insisting on going to Dallas or Brooklyn.

[RedPhazon8]

As for Howard, why wouldn't he want to play for the Bulls. Well established team that lacks another superstar. When Rose comes back healthy, they will form a formidable duo. Everything indicates that the Bulls are a great fit for Howard. If I was Howard, I'd at least give it a thought rather than only insisting on going to Dallas or Brooklyn.

Also with the fact he fits well into Thibs' system, a strong defensive presence at the rim, which would also include Gibson and Asik (if they stay). I'm also thinking he won't have to worry about calling for the ball, the Bulls work inside out and they'd have him touch it first.

[Andrew]

Buyers' remorse from 2010 free agency market winners.

That's pretty much it, a case of being disappointed and wanting to see the back of him. When you get down to it, there is admittedly no tangible benefit to amnestying Boozer in terms of cap space or the like. As I said, it's disappointing how that's turned out so far. It's not like these issues are a total surprise, but you naturally hope for the best case scenario when your favourite team makes a big signing like that.

As far as Howard not wanting to come to the Bulls, my impression is that it comes down to him wanting to be somewhere where it's "his" team. Understandable I suppose, though it's not like he'd be too far down on the pecking order in Chicago.

[benji]

the talk of Amare amnesty in New York.

They already used their amnesty on Billups.

[air gordon]

Yeah, that's a real great plan, trade one of your most important players (along with picks probably) for a guy who doesn't want to play for your team while you go a season without your star.

Amnestying Boozer this offseason doesn't make any sense. What do you gain from doing it? It doesn't put the Bulls under the cap. And unless they intend on tanking next year they need his usage.

If Gibson's better then just bring Boozer off the bench as a scoring punch.

The Bulls don't have team options on those players, instead if Watson and Brewer aren't waived before free agency starts then their contracts become guaranteed. Korver's contract simply isn't guaranteed.

Dumping two of those guys and Boozer, along with no Rose means the team would be without half of the rotation of the best team in the league this year and a two-time 60 win team next season. You're basically rebooting the team back to 2010 and starting over. With only the MLE to use to add players, which you would have without dumping those players. (Bonus points if they use the MLE on Hinrich.)

The point of dumping boozer is to be free of him. Admit he was a mistake and move on. There would be no mandatory pt for him to drive his trade value up. No need to include draft picks or decent players in a trade to make it happen. Start Gibson and see if he's truly worth giving a starting pf salary. And give butler at least 20minutes a game.

Next season will probably be a wash. Even a proud gm like Paxson knows it. The united center will still be sold out without Rose. Nothing wrong with tanking like the spurs did and then regrouping for a title run the following season

[benji]

But why not keep him and bring him off the bench for scoring if Gibson is better? Why gift him to Miami or whoever else picks him up on cheap?

This team is a contender now, isn't it safer to hope Rose is on the eight month time table and they can make a run twice more rather than being the eighth seed for two years hoping they somehow get another shot at being a contender? (Which they probably won't be able to with the Noah-Deng-Rose core.)

[air gordon]

I'd pay for the shipping on boozer. Let him be a "stretch" 4 on another good team

Its unlikely boozer would accept a role off the bench/losing his spot to a 2nd round draft pick. Boozer Is already notorious for being unable to snap out of slumps. I can't imagine how much he will sulk on he bench

If the bulls somehow stay above water until deng and rose return- sure im on board with "trying". Just know the bulls organization is going to approach the Rose rehab with baby gloves. Similar to jordan's foot injury. Shoot- Paxson assaulted del negro when del negro was playing Noah over his minute limit.

As long the UC is filled there wont be any pressure coming down from Reinsdorf to win next year

[RedPhazon8]

I guess we're good to go for next season...

[air gordon]

um ok..

so any other bulls (edit: and NON) fans here have any thoughts on what the bulls should do in the offseason??

resign Asik and some of/all of the bench mob?
amnesty boozer this or next year?
make a drastic move like trade Deng for cap space/ok player?
trade for Howard even though he doesn't want to be here?

[shadowgrin]

Trade Ben Gordon and Luol Deng for Pau Gasol. Oh wait...

[Andrew]

I don't think there's going to be any can't-miss deals involving stars on the table and I don't think it would be wise to trade for Howard unless he signs an extension; it's not worth giving up key pieces to watch him leave in 2013. With that in mind, I'm in favour of keeping the current group together to try and hang tough until Rose is back.

[air gordon]

Trade Ben Gordon and Luol Deng for Pau Gasol. Oh wait...

lol there's already one vagina on the team. we don't need another one, especially a stinky one

I don't think there's going to be any can't-miss deals involving stars on the table and I don't think it would be wise to trade for Howard unless he signs an extension; it's not worth giving up key pieces to watch him leave in 2013. With that in mind, I'm in favour of keeping the current group together to try and hang tough until Rose is back.

bringing everybody back would certainly put the bulls in the luxury tax territory. Reinsdorf won't do it. Some players are going to have to go

[NovU]

so any other bulls (edit: and NON) fans here have any thoughts on what the bulls should do in the offseason??

Since you asked, I will shoot it straight out though a lot of people may not agree with me.

The Bulls are built perfectly for the regular season, and this notion widely has been ignored/regarded as a mere hate by the most Bulls fans. Yes, it's also true the Bulls weren't healthy and that limited their success in the post season. But to be honest, the notion carries the truth to certain degrees imo. When you look at the Bulls rotation, there isn't really a bad player that gets the minutes. All above average(or near) and productive on the floor. Your strength obviously has been the depth last 2 seasons, not just Rose, and not just a few stars. But the problem is the playoffs because the depth in the playoffs is minimized. The stars are better rested/prepared, the schedule is more relaxing, and stars get more minutes/space to work with. Not that the Bulls aren't a serious contender, but the way your team is built, it might not be a bad idea to let go of few ok players to chase after some of the big names out there.

As for the short term move, I actually thought Boozer was ok this season otherwise for the playoffs. It's obviously going to be troublesome trying to trade him. I'd rather keep him for the season, and wait for Rose to come back healthy to see what happens. Besides, instead of Boozer, how about Deng as a trade chip? He's much more attractive piece than Boozer to many teams out there. I don't really think he's a definite keeper for the Bulls.

[RedPhazon8]

The only thing I dislike about throwing Deng into a trade is the fact that he actually showed promise before he messed up his wrist. The first few games at the start of the season he was attacking and finishing really well, but when he messed up his wrist he stopped doing what made him perform well at the start of the season.

[rise]

They need to watch and wait and see whether Rose gets healthy. Make moves in 2013. Instead, just make small adjustments, like getting a decent scoring guard next to Rose that isn't injured as often as Rip.

[air gordon]

The Bulls are built perfectly for the regular season, and this notion widely has been ignored/regarded as a mere hate by the most Bulls fans. Yes, it's also true the Bulls weren't healthy and that limited their success in the post season. But to be honest, the notion carries the truth to certain degrees imo. When you look at the Bulls rotation, there isn't really a bad player that gets the minutes. All above average(or near) and productive on the floor. Your strength obviously has been the depth last 2 seasons, not just Rose, and not just a few stars. But the problem is the playoffs because the depth in the playoffs is minimized. The stars are better rested/prepared, the schedule is more relaxing, and stars get more minutes/space to work with. Not that the Bulls aren't a serious contender, but the way your team is built, it might not be a bad idea to let go of few ok players to chase after some of the big names out there.

to some degree it is true. the bulls mealticket is their defense and rebounding. but even in the playoffs where the rotations are shortened- Asik and Gibson are still defensive juggernauts. If some team like the heat wants to give haslem 40 minutes in a given playoff game- the bulls are going to wear them down.

their problem is their lack of secondary scorer. I don't think Paxson/Forman is delusional to this. Deng for all the good things he does, he cannot create shots for himself. Boozer has regressed to a jump shooting PF. That's $28million comitted next year to players who can't score for themselves.

finding this coveted #2 scoring punch has been Paxson and now Forman's failure. They thought they had it in 'Boozer (bleh). Now with big contracts committed to Deng, Boozer, Noah, and Rose their moves are limited. Hamilton was a safe stopgap move @SG but he couldn't stay healthy.

And now Asik is up for an extension and Gibson the following year.

As mentioned earlier- the bulls can't bring everyone back without going over the luxury tax. IMO the core is Rose and Noah. I think Deng, Asik, Gibson, and Butler are decent pieces but are all tradeable along with the rest of the roster.

Korver and Brewer shouldn't come back because they make too much for being specialists. Butler will replace Brewere at 1/4 the cost. Should the bulls keep their pick- the sharp shooting Jenkins makes a lot of sense to replace Korver.

Watson i think is coming back. he had a huge brain fart passing it to Asik in waning seconds of game 6 but i think for what he will make and his ability to play some SG as well, he's working keeping around.

use MME/MLE on Kirk hinrich as the stopgap guard

I'm on board with with getting rid of boozer. amnestying Boozer isn't a "reinsdorf" like move but i thnk it needs to be done. none of the contenders have the cap to go after him but a shitty team like Charlotte could put a bid in the neighborhood of $5-9mil. if he stays then you can almost guarantee asik/gibson will NOT be on the team. and management has an affinity for falling in love with guys they drafted. i suppose the bulls can try to explore trading boozer but is there a realistic scenario where they don't get back a crappy contract?

If they won't amnesty boozer then try trading deng for a legit scoring option like Rudy Gay or trading him for cap space. next year is a wash. regroup the following year.

[Andrew]

their problem is their lack of secondary scorer. I don't think Paxson/Forman is delusional to this. Deng for all the good things he does, he cannot create shots for himself. Boozer has regressed to a jump shooting PF. That's $28million comitted next year to players who can't score for themselves.

finding this coveted #2 scoring punch has been Paxson and now Forman's failure. They thought they had it in 'Boozer (bleh). Now with big contracts committed to Deng, Boozer, Noah, and Rose their moves are limited. Hamilton was a safe stopgap move @SG but he couldn't stay healthy.

Absolutely.

As much as I like Deng and the good things that he can do when he's healthy, I agree that he's certainly tradeable. You definitely do not pass up a deal for that coveted second scorer that if it takes moving him to get it done. However, I have a feeling that with his wrist injury, impending surgery and his contract, he might be close to being the other kind of untradeable.

I'd be on board with something like Deng for Rudy Gay, but do you reckon they could move him in a deal like that? Again, I'd pull the trigger on that kind of deal, but I'm not sure about their chances of actually having an opportunity like that.

[NovU]

Do you guys think Taj is the future for the Bulls at PF position? How is his potential?

I am not too keen on Asik. He's a big that provides depth but not a starter material of a contending team.

[Andrew]

Barring them pulling off a blockbuster for someone better at the four spot or Boozer experiencing a revival, he seems like he's the power forward of the immediate future for the Bulls. I like Gibson, he's solid at both ends of the floor. He was an old rookie though, at least a couple of years older than most of his draft class. Given the opportunity, he could establish himself as a good starting power forward. I'd say that's about the limit of his potential, which is fine so long as someone else is going to be that dependable second scorer.

I'd like them to find a way to keep Gibson, though like Deng if there's a can't-miss offer with a star on the table, they'd have to pull the trigger. I'm not sure who that would be though...I don't think a package of Deng and Gibson is going to pry a quality second option away from anyone. I think the Bulls have to be open to trade scenarios involving those players, but no feasible and appealing scenarios spring immediately to mind. I like AG's suggestion of Rudy Gay, but I don't think the Grizzlies would go for it.

[air gordon]

If asik can get stronger and improve his conditioning- he can Potentially be a starter on a contending team given the right situation. Yeah you are asking a bulls fans but how many other centers can protect the paint and also be defend the pick as roll and make defensive rotations out to the perimeter??

I would try to sell high on both Gibson and asik but that's something management seldom does.
S
Memphis hasn't been friendly to the bulls. A gay trade is unlikely.

[RedPhazon8]

If he can learn to make free throws, I think we're good to go...

[Andrew]

Asik has some good tools. I'm not sure about him starting for a contender but he can at least be a very solid and serviceable backup on one. Again, someone I wouldn't mind seeing the Bulls keep if the price was right and they could make it happen, but there should be no qualms about including him in a deal for a more valuable player.

[air gordon]

what is the right price for him??